Stocking Question

[Briggan]

Hi!
So today, my dwarf gourami passed away. I’m not sure what from or how, but he did.
Now I’m left with 6 neon tetras and 2 platys in a 20 gal hex tall.
I plan on going out to the lfs within the week and I would like to know if I could replace the gourami with a betta and some type of snail.
I don’t have any animal to clean up algae or waste and I think snails are cool. Would adding the betta and some snail be too much or would it be ok? If so, what kind of snail would you recommend? I already own a nerite and I love them.
Also, I would like to get a siphon if I can’t get a snail. Can siphons be used with river stone gravel or can it only be used effectively with sand?
Thanks!

 

[Byron]

Betta is not a community fish so I would not advise a Betta with neons (I have seen Betta eat neons and I have seen neons fin nip a Betta literally to death).

Snails are good scavengers; I only have the small innocuous snails like pond, bladder, and Malaysian Livebearing. Other members can suggest larger options.

What are your water parameters? This refers to the GH and pH. There are a lot of smaller fish well suited to a small vertical tank (a 20g is small to the fish) but many will be wild caught so more demanding.

Siphoning the substrate gravel during the water change is fine.

 

[Colin_T]

Do not get another labyrinth fish (Betta or Gourami) for the tank. If your gourami had the Iridovirus or some other disease, it could be passed onto other gouramis or Bettas if you put them in that tank.

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Get a basic model gravel cleaner like the one in the following link. You do not need a fancy gravel cleaner with switches and gadgets. Just get a plain old boring one with a syphon hose and tube. They don't need anything else.
https://www.about-goldfish.com/aquarium-cleaning.html

Ask the pet shop to demonstrate it for you. If they won't, then hop on YouTube and look up gravel cleaning an aquarium.

You start the water syphoning out of the tank into a bucket. While the water is draining out you push the gravel cleaner into the substrate and lift it up. The gravel circulates in the clear tube before dropping back to the bottom, and the gunk gets drawn up and out with some of the water.

If you have ornaments or rocks in the tanks, lift them up and gravel clean under them, then put them back in place.

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Apple/ Mystery snails are cool but not available in the UK coz the government thinks they are going to take over the country and rule with an iron shell.

Ramshorn snails are interesting and come in a variety of colours ranging from black, brown, red, pink and they can have spots or stripes.

 

[Essjay]

Nerite snails will eat some types of algae but little else. Avoid giant Columbian ramshorns as they do eat plants.

Apple/ Mystery snails are cool but not available in the UK coz the government thinks they are going to take over the country and rule with an iron shell.

It's the whole EU not just the UK, we have members in other EU countries who can't get apple snails either. All because one species of apple snail was found in a river in Spain, so all species are banned from the Med to the arctic circle.

 

[Briggan]

Hi!
I live in a place where I can get apple and mystery snails, most others for that matter. My nerite keeps the whole tank clean. There is a small gap in the hood for the filter on the 20g, I was worried a snail might get out, as nerites can stay out of water for a limited time. The nerite I have cannot get out of its tank because the tank’s hood doesn’t have a big enough gap. I just need a species of snail to keep the gravel clean but not overpopulate my tank.
My lfs also has regular siphons so that shouldn’t be a problem.
I believe I asked this in another thread, but how do I know the gourami had the iridivorus disease?
If it did is there a way to make the water safe for other labyrinths? They are my favorites.
Thanks!

 

[Colin_T]

It's the whole EU not just the UK, we have members in other EU countries who can't get apple snails either. All because one species of apple snail was found in a river in Spain, so all species are banned from the Med to the arctic circle.

ROFLMAO

attack of the killer mystery snails, ahh, ahhh, ahhhh run away.

alert all military defenses, mobilise all forces.

Gentlemen, lock n load. We have snails to kill.

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For the OP

If you can get mystery snails (good for you but don't tell the EU or they will consider you an enemy of the state), then get a couple of them. They don't breed very often and are slow growing.

I might send some mystery snails to the EU and see if I can create a panic. Alert all government agencies, we have a snail terrorist on the loose.

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If the gourami had the Iridovirus then it should have developed sores on its body and become run down/ tired, weak lethargic, and eventually die.

The only way to make a tank safe after the Iridovirus has been in it, is to drain and disinfect everything in the tank with bleach. Any fish in that tank can be carriers of the virus and so can plants shrimp, snails, etc. They can carry the virus on their body or inside their cells.

