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Yeah, I agree, its easy to get "talked out" on the subject of KH. It happened once before with my "best practices" thread in the scientific section. So, you're right, would be hard probably even to get people to comment, much less come to much consensus.

What perked up my attention was just that your observations certainly mirrored mine. I spent a pretty long time doing morning and evening KH stats on my tank all through my second fishless cycle period and for a while into having fish, and still do measure periodically. Of course it was the periods of recording lots of measurements that was more valuable. I could get a real feel for how long it was going to take for KH to start dropping, then how quick the drop would be and then for how the pH drop would come following along behind that, it was very interesting.

There really do seem to be some "categories" that the dKH scale could be divided into, but one would need to be clear that the categories could only apply to say, a fishless cycle, or a separate set might apply to a lightly stocked tank and yet a different one to a heavily stocked tank.

So, for example, I might venture that for a fishless cycle:
0-3dKH - Category 1 - This range of KH (Carbonate hardness) respresents buffering so low that the fishless cycle may easily crash from subsequent low pH.
4dKH - Inflection Point - Things could go either way. This KH value could mean pH might crash or might not.
5-9dKH - Category 2 - Much less frequent or no pH crash during fishless cycling.
10+ dKH - Category 3 - Very unlikely pH would crash during a fishless cycle.

This I guess assumes softer water is usually found in conjuction with water of lower pH to begin with, and harder water usually with higher pH, but I don't really know how independent KH and pH are from each other for real instances of tap water in most communities, sigh!

~~waterdrop~~
 
Well good afternoon to all again for the latest update!!!

I believe this is now DAY 4 after the reset that was advised by WD

I tested the water this afternoon at 13:15 PM and got the following:

PH 8.5-8.0 :rolleyes:
Ammonia 0.0 :rolleyes:
Nitrite 0.3-0.8 :rolleyes:
Nitrate 20 :rolleyes:
dKH Off the scale > 16 :rolleyes:

As the Nitrites and Nitrates had not gone off the scale I left the water and added the ammonia 2.5ml that is at that time!! I hope I assumed correctly!! Sorry guys I didnt test the water when I got back in from work it was a busy night and I finished 2 hours late!! So 5 AM was bed time for me!!

Cheers

Hope this helps!!

I have been reading the other forum chats and i have noticed that it is recommended to have a higher temp mine is currently set at 26C though my thermometer to go in the tank has not arrived yet to check. Should I raise it or leave it?

Also according to the online shop my filter media for my Aquaball should be here soon, how would I go about swapping my stingray for the Aquaball? I am thinking about either putting the filter media from the stingray in the aquaball or the other way round for a few week thus leaving me with an aquaball hopefully only later on? Would you guys suggest anything different?
 
Yes, I would bring the temp on up to 29C/84F and as long as all the media you've been cycling stays in one filter or another, it shouldn't matter which filter it is in as long as you can make things fit such that water can't cheat and get through without being filtered.

All the rest sounds ok to me,

~~waterdrop~~
 
Well good afternoon to all again for the latest update!!!

I believe this is now DAY 5 after the reset that was advised by WD

I tested the water this afternoon at 13:25 PM and got the following:

PH 8.5-8.0
Ammonia 0.0
Nitrite 0.8+
Nitrate 20+
dKH Off the scale > 16

As the Nitrites and Nitrates had not gone off the scale again I left the water and added the ammonia 2.5ml that is at that time!!

Off to work now so will try and get the smaples done tomorrow but at court! I will try!

Cheers
 
Looking good so far. Would never have guessed looking at the figures that you were only 5 days following a restart :good:

Court, tut tut, who's been naughty :p Might explain the up and comming holiday :shifty: :lol:
 
Well good morning to all again for the latest update!!! I have certainly NOT been naughty!! I am a Police Officer and someone else was VERY naughty!! Silly Girl!!

Well it is now DAY 6 after the reset!

I tested the water for Ammonia last night when I got in at 22:30 hrs and it showed the level to read 0.0 :good: . I also tested Nitrite as I was curious and it read 1.6 :good: .

I tested the water this morning at 08:00 AM and got the following:

PH 8.5-8.0 :good:
Ammonia 0.0 :good:
Nitrite 0.8 :good:
Nitrate 50-110 :unsure:
dKH Off the scale > 16 :good:

As the Nitrites have not gone off the scale again I left the water and added the ammonia 2.5ml this morning. I am not sure whether I should do a change of water to get the Nitrates down again? Dont really have time this morning but maybe later if someone could advise? Or can this wait till tomorrow?

Thanks for all the help!
 
Its curious how your nitrate(NO3) reading will suddenly jump up like that. From way over here, listening to you, it sounds like a scale-reading kind of thing, where perhaps a test color has just continued to get a little darking but you have finally judged it to be in the next category, which happens to have the big 50-110 value marking. Does it seem this way to you?

