Molly not quite right...?

[Ellio]

Hi all,

I could do with some help with one of my platinum lyre tail mollies.

We noticed today that he is sort of floating on the surface. I say sort of because he does swim around, albeit slowly. He has his mouth partially open, but doesn't open and close it. He also isn't eating. It almost looks like his jaw is broken. Sadly we have also just lost a ghost glass catfish and a dwarf cinnamon gourami. Everyone one else seems to be happy as Larry! We really don't know why. We've been testing our water and over the last couple of days our ph and ammonia has gone up. Ph was 8 this evening, ammonia was 0.25, nitrite 0, nitrate was 15. Not the greatest we know. We've done a water change but are worried our molly is unwell and as was the catfish and gourami.

We add aquasafe when we do a water change, is there anything else we should be adding?

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you!

 

[Byron]

Members will need some more data. How long has this tank been running with fish? How long have you had the molly? What size is the tank, how many and what fish? How often are water changes and how much volume?

Do you know the GH of your water? Check the municipal water authority's website for the GH, or call them; this is not something one checks regularly but it is necessary to know as some fish (like mollies) need harder water, and your other mentioned fish do not.

 

[Colin_T]

Hi and welcome to the forum

The fish in the picture appears to have a white top lip. If this is the case, it is probably a bacterial infection.

You can add rock salt (often sold as aquarium salt), sea salt or swimming pool salt to the aquarium at the dose rate of 2 heaped tablespoon per 20 litres of water.

If you only have livebearers (guppies, platies, swordtails, mollies), goldfish or rainbowfish in the tank you can double that dose rate, so you would add 4 heaped tablespoons per 20 litres.

Keep the salt level like this for at least 2 weeks but no longer than 4 weeks otherwise kidney damage can occur. Kidney damage is more likely to occur in fish from soft water (tetras, Corydoras, angelfish, gouramis, loaches) that are exposed to high levels of salt for an extended period of time, and is not an issue with livebearers, rainbowfish or other salt tolerant species.

The salt will not affect the beneficial filter bacteria but the higher dose rate will affect some plants. The lower dose rate will not affect plants.

After you use salt and the fish have recovered, you do a 10% water change each day for a week using only fresh water that has been dechlorinated. Then do a 20% water change each day for a week. Then you can do bigger water changes after that. This dilutes the salt out of the tank slowly so it doesn't harm the fish.

If you do water changes while using salt, you need to treat the new water with salt before adding it to the tank. This will keep the salt level stable in the tank and minimise stress on the fish.

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The formula below will allow you to work out how much water is in the tank:
measure length x width x height in cm.
divide by 1000.
= volume in litres.
When you measure the height, measure from the top of the substrate to the top of the water level.

There is a calculator/ converter in the "How To Tips" at the top of this page that will let you convert litres to gallons if you need it.

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Before you add salt, wipe the inside of the glass down with a clean fish sponge and do a 75% water change and gravel clean the substrate. You should also do a 75% water change and gravel clean the substrate any day you have an ammonia or nitrite reading above 0, or a nitrate reading above 20ppm. And if you ever lose a fish, do a 75% water change.
The water changes and gravel cleaning will reduce the number of disease organisms in the water and provide a cleaner environment for the fish to recover in.
Make sure any new water is free of chlorine/ chloramine before it is added to the tank.

Clean the filter if it hasn't been done in the last 2 weeks. However, if the filter is less than 6 weeks old, do not clean it. Wash filter materials/ media in a bucket of tank water.

Increase surface turbulence/ aeration when using medications because they reduce the dissolved oxygen in the water.

If you can post pictures of the other fish in the tank, I will check them for diseases.

 

[Ellio]

Hello,

In answer to the questions...
The tank is 120L, it is on its 5th week. We've had the molly for 4 weeks. It was ones of the first fish we got and has been absurdly fine until yesterday. We've been doing went 20% water changes since we got the track, although once our ammonia spiked we started doing daily 20% water changes. Or water is considered soft to moderately hard. We tested our tap waters nitrite level which is fairly high, but we use the Aquasafe with every change.

Colin-T, that is incredibly helpful, thank you so much! Our filter.is less than 6 weeks, but we've been changing the sponges in it as recommended by the sponge brand.

We couldn't find the molly this morning (dead or alive!). If it did die, is it possible the other fish are you? We have mollies, a dwarf cinnamon gourami, ghost glass catfish, a gold ancistrus pleco and a couple of platys.

