New betta at top of tank?

[Quin]

Hi there! I got a new male black orchid betta today and I'm super excited to have him! I'm also really nervous and maybe over-paranoid because yesterday I brought home the tiniest betta I'd ever seen, a veiltail female, but she did not make it past an hour. I believe it was completely user error, so I checked that my heater and filter were on and today I tested my water at PetSmart. They outlined the problem (our water was too far on one end of the pH spectrum, so I was taught why that is, how to fix it, and the best way to introduce my betta to a new tank) and I followed all everything they lined out for me and everything I've learned from following the betta community on tumblr. I'm still really really paranoid. I absolutely clicked with that female (she was so spunky!) and I can admit I cried when I realized she wasn't going to recover from her shock. I believe in providing the best home for animals, and I want to catch anything and everything before it can hurt another fish. This will NOT be a trial and error learning experience.

My male has been strong and healthy from when I got him at the store to when I brought him home. He has rested at times, but he has always been responsive to light changes and when I put my finger close to the glass. However, it has been a couple hours and he hasn't moved very far away from the surface of the water. A Google search said that my oxygen may be low so I'm hoping an adjustment to the placement of his waterfall filter will help, but if it's not that, I'm completely unsure what it may be. I assumed he would immediately hide in the log I have for him, but I don't think he's even looked at anything more than three inches from the waterline. Is this just his personality, or should I be worried? I don't want to lose another fish

Also, this is the first fish that has ever been my sole responsibility since I'm now old enough to be physically and financially responsible. If you have any tips, even if it's reinforcement to what I may have heard before, I would love to hear it! I picked betta because we've had several in the past (two that I was really old enough to pick out and help with) and I've heard that they're good, sturdy fish.

Tl;dr my betta has only been at the top of his tank, and though he seems healthy and responsive I don't want to overlook any problems and would love tips and help. Thank you!

 

[JuiceBox52]

Hi, I would love to see a pic of him and his tank. Orchid bettas are so pretty.
It is normal for bettas to hang at the top of the tank. They have an organ called the labyrinth organ that allows them to breath air from the surface of the tank. There is a problem if they seem to be constantly there or struggling to breath.

New fish may hide for a day after being added to a tank. This is normal unless it lasts for an unusual amount of time

Do you have a test kit? I would highly recommend getting one if you dont. The API master test kit is the best in the business. A test kit will help you identify any health issues and keep your water safe for your fish.

 

[Quin]

Hi, I would love to see a pic of him and his tank. Orchid bettas are so pretty.
It is normal for bettas to hang at the top of the tank. They have an organ called the labyrinth organ that allows them to breath air from the surface of the tank. There is a problem if they seem to be constantly there or struggling to breath.

New fish may hide for a day after being added to a tank. This is normal unless it lasts for an unusual amount of time

Do you have a test kit? I would highly recommend getting one if you dont. The API master test kit is the best in the business. A test kit will help you identify any health issues and keep your water safe for your fish.

Hi! Thank you for the info, I will be sure to monitor his breathing and actions. What do I do if he starts breathing heavy?

I don't have a test kit personally, but I did get the water tested and I can show you the printed out results if you'd like? I don't remember specific numbers for their pH tolerance but I know we were close to the extreme end of neutral, so his water was treated immediately when I got home. If you think this is a necessary investment for a healthy betta though, please tell me! I'm very new and would like to see my fish thrive!

As for pictures I have a few, but my camera has been having trouble focusing on him and not the water so they're not the best yet and are only close up, my apologies. As for his tank, if that's what you're asking, it's an old one I found and I had one petsmart employee say it was five gallons (yay!) and another say it was upwards of three (oh no!). He has three small moss balls and a small/medium leafy plant with an artificial log for a hide and about three inches of gravel at its deepest point (curved bowl).

This man here is my wonder! He has a black head fading into reflective dark blue with white fins edges! He's much more beautiful than any picture my phone could capture, so I believe i am after a better quality camera!

