Is This True?

[WILDER]

I won't buy anymore of cycle by nutrafin is a complete waste of money.
Didn't seem to do anything.

 

[rdd1952]

Personally, I don't think any fish should be considered disposable. I do understand that some fish are used as feeders but they aren't subjected to the high ammonia and nitrite levels and a slow, painful death.

As to the cycling issue, cloning is definitely the way to go if you have the capability of doing that.

 

[5teady_2012]

I still stick with the fish cycle;
I have quite a few tanks running now so I just clone them, really I haven't had to cycle for any of my tanks except for one.
Most of you make fish cycling sound like a genocide....
Keep in mind we are talking about fish here, not people. Do not buy your desired fish for the cycle, buy ones that are "disposable". I know some of you may take that statement as offensive, but it is simply a difference in opinion. I believe the death of a $3 goldfish as a result from inducing the nitrogen cycle is not a crime against nature.

I think cycling with fish is not right, its unfair, even hardy fish get burnt gills etc and it does them harm, in my eyes.. why harm anyhting if there is products out there that do the same job without having to harm anything..

Would you like to be harmed for the benefit of others?

Would your family and friends think, oh never mind he can handle it? he may get hurt but he will survive..

I know fish dont have familys but ehh come on, they got a life thats just a valuble as yours.

Remember assembly m8? all things bright and beautiful, all creatures great and small.

 

[WILDER]

Why do you have to add cycle after a water change in mature tanks, as it says it here in this article.
http/www.drsfostersmith.com/product/prod...p;N=0&Nty=1
Only thing I can think of if you have ammonia in your tap water.

 

[demonmagus]

I cycled with danios, didn't see them suffering at all...

 

[spAcE mOnkEy]

Would you like to be harmed for the benefit of others?

-No I would not, but I am also not a fish. Fish do not think like you or I do, they strictly upon their instincts.

Would your family and friends think, oh never mind he can handle it? he may get hurt but he will survive..

-My friends and family wouldn't like it.

I know fish dont have familys but ehh come on, they got a life thats just a valuble as yours.

-I would like to believe that my life is a bit more valuable than a fish. Depends how rare the fish is though...

I understand what you are trying to say, but we just have different opinions. I do not support the torture of animals as many of you may believe, but I simply think this isn't really "torture". Fish got through far worse conditions in the wild, evading predators, etc.
When fish experience pain, it is not like you or I, they do not scream, feel sad or think of the future. They just live.

 

[WILDER]

I'm going to be honest I cycled my first tank using fish.
Didn't know at the time, they do suffer in a cycling tank damages there gills, burn there skin.
Not nice watching a fish gasp for breath at the top of the tank.
If a was starting out now I would take the fishless cycle route.

 

[5teady_2012]

understand what you are trying to say, but we just have different opinions. I do not support the torture of animals as many of you may believe, but I simply think this isn't really "torture". Fish got through far worse conditions in the wild, evading predators, etc.
When fish experience pain, it is not like you or I, they do not scream, feel sad or think of the future. They just live.

Who in the world can prove how fish think, pain is pain, no matter who or what it is, its not nice..

I understand what your saying about them been in the wild, but us humans can prevent harming them by means of products..

So really you have a choice (unlike wild animals) and you can choose not to harm them in anywa, or choose to harm them even if its mild..

IMO, you choose to harm them.

Your choice though but i wouldnt do it.. and i dont judge you as a person.

 

[Tobigara]

I think cycling with fish is not right, its unfair, even hardy fish get burnt gills etc and it does them harm, in my eyes.. why harm anyhting if there is products out there that do the same job without having to harm anything..

Would you like to be harmed for the benefit of others?

Would your family and friends think, oh never mind he can handle it? he may get hurt but he will survive..

I know fish dont have familys but ehh come on, they got a life thats just a valuble as yours.

