I'm Getting Worried...

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t1tanrush

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Nope, you can use live fish if you want, I don't mind about that.
It's your combination of ignorance and willingness to 'help' others that concerns me.
I am also concerned about your frog, but that's really your responsibility so do what you want, just don't advise others to do the same.
Your opinion is no more correct than mine. I have every right to give advice on what has worked for me. Your advise is not better than mine. I will continue to share what has worked for me, and just because you disagree, doesn't make me wrong. Who died and made you king?
No you are advising others to buy sickly store bought feeders, your advice really is wrong.
No, I'm saying the majority of feeders are not sickly, and that they shouldn't be avoided all together. My advice is wrong in your opinion, and mine differs. If you want to give me a study that surveyed a large number of feeders to find the numbers of sickly fish, then I'll agree, but for now, its an opinion, back by no facts.

facts.. and someones opinion... are 2 very different things.

titan obviously doesn't understand that
Stop trolling me? Thought you ignored me? Get out of my face.
 

andywg

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The problem with your advice, t1tanrush, is that you are not just stating "This is what has worked for me". You state your experiences are the absolute: "You should feed live fish as it improves their quality of life" rather than "Feeding live fish appears to have improved my frog".

If you had worked with many frogs and studied their diet and biology and the effects of many other factors, then you would be in a position to make such definitive statements about what is and isn't best for the frog. Having kept one and trying to draw conclusions down across an entire species from that one observation is not best practice.
 
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Fate2006

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Okay... first off, t1tan... THANK YOU your information has been very helpful, and I've got him to eat (only 2 small) fish... now as for all of the bloody shrews out there arguing on this thread about the practice of feeding live fish, heres an idea... if you have no idea what your talking about then just hush up! There now doesn't that make alot more sense? T1tan told me what worked for his frog, that was what he observed and what worked for him... also threefingers, you said "it's what you THINK worked"... well clearly if it did work, than it was proven to work and therfore DID work...

Once again thank you for the help T1tan and anybody else who did not argue about feeding live fish...


PS... I'm certain that if you were to ask a moderator if they feed live fish to their big agressive fish, they'd tell you "Yes", so don't look down on people who do this... it's our risk not yours...
 

three-fingers

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t1tanrush said:
No, I'm saying the majority of feeders are not sickly, and that they shouldn't be avoided all together. My advice is wrong in your opinion, and mine differs. If you want to give me a study that surveyed a large number of feeders to find the numbers of sickly fish, then I'll agree, but for now, its an opinion, back by no facts.
My opinion is based on all the feeders I've seen in stores around me, with visible parasites and deformities, all the info I've read on feeders elsewhere, and the numerous people I have spoken to who have had trouble with them.
As I said, you are likely to be just lucky in that you have a good supply of feeders, and Fate2006 breeds his own so there is no risk (well, less risk you your case) of introducing disease/parasites.

The reason I got into this was Fate2006 said:
ACFs need live food to suppliment their diets
Which is clearly not true.

t1tanrush said:
The frog doesn't NEED live food. HOWEVER, live food GREATLY improves the quality of life of the frogs, and their growth.
Which is an opinion he is stating as a fact, and the part about the growth was just silly. If he had said "My frog appears to have grown faster" or something like that, it would have been OK.

He also so said:
These frogs if fed strictly on pellets become boring, simply moving to grab the floating pellets once an awhile, and can EASIlY go underweight.
Which not only depends what you consider 'boring', but is at best an exaggeration. It depends heavily on the pellets, and also on the health of the frog. For example, the frog could have a flatworm introduced from feeder fish and that's why it was going underweight so easily ;) (joking here, don't kill me).
But if you have a healthy frog, and the right food (doesn't have to be feeder fish) then the frog will NOT go underweight anywhere near that easily.

Though I do agree that these pellets are a bad staple, and feeding feeder fish as a SUPPLEMENT every now and then (say once a week a couple of fish) will benefit the frog.

if you have no idea what your talking about then just shut the hell up! There now doesn't that make alot more sense?
That's funny...we have no idea what we are talking about, when you were the only one here who stated that apparently ACF's NEED live food. Also, you were the one with the problem in the first place, and were originally trying to help.
If it wasn't for an intervention, someone could read this thread and come away with the impression that they need to eat live foods.
They would then either be put off ACF's, or start feeding them store bought feeders, which at least frequently carry diseases and parasites.
Also 3 fingers your an idiot... you said "it's what you THINK worked"... well clearly if it did work, than it was proven to work and therfore DID work...
Thanks for that..... "Nope, what your doing is posting advice to do what you think has worked for you" means that he is posting advice and telling people that it has worked (past-tense) for him, when it actually only appears to him to be working (present tense), and only so-far.
He has no proof that it's working other than his own observations, and in the long run there could be dire consequences (in my opinion, there is very likely to be).

PS... I'm certain that if you were to ask a moderator if they feed live fish to their big agressive fish, they'd tell you "Yes", so don't look down on people who do this... it's our risk not yours...
I would once again just like to make it clear, that I have no problem with people feeding live fish, as long as they are doing so safely.
And even if I did have something against people feeding live fish, I probably wouldn't care weather or not the moderators did it or not.