 

[JuiceBox52]

The numbers would be great. Are you aware of the nitrogen cycle? If you did not do a fish less cycle you will have to do a fish-in cycle.
Please don't use any PH adjusters. They dont work well and the chemicals can damage the fish.
@Byron @Deanasue

 

[Quin]

The report only had circled numbers on line and not exact values, so I'll give you those.
Ammonia - 0
Nitrate - 0
Nitrite - 0
Total Hardness - 0
Total Chlorine - 0
Total Alkalinity - 300
pH - (circle between 7.8 and 8.4)
The man at the store said that when the total hardness is zero it's usually supposed to have the opposite effect on either alkalinity or pH, but we decided that there might be something else in our water to combat it.

I have never heard of the nitrogen cycle and would definitely like to know everything I need to know about it!

I do not think we used a pH adjuster, but the worker at the store gave me his recommendation for a water treatment. The bottle says "Prime," subtitle "Removes chlorine," and also says "detoxifies ammonia, nitrate, and nitrite." It's label by the picture of the fish says "Seachem." I put about 7 drops in hours before introducing my fish to the water (with prior acclimation)

Edit: I saw him move down from the top of the water for a few inches before deciding to go back up. I also adjusted the placement of my filter slightly again and swirled my finger in the water in case it is an oxygen issue, but I didn't do too much in case the movement stresses him out. I may have to move the filter entirely so it is high enough to really oxygenate the water, but it is suction cupped on and every time I tried to move it before fish were added it came off with a lot of force. I can remove the betta temporarily to relocate the filter if necessary, because I don't want to risk hitting him when it comes off or sending him into shock or something from the movement

Also, I'm not sure if it's because something was said or if it is an issue, but I checked and double checked the gill movements of my betta. It's definitely faster than a human heartbeat, but I don't know if its fast because of their small size? Any reference to what betta breathing should be would be wonderful, as now that I've noticed it I can't stop seeing it. Thank you so much for the help, and I really hope that we can make sure my betta has a safe and healthy place to thrive.

 

[JuiceBox52]

@Colin_T or @Fishmanic can probably explain the nitrogen cycle better than me

 

[FishGuest5123]

Hi! If you didn’t cycle your tank first then you need to read this. https://www.fishforums.net/threads/cycling-your-new-fresh-water-tank-read-this-first.421488/. Get back to us after you read it. What size is your tank! If you can get Tetras Safe Start to help introduce bacteria into your tank it will help. Read the article first. We’re hear to help you.

 

[Quin]

Thank you so much for the article! I read through it all but I will have someone help me read it again tomorrow to make sure I didn't miss anything important! I have a slight reading disability so if there is any information that is urgent please let me know and I will be on it as soon as I can.

Do the test kits need to be acquired immediately? I live in a very rural area and (assuming they're less common, primarily fish care products) if the PetSmart doesn't have them then it will be a while before we will be able to find another pet store that carries them. If they are expensive then I may need to ask for money from my mom, as I dipped into gas money when purchasing the essentials for my new fish and might not be able to make another purchase for a little bit. If you have any safe and trustworthy yet in-budget kit reccomendations, especially if you have more than one option, that would be an absolute lifesaver. I never knew there were this many variables!

I do not know that a fish out cycle will be possible as our house is cold and he would not make it long without a heater (in a cold snap locally and our furnace keeps breaking down). I will definitely be reading the article again with help tomorrow but I did not see any instructions on how to do a fish-in cycle. Do you have any articles on that, or any tips on how to safely store my betta until a fish-out cycle has finished?

Truthfully, I would not have gotten this betta at all if I hadn't wholeheartedly believed this tank was 5 gallons at least. Two different employees have given me two different answers as to what size they believe it is, and I'm now not so sure what to think. I can send pictures with something to show reference to scale if you'd like. I have seen different minimums of 5 gallon, 3 gallon, and even 2.5 gallon, but I would prefer an outside opinion on whether or not my tank is the right size for my fish and if I need to ask around for a bigger tank.