Remember assembly m8? all things bright and beautiful, all creatures great and small.

i value the lives of animals more than the lives of most humans. i don't want to hurt my fish but
with proper care, a fish in cycle can be no more dangerous than living in the wild as far as chemical levels go. it just takes work. regardless of the circumstances, fish all live in a small amount of ammonia and nitrite.

 

[jeej]

You didn't read what I put. I never said there was no ammonia in urine. I think it might be wise for you to read someone's comments properly before mocking them in future.

quite right, i will concede that, i also mention it in my signature, however it will not change the way i post. as passing on correct information, even if you do make the odd mistakes sometimes, is far better than passing incorrect, information to those who wish to learn. your comments were still faulty at best. you advise against a practice, yet the reason you give, is actually the reason it works! now if you had identified the troublesome culprits in urea that you fear may cause problem, fair enough.

The kidneys play a vital role in regulating body pH, preventing acidosis or alkalosis by excreting excess hydrogen ions or bicarbonate ions as required. When it leaves the body, urine is usually around pH 6, though it may be as low as 4.5 or as high as 8.2. As urea—the compound which accounts for 75–90% of the nitrogen in urine—begins to decay, hydroxide ions form, raising the pH as high as 9–9.3.

The decay of urea into carbon dioxide is catalyzed by urease:

(NH2)2CO + H2O → CO2 + 2NH

Animals ingest a wide variety of compounds daily. Not least are humans, who consume an incredible array of natural and artificial chemicals in the form of food, drink and pharmaceutical products. With the exception of vitamins, minerals and other micro-nutrients such as essential fatty acids, none of these are needed or desirable within the body. All are either metabolised by the liver, excreted in bile or filtered from the blood by the kidneys, and excreted in urine.

Studies of urine in organic cattle farms in Sweden in 1999 and 2002 yielded the following concentrations of heavy metals (all in μg/kg wet weight):

* Copper: 67
* Zinc: 30
* Chromium: 5
* Lead: 1
* Cadmium: 0

Now, in all fairness, it is not for me to say how bad some components of urine may be for a tank, I'm not a scientist! I just don't know whether I believe it is ideal to urinate in your fish tank. Still, each to their own!

 

[rdd1952]

This is starting to get way off topic as the discussion really has nothing to do with the morality of fish-in cycles. We are all entitled to our opionion (even if yours is wrong....) and we will never agree on where fish stand in importance.

 

[Tobigara]

This is starting to get way off topic as the discussion really has nothing to do with the morality of fish-in cycles. We are all entitled to our opionion (even if yours is wrong....) and we will never agree on where fish stand in importance.

good point. my apologies(sp?) 5teady.

as for urinating in an aquarium...i can see both sides of it but i don't think i can bring myself to peeing in something that will eventually live there. it seems degrading even tho i know a fish wouldn't care.

 

[rdd1952]

It wasn't only you Tobigara. I was even guilty too. As for the urine, yes, it will work but I would personally never do it. After all, I'm not tall enough....

 

[5teady_2012]

This is starting to get way off topic as the discussion really has nothing to do with the morality of fish-in cycles. We are all entitled to our opionion (even if yours is wrong....) and we will never agree on where fish stand in importance.

good point. my apologies(sp?) 5teady.

as for urinating in an aquarium...i can see both sides of it but i don't think i can bring myself to peeing in something that will eventually live there. it seems degrading even tho i know a fish wouldn't care.

No need to apologise, i have learnt a lot from a lot of comments so i see no harm..

I see also no harm in constructive critism

This is starting to get way off topic as the discussion really has nothing to do with the morality of fish-in cycles. We are all entitled to our opionion (even if yours is wrong....) and we will never agree on where fish stand in importance.

In my opinion, everything living as an importance in the world (it must have or it would not be there) thats the way i look at life..

Life is a gift, and in return i choose to respect all life..

Oops going off topic again sorry 5teady, oh i am 5teady

 

[Tobigara]

It wasn't only you Tobigara. I was even guilty too. As for the urine, yes, it will work but I would personally never do it. After all, I'm not tall enough....

off topic again but...i'm not tall enough either but maybe with a good arc?