P.S.....I'm certain that if you were to ask a moderator if store bought feeders usually carry parasites and disease, they'd tell you "Yes".
P.P.S....I'm certain that if you were to ask a moderator if ACF's need live fish, or even if live fish is really as beneficial as it is made out to be in this thread, they'd tell you "No" :p .
 

~T~

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Okay... first off, t1tan... THANK YOU your information has been very helpful, and I've got him to eat (only 2 small) fish... now as for all of the bloody shrews out there arguing on this thread about the practice of feeding live fish, heres an idea... if you have no idea what your talking about then just shut the hell up! There now doesn't that make alot more sense? T1tan told me what worked for his frog, that was what he observed and what worked for him... Also 3 fingers your an idiot... you said "it's what you THINK worked"... well clearly if it did work, than it was proven to work and therfore DID work...

Once again thank you for the help T1tan and anybody else who did not argue about feeding live fish...


PS... I'm certain that if you were to ask a moderator if they feed live fish to their big agressive fish, they'd tell you "Yes", so don't look down on people who do this... it's our risk not yours...
It wasn't a question on ethics, im not a peta freak. Its more of the risk factor of feeding store bought feeder, its not something I would risk and I would advise others not to either. At the end of the day though I couldn't give a rats ass what you feed your fish as like you said its your risk.But its the fact that you and titan seem to think its ok to tell others its ok to do so(which as you say yourself, is taking a risk).
 

vancouver

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In the future then, pm t1tan with your ''questions''.. you don't want to take the advice of anyone intelligent.. so don't waste anyones time.
 

Inchworm

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I've considered closing this thread, but since a moderator's opinion has been asked for, I'll give you mine.

At present, I'm caring for seven ACFs that were stunted by someone who provided them with neither adequate space to grow nor an adequate diet. These frogs are several years old but did not know enough to eat live guppies when I put some in their tank. The bulk of their diet now consists of frozen blackworms and they appear more healthy and "filled out" then they did when I first got them and they existed on pellets and dry food alone.

It's always a risk adding a new fish to a tank, and perhaps more so when feeder fish are used as part of another creature's diet. I would suggest taking care to feed only ones that at least appear healthy. Remember, they are going into a frog tank, not a community tank. ACFs are relatively tough creatures to kill. On the other hand, frozen bloodworms are good protein food too, and live earthworms may also be given.

Some of the biggest and healthiest ACFs I know of are a pair of females who were raised almost entirely on live blackworms. The owner was squeamish about feeding live fish and settled for the worms instead. It worked out well for her.
 

~T~

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Earthworms are a great food for them, readily available and packed with protine.Reptomin is good as a dry pellet food as its high in calcium but would not be good as a staple diet.
 

t1tanrush

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In the future then, pm t1tan with your ''questions''.. you don't want to take the advice of anyone intelligent.. so don't waste anyones time.
Lol. he asked a question, some answered. Because you disagree its wrong and not intelligent. As for saying I'm not intelligent, I would suggest finding who your speaking to before making such a statement.

I've considered closing this thread, but since a moderator's opinion has been asked for, I'll give you mine.

At present, I'm caring for seven ACFs that were stunted by someone who provided them with neither adequate space to grow nor an adequate diet. These frogs are several years old but did not know enough to eat live guppies when I put some in their tank. The bulk of their diet now consists of frozen blackworms and they appear more healthy and "filled out" then they did when I first got them and they existed on pellets and dry food alone.

It's always a risk adding a new fish to a tank, and perhaps more so when feeder fish are used as part of another creature's diet. I would suggest taking care to feed only ones that at least appear healthy. Remember, they are going into a frog tank, not a community tank. ACFs are relatively tough creatures to kill. On the other hand, frozen bloodworms are good protein food too, and live earthworms may also be given.

Some of the biggest and healthiest ACFs I know of are a pair of females who were raised almost entirely on live blackworms. The owner was squeamish about feeding live fish and settled for the worms instead. It worked out well for her.
If course the best fish to feed are the healthy ones, all fish that are visibly ill are fed to the snake who isn't in as much of a risk. I've done that a few times, however I think the idea that all store bought feeders being horribly sickly etc is a bit uneducated, and I have a problem with people running around claiming that its such a huge risk to a frog. These frogs are incredibly hardy, I read an account of a lady who kept one in a gallon of water and changed the water once or twice a year, feeding it a little a day. It lived something like 8 years.. I'll have to give the worm thing a try sometime.
Say inchworm, what size tank would you say for an ACF to reach its full siz?, since you have stunting knowledge.
 

andywg

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PS... I'm certain that if you were to ask a moderator if they feed live fish to their big agressive fish, they'd tell you "Yes", so don't look down on people who do this... it's our risk not yours...
I think you will find if you ask CFC what he feeds his big preds it does not constitute live fish at all. I know, becauase I have seen him feed them. There are a couple of fish that he feeds live feeders to, but these are fish that absolutely refuse to eat anything but feeders.

And man Fate, you have been banned once already for getting childish and using bad language when a thread doesn't go exactly how you want it to. Grow up!
 
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