I looked up videos of fast betta breathing and found one of a betta lying on its side breathing really rapidly. My fish is not breathing anywhere near that fast, but I'm still going to search for references to healthy betta breathing and keeping an eye on him. For reference, I thought of how when you're pumping someone's chest you have to sing the chorus of Staying Alive by ABBA and sung it in my head, but his breathing was a little slower than the bpm. Is that good?

 

[Barry Tetra]

@Colin_T or @Fishmanic can probably explain the nitrogen cycle better than me

Cycle Your Tank


There is a way to get rid of ammonia and nitrite completely by Cycle a tank, cycle a tank is when you put ammonia and nitrite down to 0 by using nitrosomonas bacteria to "eat" ammonia and turn them to nitrite then another bacteria name nitrobacter and nitro spira will "eat" nitrite and turn them to nitrate, you can speed up the process by buying the ‘bacteria bottle’ I would recommended tetra safe start.

 

[Quin]

Cycle Your Tank


There is a way to get rid of ammonia and nitrite completely by Cycle a tank, cycle a tank is when you put ammonia and nitrite down to 0 by using nitrosomonas bacteria to "eat" ammonia and turn them to nitrite then another bacteria name nitrobacter and nitro spira will "eat" nitrite and turn them to nitrate, you can speed up the process by buying the ‘bacteria bottle’ I would recommended tetra safe start.

Would tetra safe start be the only thing I need to add? If so that sounds a lot more simple than I was psyching it up to be, and honestly a little more reassuring since I don't want to mess up readings and measurements and putting bacteria in tanks? I can definitely definitely do my research on this, but I don't think I've ever heard of cycling before today, nor have we ever done it with any of our fish. I anticipate it will be necessary and will probably do it regardless either way, but it's interesting to learn about all of these new things. I know "hindsight" and all that, but now that I know so much more I really wish I would have waited to bring either of the fish home until I had talked to you guys on here and done everything that needed to be done to prepare the tank. I really appreciate all of you for offering you advice!

 

[Carolyn N]

Quin, here is the formula for calculating the gallons of your tank. Multiply the height times the length times the width divided by 231 = gallons. Veery close.

 

[Quin]

Quin, here is the formula for calculating the gallons of your tank. Multiply the height times the length times the width divided by 231 = gallons. Veery close.

It's possible my measurements were off, but using inches I got 1.7. I'm willing to accept this as the answer, but visually I believe I could fit more than two gallons of water in the tank and would appreciate a second opinion.

Also, I completely forgot that I started online classes today. It is almost midnight for me and I need to go to bed, so I will stay on a little longer in case anyone notices anything urgently necessary to know for my fish's health and safety, otherwise I will be back on once school has finished! Thank you so much guys

 

[FishkeeperLinz]

Thank you so much for the article! I read through it all but I will have someone help me read it again tomorrow to make sure I didn't miss anything important! I have a slight reading disability so if there is any information that is urgent please let me know and I will be on it as soon as I can.

Do the test kits need to be acquired immediately? I live in a very rural area and (assuming they're less common, primarily fish care products) if the PetSmart doesn't have them then it will be a while before we will be able to find another pet store that carries them. If they are expensive then I may need to ask for money from my mom, as I dipped into gas money when purchasing the essentials for my new fish and might not be able to make another purchase for a little bit. If you have any safe and trustworthy yet in-budget kit reccomendations, especially if you have more than one option, that would be an absolute lifesaver. I never knew there were this many variables!

I do not know that a fish out cycle will be possible as our house is cold and he would not make it long without a heater (in a cold snap locally and our furnace keeps breaking down). I will definitely be reading the article again with help tomorrow but I did not see any instructions on how to do a fish-in cycle. Do you have any articles on that, or any tips on how to safely store my betta until a fish-out cycle has finished?

