Relation Between Plants ,algae And Phosphates/fert's

[snazy]

Well, macro nutritients are K, NO3, PO4, etc.. but his system is limited to dosing KNO3 only(limiting both K and PO4) unless.....needed, then he suggest the other protocols to determine how much of the rest of the macros are needed in certain scenarios, if at all.
 
And yes, once you determine the KNO3, you start dosing micros as well. Then he provides the rest of the info, if one comes across some unsolved scenarios. But his point is that creating a near GSA enviroment, by using very high light,max CO2 and micros, will create a very inhabitable enviroment for any other algae to thrive, but if you do, then the issue maybe different as he suggest, like incorrectly calculated CO2 to start with, or other stuff like Mg, Ca ratio etc..
 

i hate the fact AE don't display what is in there ferts so i know exactly what i am adding in already

but again from what i have learn over the next few days i should see GDA appear as my filter takes out the phosphate's

 
Not Green Dust Algae, Green Spot algae should appear once you reach 0 phosphate and dose some KNO3 after.
He says GDA is caused by wrong Ca:Mg ratio, too much calcium compared to Mg. He suggest 1:4 Ca/Mg or somewhere near.
And also excessive phosphates too in relation to NO3 amount added. And he says the following about Green Dust algae:
 
There is a lot of confusion about this algae. The EI method suggests that you should wait out the lifecycle of this algae until it dies (about 3 weeks).
However, a friend of mine waited for 6 months, the picture is from his tank.
I tested the water and I discovered a complex imbalance related to (1) Ca: Mg, too much Ca and (2) NO3O4, too much PO4. Three days later after we worked out and corrected these imbalances the problem was solved.

PROTOCOL:
1. Use the KNO3 generic protocol plus:
2. Clean the glasses every day until GDA doesn’t appears anymore.
3. In future, you should use a Ca:Mg ratio of 1:4.
4. If you add PO4, read the fertilizing chapter about PO4.
5. Read the water quality chapter about excess of PO4 and Ca in tap water

 

[SO19Firearms]

Far too much in this thread for me to get my head round. But a few things to bear in mind if you're going to be doing testing - You'll want to use distilled or at least RO water, so you know you're controlling everything.
You can rule out test kits. They're not up to testing aquariums, let alone critical values. Invest in a Spectrophotometer, or borrow one from a Uni.
If you're still looking for just PO4, or just NO3 the chemistry might be a bit out of reach.

And to pick up the very last paragraph - they tested the water (with what) to find a very complex imbalance and upon correcting the imbalance the problem was solved - It's equally likely that something else was at play - [lets guess CO2 for fun] and upon introducing a complex imbalance they were able to impair the growth in such a way as to stymie the plant growth/algae continuation.

Oh and because you asked - Aquarium Chemicals

 

[snazy]

It's equally likely that something else was at play - [lets guess CO2 for fun] and upon introducing a complex imbalance they were able to impair the growth in such a way as to stymie the plant growth/algae continuation.

SO, read the article how he evaluates the CO2 prior to nutritients:
 
http/www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/algae/69737-method-controlled-imbalances-summary.html

 

[SO19Firearms]

I've had another quick read. It looks like he's using a nutrient limited method to control growth, on initial reading that looks to be Fe and Phosphorous. IMO it doesn't show one or the other as a cause of the algae, it just controls it by not providing it (LLotM)
It can be done. I know of another chemist that dose something similar in his tanks. The difficulty is keeping those values low - unlike Eutrophic dosing where its pretty easy to keep them high.

I'd say make a choice and stick with it tho.

 

[Zikofski]

yes at the moment i am just testing to see if the products i have bought work the way they should so to speak, so far no drop in phosphate again i know the test kits not that good as you say SO19.
 
this morning my phosphate still read's beyond the scale, i am at the moment trying to sort out my co2 again so raising it up slowly to get it around 30ppm lime green on the drop checker, i am not dosing any ferts as of yet giving them a break i am hoping i should see a drop in the BBA, and possible a rise in GSA

 

[snazy]

and possible a rise in GDA

 He, he, GSA Zik, not GDA

 

[Zikofski]

well okay this was and wasn't going to plan, so where do i start, this backs up what SO19Firearms was tell me that test kits are useless, i am still getting huge amounts of phosphate in my tank according to the test kit, (now see if i get this right ) yesterday i saw GSA on my tank walls, so i dosed the ferts anyway even tho i had high phosphate and GSA ye wired my co2 has been stable now for a fair few days, the fact i got GSA was what i was hopping but i was also hopping to see 0 phosphate on the test kit so that part did not go to plant, the other thing is, the grow rate of my plants from yesterday to today was unbelievable, now the only plant i can see rapid growth in is this Hygrophila Guanensis as the new growth is such a lush bright green compared to the older more darker leafs, almost every one of this plant has at least 3 to 4 new leafs in one day :O i have not seen this amount of growth since i started adding co2 and ferts for the first time, now this is a shock as 2 weeks ago my growth stumped? why would this be and since doing a fert break so to speak without doing a WC, would my growth suddenly boom again?
 
so just to summarise maybe easier to understand
 

• around 2 Weeks ago -- i noticed my growth slow down, to a point i cant see anything growing
• 2 Days later -- still no growth i decided to combat this BBA, by spot dosing carbon and increasing my co2
• for the Next week -- my co2 levels would be HIGH beyond the 30ppm maybe even close to 35-40ppm fish where fine untill i added in fresh fish
• I add in fresh fish, in which i do a quick water change and take out ALL of my co2
• for the next 2 days i kept co2 off lights off and no ferts but spot dosing liquid co2 on the BBA where i can
• 2 days later i am back with co2 and lights
• now i kept the co2 steady at 30ppm until yesterday (18-04-13)
• dosed 50ml of ferts on 18-04-13 (Bottle dosing says 33ml for my 330L tank) and i increase my light period from 6 to 10 hours
• today (19-04-13) i dose ferts again, and i have HUGE amounts of growth?

 

[snazy]

I've had another quick read. It looks like he's using a nutrient limited method to control growth, on initial reading that looks to be Fe and Phosphorous.

 
He's limiting potassium too SO19, by adding it mainly via KNO3. He says the potassium drives NO3 demand and causes it to bottom out which one should avoid at all costs. One can increase NO3, but then you've got to increase the entire range of CO2, other nutritients, losing your current balance, hence he calls his method a controlled enviroment.
 
 
@Zikofski.
It goes to show that the phosphate test is for the bin anyway
If one knows how to trigger algae, then you'll know how to stop it too

 

[Zikofski]

yes exactly that was what i was trying to do effectively i am just hoping i can keep the bba at back now otherwise as i dono how flow could be any better to distribute my co2 and ferts around, co2 is perfect and constant to