 

[Briggan]

So the gourami I had was good for about a month. In that time, it would occasionally develop white slimy looking stuff on its body but it would go away. Around a week ago it became skinny, pale, and wouldn’t leave its urn deco. Whenever it swam, it did so near the bottom. Then, it just died. It rarely got enough food. Are these signs of iridivorus? I reeeeeaaallly don’t want to have to disinfect everything, but I don’t want another infected fish. I got the gourami from a different shop than usual...
I have other fish in there that seem unaffected.
I’ll see what snails the lfs has in stock.
Thanks!

 

[FishGuest5123]

Regarding syphons, I agree that the plain ones are great but if you have a large tank, the Python is the only way to go. I can clean, drain, and refill my 55G in less time than it takes to do the same for my 20G long with my pump syphon. It just takes way too long to drain big tanks with plain bulb syphon. With 6 tanks, currently, I need the fastest way possible to get the gunk out and the tank drained and refilled.

 

[Colin_T]

The Iridovirus is simply a virus that affects the fish. It can cause numerous symptoms but generally it will weaken the fish's immune system and cause the fish to spend lots of time resting. When the immune system is compromised the fish is susceptible to secondary infections like sores from bacteria. As the virus does more damage to the fish, the internal organs start to fail and the fish eventually dies from organ failure or secondary infection (bacterial infections).

The white slimy stuff on the fish is simply excess mucous produced by the fish. Fish naturally have a thin layer of mucous over their body to help protect them from parasites, disease organisms, and to help them slip through the water easier. When the fish is stressed by something they produce more mucous and it looks like a cream or white film is covering them.

Any labyrinth fish from Asia can have the Iridovirus and the only way to tell if the fish had the Iridovirus is to get a fish vet to necropsy it and send samples off to be cultured in a lab. That costs a lot of money and isn't really worth it.

Most people just risk it and get another gourami and hope for the best. If you get another one and it dies within a few months, then the virus is probably in the tank.

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Re: gravel cleaners. I had 20 meters of 2 inch plastic hose and a 2 litre plastic drink bottle. I could water change and gravel clean 100 x 3ft tanks in a day. Use a big hose and run it out the door onto the garden. Put a 2 litre plastic bottle on it and go nuts.

 

[Briggan]

Thank you!
I plan on going the the lfs within the week and I might try out another fish. If something goes wrong I will treat the tank and fix any problem.

 

[FishGuest5123]

I actually am using your water bottle syphon in my garden pond, Colin. Nice!!!

 

[Briggan]

Ah, one more question:
Is iridivorus dangerous in any way to humans?
I had to use some kitchen tongs to hold the net in order to reach the dead fish. Is it dangerous that the tongs were in that water or was touching the net holding the fish? I’m a total germaphobe 100% and I need to be sure if it’s safe or else I get anxious...
Thanks!

 

[FishGuest5123]

Bleach! Let the tongs sit in bleach and water...10 parts water to 1 part bleach for 30 minutes and then rinse well and wash as usual. Bleach is the best disinfectant you can use. I worked my career in healthcare and we used it for everything. Even HIV. If you want to go further, you can boil after bleach but not necessary. I believe the virus is only contagious to other Gouramis but not sure. It is NOT contagious to humans.

 

[Briggan]

Thank you.. my mom already washed them and put them away but I told her and we will wash them.

 

[Colin_T]

It is NOT contagious to humans.

You spoil sport. I was gonna stir them up a bit and say, ahh ahhh don't let it touch you. Your skin will melt and your hair will fall out. Think the wicked witch and a bucket of water from the Wizard of Oz.

But on a serious note (you still spoilt it for me), it is not contagious to people. Just wash your hands with warm soapy water after working in the tank and you will be fine. Warm soapy water is to wash off any protozoans, bacteria, and other microscopic organisms in the tank water.

Any labyrinth fish can catch the Iridovirus and there are other viruses that can affect different fish, but you won't catch it and neither will any mammal or bird or reptile pets you have. It's a fish only virus and generally only affects gouramis and Bettas, but it might be able to jump species to other fish like tetras and barbs.

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On a side note, most organisms that live on this planet will die at 60C for a minute, so if you have a dishwasher and use a hot wash (60C), it will kill anything including bacteria, viruses, fungus, protozoans, etc.

60C is also good for clothes because it kills all the nasty things that can be spread from person to person.