Truthfully, I would not have gotten this betta at all if I hadn't wholeheartedly believed this tank was 5 gallons at least. Two different employees have given me two different answers as to what size they believe it is, and I'm now not so sure what to think. I can send pictures with something to show reference to scale if you'd like. I have seen different minimums of 5 gallon, 3 gallon, and even 2.5 gallon, but I would prefer an outside opinion on whether or not my tank is the right size for my fish and if I need to ask around for a bigger tank.

I looked up videos of fast betta breathing and found one of a betta lying on its side breathing really rapidly. My fish is not breathing anywhere near that fast, but I'm still going to search for references to healthy betta breathing and keeping an eye on him. For reference, I thought of how when you're pumping someone's chest you have to sing the chorus of Staying Alive by ABBA and sung it in my head, but his breathing was a little slower than the bpm. Is that good?

First of all, yes you need a test kit, ASAP. Many of us use the API Master liquid test kit. You can get it in store, but it's often cheaper online - eBay is your friend. It will set you back roughly $30, but it'll last month's, and in terms of your fish's welfare, it's worth its weight in solid gold. Especially as you'll be doing a fish-in-tank cycle.

In a fishless cycle, the fishkeeper (you), have to physically add a source of ammonia (household ammonia, or fish food), to the tank to simulate fish and heir bioload (waste). You'll then test every day until ammonia and nitrite peak, and then fall back down to 0ppm. A water change to bring down nitrate, and you're good to go. It takes anywhere from 2-6 or 7 weeks, on average, but you have the freedom to whack the temperature up to 30°c which speeds things up. You can also just let the filter do its thing and only need to intervene if ammonia and nitrite get too high.

With a fish-in-tank cycle, there's no need to add ammonia to the tank, because the fish does it for you. The problem is, ammonia and nitrite are toxic to fish, and will kill the fish if left unchecked, so the priority changes. You don't have the freedom to whack the temps up, because you have to keep things within the fish's biological range, and you can't let ammonia or nitrite get to the same!r levels as you would in a fishless cycle (3-4ppm). The priority is on the fish, and his health, so you're going to need to carry out daily water changes until ammonia and nitrite fall to 0ppm. Seachem Prime will help keep ammonia and nitrite away from the fish but it does not take the place of daily water changes. You need to be changing about 30% every day - more if ammonia or nitrite reach 1ppm.

Safe Start can help by giving you an initial colony of bacteria for your filter, but I doubt it would allow for an instant cycle, so you will still have to carry out the daily testing and water changes.

Eta: Fish-out is a fishless cycle, and would involve taking the fish back to the store.

 

[vanalisa]

I would go back to the fish store and make arrangements to switch to a bigger tank. If they won't help you get a manager.
Tell her that you were ill-advised by staff and would like to return the tank they sold you for one better suited for your betta's longer fins.

(Also, bowls disorient fish; so I've heard)!

Or, just go ahead and get a 5 gallon, set it up, get your little buddy in there, clean and dry what they sold you, take it back and get a refund.

They should not give you any grief as you will be most likely buying a more expensive tank. It may seem hard but you can do it.

Buy a 5 gallon, it makes a difference: do it not only for your Betta but for yourself. You will enjoy watching him swimming in a bigger tank and he will be able to get great exercise and dive for pellets!

Get that bigger tank, get it set up, and enjoy looking at your study-buddy when you need a break from class! ☆☆☆
PS Make it easy and get a kit set up.
It usually has tank, internal filter, and lid with lighting. You will still need a heater.

 

[Naughts]

If the bowl is only 1.7 gallons it wont be possible to maintain the cycle. Instead do 100% water change every 2 days. Make sure you dechlorinate the new water. Obviously a bigger tank is better if you can manage it.
Use a measuring jug to check the volume of the bowl.