The reason for the interest is that I usually think of the decision whether to water change or not during a fishless cycle as a bit of a balancing act. There is some concern that excessively high nitrates(NO3) will slow the development of the N-Bacs, but on the other hand I always feel there is a little bit of advantage to those stretches when the fishless cycling tank can go along undisturbed. I feel there is a bit of a slowdown, just a small bit, from the "disruption" of a water change (hastening to add that water changes, done for the right reasons during fishless cycling, can be extremely important of course.)

In your case I suspect nitrate has not really shot up so much as that category reading makes it feel and that you are fine going along a bit without a water change. Also, the whole "reset" bit should make us suspicious that you could still be in first phase, waiting for ammonia to drop better, in which case water changes are not as good.

~~waterdrop~~
 
Thanks for that WD I think I will leave it till tomorrow to do a water change as long as the levels are increasing however if they remain the same I will refrain for now!!

I think it is me really reading the charts sometimes the colour just seems to be in the middle darker than one and lighter than the other!! So that is why I put the in between levels! I will check the level of ammonia and nitrite in a few hours to check if they have fallen to see where i am upto, by all accounts I believe that I am in the second stage and I am now trying to grow some N-Bacs to eat the Nitrite, which I can only assume I have some of as there are Nitrates in the tank!

Again WD and Rabbut thanks for all the advice!! :good:

I know its a little confusing about what day I am upto but I think it is just that I was in to a fishless cycle for some weeks and taking your advice has put me on track!

When I do get to the end of the cycle and do a large water change do you clean the filter or leave it for a month with fish in and then clean it as such?

I have some FLORA BOOST from INTERPET to feed my plants. Should I continue to use this or should i stop? :huh:
 
Don't clean the filter right away with the new fish, let it wait the month (unless of course you observe your flow lessening a lot, but you shouldn't.) The filter will probably not be very clogged and it will be fragile and you want it to just mature without disturbance as much as possible.

I do not know about those particular plant fertilizers, perhaps some other member will. Usually fertilizers will not disturb a fishless cycle, but its possible they could be a source of NO3 shooting up I suppose.

~~waterdrop~~
 
I have just noticed that I have added the ammonia about 5 hours before I should of but that is due to my shift pattern, I will have to add sometimes early or late to the tank because of this, will it effect the cycle by any chance?

P.S. as much as I love my other half :rolleyes: , I DONT trust her :lol: with adding it when it should and doing all the tests!!!
 
Its not particularly ciritical when you put the ammonia in, but it is important to note it and then know how many hours later it is when you test how much the ammonia has dropped. It is also important not to be making the mistake so many do of just adding ammonia right when it gets to zero (I know in your case you are not doing this now.)

~~waterdrop~~
 
Only thing I can say today is I wouldn't yet waterchange ;) I let nitrate raise untill it starts to slow anything down. The joy of fishless is less work for the same results, so I tend not to do more work on a tank that is fishless cycling than is needed.
 
Still on Day 6 and I tested the water this evening at 22:00 and got the following:

PH 8.5-8.0 :good:
Ammonia 0.0 :good:
Nitrite 3.3 :unsure:
Nitrate 110 :unsure:
dKH Not tested

Well the ammonia is being processed within 12 hours by the looks of it! :good:

So my question is do I do a water change or just add 2.5ml of Ammonia after I have done my tests tomorrow? If i am to do a water change how much?

Cheers
 
I'd say just add the ammonia at your roughly 24/day mark and lets go another day just looking at stats.

Clearly, counting days from the time where you "reset" per my instructions is deceptive for fishless cycling purposes. You are probably technically somewhere in the 2nd stage with the nitrite spike by the look of the stats.

~~waterdrop~~
 
Well good morning to all again for the latest update!!! I have certainly got some interesting results this morning!!

Well it is now DAY 7 after the reset!

I tested the water this morning at 11:35 AM and got the following:

PH 8.5 :good:
Ammonia 0.0 :good:
Nitrite 0.3 :good:
Nitrate 10 :good:
dKH Off the scale > 16 :good:

The Nitrites and Nitrates have dropped dramatically! looks like its taking around 24 hours to process the Nitrites and Nitrates! I even retested them as I was that shocked!!! So I have added the 2.5ml and we shall see where we get to tomorrow!!

I have been looking at what fish I would like and have seen theat most of my fish would like soft to hard water as mine is > 16 dKH how can I solve this? I guess that when i do my water change it will bring the dKH down but then the PH will do the same and I dont want a crash again if I can help it!!???

Also I have been reading about SLUDGEBUSTER?? for when I get my Fishies!! is this any good? Or should I just stick to gravel cleans?

Thanks for all the help!
 

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