Unusually swollen guppy!

[AdoraBelle Dearheart]

So should I just get praziquantel and levimasole? Will they get rid of everything? I mean what can I use to get rid of all worms that is shrimp and snail and plant safe? The article sent here mentioned many substances so I chose from there, I thought it was UK based.

Hi, I used eSHa ndx (levamisole, kills roundworms) and eSHa GDEX (prazi, kills flatworms) in my tanks including shrimp and heavily planted, and they were fine! Had to stagger the treatments, so I did a round of NDX, then in the wait period for the second round of NDX I did the full course of the GDX treatment. I had camallanus worms at least, possible others since I had a lot of livebearers, and livebearers often arrive carrying worms, so I wanted to sure I'd wiped them out. Worked well for me.

 

[Divinityinlove]

Hi, I used eSHa ndx (levamisole, kills roundworms) and eSHa GDEX (prazi, kills flatworms) in my tanks including shrimp and heavily planted, and they were fine! Had to stagger the treatments, so I did a round of NDX, then in the wait period for the second round of NDX I did the full course of the GDX treatment. I had camallanus worms at least, possible others since I had a lot of livebearers, and livebearers often arrive carrying worms, so I wanted to sure I'd wiped them out. Worked well for me.

Thanks. That's good advice. I can get esha gdex. Its just it has malachite green in it amongst other things and their extended product info says they have not observed negative effects on shrimp or snails but there isn't enough evidence. Everything else online says MG kills shrimp and snails.

 

[AdoraBelle Dearheart]

Thanks. That's good advice. I can get esha gdex. Its just it has malachite green in it amongst other things and their extended product info says they have not observed negative effects on shrimp or snails but there isn't enough evidence. Everything else online says MG kills shrimp and snails.

I can't make any promises, but my red cherry shrimp colony was fine, and the pest snails survived too (I don't have nerites or anything).

 

[Essjay]

I can get esha gdex. Its just it has malachite green in it amongst other things

Can you point me to where you found that, please. The instruction leaflet lists only praziquantel and it says it doesn't colour the water. I like to know what else is in things besides the listed ingredients .

 

[Divinityinlove]

Can you point me to where you found that, please. The instruction leaflet lists only praziquantel and it says it doesn't colour the water. I like to know what else is in things besides the listed ingredients .

I just looked again, malachite green is in the esha exit. My mistake. I've bought gdex too now.

Follow up question to anyone who has so far shared such valuable knowledge. I received the ndx today and am a bit confused reading the leaflet as I didn't see this on the website.

It says to perform water change without dechlorinaters? Never heard of this before. Why? And how is that OK for the aquarium? Am I misunderstanding?

Also, are regular aquarium lights OK for these meds? I read one article saying to turn off regular lights too. Unsure based on a whole.

 

[Essjay]

It's UV lights that need to be turned off.

They say not to use water conditioners because

Q -Can I use water conditioners with eSHa products and how am I supposed to provide my fish with safe water without it?
A -Tap water conditioner / chlorine / heavy metal & slime coat protection generally do not interfere much with eSHa products.

However, these products contain chemicals which are designed to attack, bind or coat other molecules. When your tap water is clean or if you overdose the tap safe, these chemicals build up and eagerly wait to react and then can reduce or even neutralize eSHa products.

They go on to say things like using the minimum amount of dechlorinator (which we should be doing anyway), leave the new water to stand overnight with an airstone running (does not work for chloramine), use RO water with added minerals, or filter the new water through carbon (fine if you have only a small tank but impractical with large tanks)

From https://www.eshalabs.com/faq/


Most people just use dechlorinator as usual.

 

[Divinityinlove]

It's UV lights that need to be turned off.

They say not to use water conditioners because


They go on to say things like using the minimum amount of dechlorinator (which we should be doing anyway), leave the new water to stand overnight with an airstone running (does not work for chloramine), use RO water with added minerals, or filter the new water through carbon (fine if you have only a small tank but impractical with large tanks)

From https://www.eshalabs.com/faq/


Most people just use dechlorinator as usual.

Thanks. Do you know if the medicine still works with the dechlorinator?

 

[Essjay]

I'm pretty sure everyone else who has used it also uses dechlorinators and no-one else has reported it not working. eSHa says the same thing about all its products.

