They Just Die

[TarkMalbot]

I have had fish for about 6 months now and keep a variety of community fish such as Guppy, Molly, Tetra, Danio, Silver Shark, Pink Kissers, Glass Catfish, Blue rams and a whiptail. I would say my water is good quality. 0ppm Ammonia, 0 Nitrites and very little Nitrates. The PH is a little high at about 7.6 but have always been advised to leave it alone if the fish seem ok due to PH swings and stress etc etc. My Tap water is 7.6 and is hard. I keep the temperature at about 26 Degrees. I do a 1/4 tank water change every week or two and give the filters a clean every week in the old tank water. I use stress coat to treat my water and put it in the tank at the right temperature. Every month I clean out the filter internals and tubing as described in the maintenance instructions. I have the lights on a timer for about 10 hours a day, feed the fish once a day sometimes with flake sometimes with frozen food.

My problem is that my fish have lived in the same quality and treated water for months all seem healthy and none never show signs of illness but then with no warning one day one just dies. I watch the fish every day out of pleasure and to check they are all there and healthy. This has happened out of the blue a few times over the last few months and to different types of fish. For instance I had 6 Zebra Danio that all seem healthy and then one day I find one is dead and a few weeks later another died. Now I have 4 and no more deaths since. Same heppened a few months ago with the Neon Tetra. I had six then one died and have had no others die since. I have had the fish for 4 months or more now and don't understand why one out of a shoal just die one day and then the rest seem fine. It's not just the small fish either as I have had a glass catfish dissapear and both of my pink kissers died within 2 days of each other with no warning after seeming perfectly happy for months. On the other hand the Molly and guppy seem happy to bread all the time and some other fish have had no losses at all.

What is it that is killing them off in this way and without any signs how can I predict it or prevent it happening?

 

[rdd1952]

It does seem odd. Are you using any chemicals other than the Stress Coat? What size tank do you have and what fish are currently in it? Do the fish show any signs of disease or injury when you find them dead? How are you cleaning the tubing on the filter? I've never heard of doing that. I clean my external filters about once every 3 months but never touch the tubing.

 

[OldMan47]

I have never used the stress coat product. Is it a dechlorinator? If it is and you are using it for water changes then all should be well. I have fallen for the hype regarding Prime so I use it for my dechlorinator but have used other products with no problem. You will sometimes lose a fish or two to old age but two in rapid succession of the same type seems to point to more than old age. Did you do anything that might have affected the pH, hardness or other factors of your water shortly before any of the deaths or are we totally without clues to guide us?

 

[TarkMalbot]

The fish are usually all fine when I go to bed and then in the morning one will be missing. It's dead body will turn up usually with most of its internals eaten. I guess they die and then the others scavenge. There are no fish in there big enough to eat the other fish whole and I haven't witnessed any chasing or bullying. None of the fish have shown any sign off illness before they died which is why it is confusing me.

I use API Stress Coat which is a quoted as follows

"Instantly removes chlorine and chloramines, making tap water safe for fish. Neutralizes heavy metals. Also, replaces the natural slime coating fish need in times of stress, such as handling, shipping or fighting. Contains Aloe Vera, nature's liquid bandage, to prevent the loss of essential electrolytes and protect damaged tissue against disease-causing organisms. Helps heal torn fins and skin wounds. Use when setting up aquarium, changing water, or adding fish."

I used Stress Zyme when setting up the bacerial filter and topped up every month or so. Quote:

"Improves the development of the biological filter and helps clean a dirty aquarium. Contains over 300 million live bacteria per teaspoonful. Breaks down organic compounds that cause dangerous conditions such as ammonia and nitrite poisoning and low oxygen levels. Continuous use assures an active biological filter, cleaner aquarium, healthier fish and good water quality. No refrigeration necessary. Use when setting up and maintaining an aquarium. For use in fresh and saltwater."

I have also used API aquarium salt as advised by my LFS as a weak solution conditioner although I have heard mixed opinions about this but I have been using it for 6 months so was a little reluctant to just stop all of a sudden. Quote:

"All natural salt, made from evaporated sea water, promotes healthy gill function, reduces stress and loss of electrolytes. Used to improve the efficiency of medications and reduce the harmful effects of nitrite."

Should I wean them off it or continue to use it? I know the livebearers will do better with it but not sure about the others.

I have also added some plant food as I have a variety of living plants in the tank.

The Tank is 165 Litres with a trickle filtration system and at present have the following fish:

1 male and 2 female Guppy (originally had only 6 males & no female but 5 died during cycle)
1 male and 2 female Sailfin Molly
1 male and 2 female Rainbow fish
4 Zebra Danios (2 died a few months ago a month or two apart)
5 Neon Tetras (1 died a few months ago)
2 Blue Rams
5 Glass Catfish (1 went missing and was never found again about 3 months back)
4 Algea Shrimp
2 Sucking Loaches
1 Whiptail

2 Pink Kissers (both died within 3 days of each other this week)

I know this seems like a lot of fish but they are all small at the min (none bigger than 3") and the tank does not seem over crowded and the fish all get on fine and have thier own space. There are plenty of hiding places and plants. I know the Silver Shark should be kept as a shoal and will grow too big for my tank but this was bad advice from the LFS when I first set up. I have since found out a lot more information about fish and realised I have been given some bad advice by the LFS so am just trying to do the best I can with what I have got. When the fish get too big or the tank crowded I will be setting up another tank or giving them away to a more suitable owner.

 

[peedee]

I had some similar problems a while back with zebra danios and gourami's i thought maybe it was an internal parasite so i treated the tank with eSHa 2000 which my lfs in soham said was good and safe for the loaches. Since then all have been fine with no more mysterious deaths. The only thing i can't make sense of is every one makes it sound like internal parasites are highly contagious and will wipe out a tank.
good luck to ya

 

[WILDER]

Esha 2000 is a bacterial med not an internal parasite med.
Signs of internal parasites are.
Being skinny or bloated.
long stringy white poo, or clear mucas poo, red poo.
Worms prutruding from the anus.
Enlarged anus to red inflamed anus.
Livebeares are prone to camallanous worms the only med available in the uk to kill them is through a vet.

 

[CFC]

Stop using the salt and stress zyme, both are just products to take your money and are of no benefitial use to the tank, the addition of salt is particularly bad as a lot of your fish are softwater fish which are not developed to deal with salts in their water.

To be honest with the exception of the gouramies the fish that have died and the time period its spread over i wouldnt be too worried, 4 very small fish over a 3 month period isn't major losses and is quite normal with things like neons and glass cats which arent the hardiest of fish in the world. Keep an eye out for any signs of disease but unless you actually have evidence of something wrong i would just chalk the deaths down to experience.

 

[waterdrop]

and did you check out this thread?

http/www.fishforums.net/content/forum/21...lt-Beneficial-/

especially the second post by Tokis and some later comments on it.

 

[TarkMalbot]

Well firstly I will stop with the salt and stress zyme then. I will do water changes over the next few weeks without adding salt so that in a month or so there will be no salt left in the tank but it wont be a sudden change for the fish.

As for the Pink Kissers I did notice that one was hiding a lot but I was used to them just seeming lazy and spending time out of the way and arround the plants. Don't know what killed them as they didn't show any other signs of illness. As for the small fish, Is it wise to top up the shoals with just one fish ie One Neon to get the shoal back to 6? Thanks for the advice and I will keep trying.

Mark.