With our set up/fish/timings etc we've been following the advice of the shop we've bought everything from.

Thanks very much.

 

[Colin_T]

Doing small water changes is pretty much pointless if you are trying to dilute nutrients like ammonia and nitrite. You are better off doing a 75% water change to dilute stuff because it is much more effective.

You do water changes for 2 main reasons.
1) to reduce nutrients like ammonia, nitrite & nitrate.
2) to dilute disease organisms in the water.

Fish live in a soup of microscopic organisms including bacteria, fungus, viruses, protozoans, worms, flukes and various other things that make your skin crawl. Doing a big water change and gravel cleaning the substrate on a regular basis will dilute these organisms and reduce their numbers in the water, thus making it a safer and healthier environment for the fish.

If you do a 25% water change each week you leave behind 75% of the bad stuff in the water.
If you do a 50% water change each week you leave behind 50% of the bad stuff in the water.
If you do a 75% water change each week you leave behind 25% of the bad stuff in the water.

Fish live in their own waste. Their tank and filter is full of fish poop. The water they breath is filtered through fish poop. Cleaning filters, gravel and doing big regular water changes, removes a lot of this poop and makes the environment cleaner and healthier for the fish.

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Any ammonia is going to be more toxic in water with a pH above 7.0, and the higher the pH, the more toxic it becomes.

You should do a 75% water change and gravel clean the substrate any day the ammonia or nitrite is over 0, or the nitrate is over 20ppm. However, if you have 30 or 40ppm nitrate in your tap water, that is as low as the tank will get to.

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Our filter.is less than 6 weeks, but we've been changing the sponges in it as recommended by the sponge brand.

Some companies suggest replacing filter media/ materials every week or two when you clean the filter. This is a marketing gimmick that encourages you to keep buying products from them. It also screws up the filter cycle.

Colonies of beneficial bacteria develop on the filter pads/ cartridges and these normally keep the ammonia and nitrite levels at 0. If you replace these pads, you get rid of the good bacteria and start the cycling process all over again. The cycling process usually takes 4-6 weeks and is where the filter develops the good bacteria.

Your best bet is to get some sponges from another brand of filter (I use AquaClear sponges but there are other brands), and cut them with a pair of scissor so they fit in your filter. You can then squeeze the sponges out in a bucket of tank water to clean them, and re-use them. Sponges will last for years and many people are still using the same filter sponges 10 years after they bought them.

You can also get round/ cylindrical sponges for some brands of internal power filter. These round sponges have a hole through the centre and they fit over the intake strainer of most external power filters. Again, you clean the round sponge by squeezing it out in a bucket of tank water.

If you add sponges to the filter, leave the old filter pads in there too for at least 4 (preferably 6 weeks), then throw the pads away and just leave sponges in the filter.

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Does your tap water have nitrites or nitrates in?
Tap water in some countries has nitrates in, but it should not have nitrites in. If you have nitrites in the tap water, you need to contact the health department and inform them because nitrite and nitrates cause cancer. Low levels of nitrates are considered safe for people to ingest, but only time will tell if that is correct.

If you do have nitrates in the tap water, you can get a Pozzani Filter to remove the nitrates, or put the water into a plastic storage container with some floating plants, and the plants will use the nitrates and get rid of them. Then you use the clean water for the fish tank.

There's a couple of threads on this forum about Pozzani Filters. You can use the search function on the top right of the screen to look for them.

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The dead fish might have been eaten by the other inhabitants, but it could also be rotting away underneath an ornament, wood or among the plants. Have a good look for it and lift items up to check in and under them.

You should do a 75% water change and gravel clean any time you lose a fish or if the fish get sick.

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You need to find out exactly what the GH of your water is, and what measurement it is in (eg: ppm or dGH). Mollies need a pH above 7.0 and GH around 250ppm and struggle if the GH is under 200ppm.
Platies like water with a pH above 7.0 and a GH around 200ppm.
Gouramis, plecos and glass catfish come from soft water with a pH below 7.0 and a GH below 150ppm.

 

[Ellio]

Thank you so much! I honestly can't express my gratitude enough.

We've been doing 75% water changes and the water tests are so much better. Ph, Ammonia and Nitrite are all good, Nitrate is almost there. We've added in a couple more live plants and also added an oxygen bubble thingy to the filter to help with oxygenation the tank more. Everyone looks so much healthier and happier.

Just, thank you.