I can see the point of removing carbon from the filter as that will remove the med. I can see the point of turning of UV lights as UV destroys many meds. But even eSHa says dechlorinators generally do not interfere with their meds if not overdosed, and even then it's probably the ones that contain all sorts of things besides the actual dechlorinator that can affect meds (eg those things which 'promote the slime coat')

 

[AdoraBelle Dearheart]

I used my regular declorinator while going through treatment (and kept usual tank lights on, since I don't use UV, and don't usually have carbon running unless I need it for a specific purpose). I was using Prime water conditioner, so not a lot of "other stuff" added to it like stresscoat has. eSHa still cleared up my worm problem! But I remember having the same questions as you, and wondering if I needed to do tank blackout. But you don't as long as your lights aren't UV

 

[Divinityinlove]

So I dosed with esha ndx as suggested, yesterday morning. Came to do the water change this morning and put the carbon back in. All fish were fine except bettas, snail fine, 1 out of 2 amano shrimp who survived the interpret anti internal bacteria meds last week is yet to be seen as always hiding, however out of 3 female bettas, 1 was dead, 1 was very ill with clamped frilly bits and 1 was totally fine swimming happily and looking red and healthy.

Not much tell for the medicine itself.

Question now; how long to wait before dosing esha gdex?

I'll dose ndx again in two weeks for hatched eggs.

 

[AdoraBelle Dearheart]

So I dosed with esha ndx as suggested, yesterday morning. Came to do the water change this morning and put the carbon back in. All fish were fine except bettas, snail fine, 1 out of 2 amano shrimp who survived the interpret anti internal bacteria meds last week is yet to be seen as always hiding, however out of 3 female bettas, 1 was dead, 1 was very ill with clamped frilly bits and 1 was totally fine swimming happily and looking red and healthy.

Not much tell for the medicine itself.

Question now; how long to wait before dosing esha gdex?

I'll dose ndx again in two weeks for hatched eggs.

Wow... I'm sorry for your loss, I find it hard to believe that it was the med that did it, having used it myself, but perhaps. There's also always the chance that worms killed by the medicine either can't successfully be passed by the fish, or have already caused internal damage since they attach to the digestive tract, leaving wounds when they die and leave the fish, and opportunities for secondary bacterial infections. Of course, any medication is an additional stressor for fish, and given that they're already battling a health problem, the additional stress - even if essential - may just be too much for them. Were the female bettas in the same tank? What are the water parameters on that tank now?
I worry though, I don't trust the results from dip strips or those stick on testers.

When doing the water changes, make sure to give the substrate a good gravel vac, since they should pass dead worms, and the worms when alive will have laid eggs that go to the floor and get eaten by other fish. The first treatment should have killed any living worms, while the second should kill any that hatch out after the first treatment.

 

[Essjay]

Question now; how long to wait before dosing esha gdex?

I would do 2 or 3 big water changes, then run carbon in the filter for a day or two before using gdex. Then do the same again before adding the second course of ndx.

 

[Divinityinlove]

Wow... I'm sorry for your loss, I find it hard to believe that it was the med that did it, having used it myself, but perhaps. There's also always the chance that worms killed by the medicine either can't successfully be passed by the fish, or have already caused internal damage since they attach to the digestive tract, leaving wounds when they die and leave the fish, and opportunities for secondary bacterial infections. Of course, any medication is an additional stressor for fish, and given that they're already battling a health problem, the additional stress - even if essential - may just be too much for them. Were the female bettas in the same tank? What are the water parameters on that tank now?
I worry though, I don't trust the results from dip strips or those stick on testers.

When doing the water changes, make sure to give the substrate a good gravel vac, since they should pass dead worms, and the worms when alive will have laid eggs that go to the floor and get eaten by other fish. The first treatment should have killed any living worms, while the second should kill any that hatch out after the first treatment.

So what do you use for parameter testing?

 

[Divinityinlove]

I would do 2 or 3 big water changes, then run carbon in the filter for a day or two before using gdex. Then do the same again before adding the second course of ndx.

All these water changes, every 24>hours, 20-30%?

 

[AdoraBelle Dearheart]

So what do you use for parameter testing?

I use a liquid test kit - I trust them more since they have to mix and react to the water as it is right at that moment. Seem to give more accurate results.
Although again, I'm no expert. @Essjay , what do you think of the Seachem stick on tank test alerts for things like ammonia/nitrite/nitrate? I honestly don't know how they claim to work, and how accurate they may be.