Problems with everything!!

[Fiori]

Hi

New to fish keeping and despite my best efforts and a lot of time I have lost 2 platys in 2 days and my black mollies have a second dose of ich . I've had the tank going for 3 weeks (30 litres - approx 6.5 UK gallons).

Fish are 4 beacon tetras, 4 platys, 1 clown plec, 2 black mollies and 2 apple snails -probably too many I think.

One platy seemed to lose its tail and the other looked enormously bloated but no sign of scales sticking out. I'm treating the tank for ich using Protozin, keeping the light off and raised the temp a bit as well - seems to be working! (fingers crossed). I do have 3 molly fry which are going well so far and I spotted a platy fry today , but only the one - sand substrate so hard to see them.

I wondered if my water readings were anything to do with it - my PH seems to be dropping, having gone from 7 when the tank first started down to 6 today. I did a 33% water change and cleaned the filter etc the other day before I started the ich treatment.

Ammonia is 0
Nitrite 0.25
Nitrate 10 - big drop from 40, 3 days ago

Am I on the right track or is there something else I'm missing? How often should I do water changes as I was told its the worst thing to do for ich.

This is a 10 page essay - sorry guys - but I just want to make sure I'm doing everything I can, especially now I've become a mummy to wee baby fishies. Any advice would be fab!

 

[WILDER]

You have a high nitrite reading meaning your tank isn't cycled till it gets to 0 reading, you don't vac the gravel till this nitrite reading is 0, you can do small water changes along the way, with that reading I would be tempted to do a small water change 10 to 20%.

 

[WILDER]

Also your ph will be down as you are in a cycle and it changes in a cycle, so don't worry about that.

 

[kev_kb]

I'm sorry to say you are over stocked. The general rule of 1 inch per gallon isn't strictly true but it serves as a good guide for when we are learning, so I would stick to it for your first tank.

The 4 Platys are 8" of fish before considering the rest... The Pleco is likely to be very messy so it would probably be a good idea to take it back to your LFS. I would also take back the Mollies as they slightly larger than Platys. Not sure how the snails would affect your stocking.

Not sure what could affect your pH like that, hopefully someone else will post some ideas. Water change as much as needed to keep the Nitrite around 0.25ppm if you can. Platys should be able to handle this level for a little while.

I would water change every day, before treating with the Protozin. This will keep your levels down and won't affect the dosage that much. It worked for me when I was treating with Protozin.

 

[Fiori]

My nitrite reading reached 0 3 days ago, ammonia was 0 and nitrate was 40, so I then did the 33% water change. Also cleaned sand. Does that mean my tank has cycled at some point, as the nitrite reading has now gone back to 0.25?

I'll certainly try more frequent water changes - thx.

 

[WILDER]

How long has the tank been set up, as nitite should be 0 and you don't clean the subtrate till the nitrite reading is 0

 

[kev_kb]

The tank is fully cycled when Ammonia & Nitrite stay at 0ppm. Just continue what your doing and keep the Nitrite level low till it reduces to 0 again. FYI I gravel vacced my tank almost every water change and it cycled fine.

 

[WILDER]

You was nearly their at nitrite reading of 03, then you cleaned the sand and took the bacteria away and now it's shot back up, their is your answer.

 

[sylvia]

Hi

New to fish keeping and despite my best efforts and a lot of time I have lost 2 platys in 2 days and my black mollies have a second dose of ich . I've had the tank going for 3 weeks (30 litres - approx 6.5 UK gallons).

Fish are 4 beacon tetras, 4 platys, 1 clown plec, 2 black mollies and 2 apple snails -probably too many I think.

One platy seemed to lose its tail and the other looked enormously bloated but no sign of scales sticking out. I'm treating the tank for ich using Protozin, keeping the light off and raised the temp a bit as well - seems to be working! (fingers crossed). I do have 3 molly fry which are going well so far and I spotted a platy fry today , but only the one - sand substrate so hard to see them.

I wondered if my water readings were anything to do with it - my PH seems to be dropping, having gone from 7 when the tank first started down to 6 today. I did a 33% water change and cleaned the filter etc the other day before I started the ich treatment.

Ammonia is 0
Nitrite 0.25
Nitrate 10 - big drop from 40, 3 days ago

Am I on the right track or is there something else I'm missing? How often should I do water changes as I was told its the worst thing to do for ich.

This is a 10 page essay - sorry guys - but I just want to make sure I'm doing everything I can, especially now I've become a mummy to wee baby fishies. Any advice would be fab!

Lets deal with one thing at a time...

Firstly, your tank is too small for the fish you have. You should consider 2 male guppies or 2 male platies as your starting fish in this size tank.

If you have ick you must not return the fish yet or you'll be exposing other fish as well (at the LFS). Start doing water-changes every other day and treat your fish for a little longer than suggested by the instructions on the medication for ich. Ich is a parasite that cannot be treated in the form you see it (white spots on the fish). It is before and after this stage that it is treatable (but start treating immediately and keep treating for a while after the spots are gone). I am suggesting the extra PARTIAL (always partial) water changes because you are so over-stocked.

I know this is going to slow your cycling down but I am more concerned with fish lives than saving time! DO vacum the sand but don't wash out your filter. BTW, if there is carbon in the filter it will be removing the medication which is obviously not good. Take it out.

Your pH is going down because fish waste is acidic and a tank that is not cycled has an unstable pH because of this. Frequent water changes will keep it more stable and save your current fish.

Once the fish are all healthy again, return the pleco, tetras and the molies. You should also return at least 2 of the platies. I would only keep two males or return them as well and get yourself 2 male guppies (pretty and hardy and great for beginners).

Then start trying to cycle your tank. It may have already cycled by this time anyway but if not, start changing water every three days if your ammonia is high. This will not hinder the cycling as other people might suggest. As long as you use dechlorinated water; the beneficial bacteria don't live in the water - they are in the substrate and filter. Once the ammonia is at 0 you can decrease the number of water changes to once a week untill your nitrite levels are at 0 as well. Your nitrates should now be high and a few live plants would help keep these low and make the tank much easier to maintain. Still do partial water changes once a week but at least they are now not the only thing keeping your fish alive.

Never over-feed your fish, no matter how hungry they look, and vacuum parts of the substrate every time you do a water change (not all of it, just sections). Once the tank is cycled you may want to try rinsing out some of the filter media in your filter (if you think it necessary - it usualy isn't unless the flow is becoming weak). Use USED water from your tank (after a water change) ONLY and only rinse part of the media in this. Don't change the filter media unless it becomes incredibly clogged up and there is no other choice. Even then, only change part of it at any time. This way your beneficial bacteria should never all die out and cause a re-cycle and will have a chance to re-colonise deprived substrate/filter media etc.

Good luck!

 

[Fiori]

sorry - I did'nt explain myself very well. The tank has been going just over 3 weeks, with fish in it for about 12 days. I waited until the nitrite reached 0, which was 3 days ago, then did the 33%water change and cleaned the sand (surface only and minimal). I had done a water change a few days before as well, but only about 15%.

I ws'nt sure how often to change the water while I was treating the ich for the first time - the fish must have had it from the LFS, as I noticed the ones left in the tank there had it when I went back to check.

I'll follow your advice and do more water changes and check the water readings every day, as I've only been doing that every 3 days. I'll also see about taking the mollies back as well - I feel really attached to my plec tho - he's called Lemmy after the singer in Motorhead - ugly but strangely attractive

I know - weird!

Thanks for all your advice folks - much appreciated

 

[sylvia]

So your tank HAD cycled but you added too many fish at once and caused a re-cycle... The pleco will get huge for your tank - you will HAVE to return it (or get a much much larger tank) .

 

[WILDER]

Good luck once you have sorted your tank the hobby becomes a pleasure.

 

[Fiori]

Never had a problem with ammonia - has always read at 0 and I have a few live plants in the tank as well. Also been watching the amount of food and didnt give any for 36 hrs when treating the ich first time round. Usually feed twice a day and they gobble it up very quickly - theres not much goes to waste.

When I washed the filter, did a gentle clean in the siphoned off water, just to get rid of the gook clogging it. Also use Aqua+ to dechlorinate and Cycle to encourage bacteria growth, when I do a water change, but before I add to tank.

Can I only keep 2 fish in that size of tank? My LFS has not advised me well, is all I can say! Once I get to grips with this, I think I will need a bigger tank then - huh! they don't half con you out of money! I certainly don't want to lose any more fish - its heartbreaking and I feel so guilty. Tho I've had problems, I find the whole thing fascinating and been reading a lot - I really want to do my best for them.

Sylvia - thx especially for the comprehensive advice - appreciate the time and effort you've spent

 

[sylvia]

Do you mean you didn't have ammonia even at the very beginning? That is impossible Ammonia is the direct result of your fish's poop and must have been present at some point or you wouldn't have nitrites and your tank wont have cycled in the first place. Anyway, as long as it is alright now the fish wont mind the lack of ammonia

Unfortunately, that's the way most LFSs are Most of those in my area are like that too. I would never trust an LFS's advice - do your own research first.

Thanks BTW. I figured I should match your 10-page essay with one of my own

 

[Fiori]

well - I was a bad girl and did'nt start testing the water straight away ) LFS never mentioned testing and I bought a kit after doing some reading. Ths forum is great for advice - wish I'd found it earlier before I got my fish.

And there was DEFINITELY poop

Thx to everybody for advice - great site, great people