How Things Have Changed.

[fish481]

I am doing it the "old" way

That's called fish-in cycling. Not 'the old way', it's only the old way cause previously fish in cycling was the only well known method.

I just wonder .....

Could it be that the modern way of fishkeeping is because you all seem to be using small internal/external filters? They might be more delicate than three inches of gravel, and two strong powerhead pumps? I don't really like the look of filters in a tank.

Has nothing to do with the filters... so long as you have enough filter media to have space for a large enough bacterial colony then it has nothing to do with anything.
We recommend fishless cycles as it make significantly more sense than fish-in. Fish-in almost always requires massive daily water changes and twice daily testing for the first few weeks. It also exposes the fish to ammonia and nitrite un neccesarily.

Weekly water changes are done because if you look at the statistics they show that weekly water changes = best results. Ie. fish spawn, live longer, show brighter colours, don't get ill as often.

The 'old way' is not the best way. The best way, regardless of when it was 'developed' is the one that firstly has the greatest success rates, and then following that one that also suits the fish keeper.
No one should stick to 'old ways' because they can't move with the times, but so long as the equipment is still capable (which it certainly should be... although where you managed to find an under gravel filter I don't know...) , then who cares.
I certainly don't envy you doing a fish in cycle though.

thers nothing wrong with under gravel filters they work as good as any.

 

[ChilliPepper]

They wouldn't put it on the label if it didn't neutralise the metals. If we disbelieve everything on these labels, then how do we know they really dissolve the chlorine/chloramine? The makers of these products have to go through testing to actually get on our shelves. I think they can be trusted. Also, waterdrop lives in the U.S. I believe, so their water may be different.

As long as you are using a good dechlor, I really see no wrong in using water from the hot tap. I always have, to no ill effects, and always will. It would take ages boiling the kettle everytime

I use this one http/www.seapets.co.uk/products/aquarium-supplies/fish-treatments/tropical/freshwater-conditioners/dechlorinators-for-new-water/nutrafin-aquaplus-250ml.html?ref=googlebase and have recently started using this http/www.seapets.co.uk/products/pond-supplies/pond-treatments/pond-water-conditioners/tetra-pond-aquasafe-250ml.html as it works out much cheaper.

 

[kaivalagi]

thers nothing wrong with under gravel filters they work as good as any.

Maybe your right, just a shame you can't use sand....so much nicer to see fish in a sand substrate tank IMHO, they behave far more naturally. Examples being eartheaters/cory etc sifting for food

They wouldn't put it on the label if it didn't neutralise the metals. If we disbelieve everything on these labels, then how do we know they really dissolve the chlorine/chloramine? The makers of these products have to go through testing to actually get on our shelves. I think they can be trusted. Also, waterdrop lives in the U.S. I believe, so their water may be different.

As long as you are using a good dechlor, I really see no wrong in using water from the hot tap. I always have, to no ill effects, and always will. It would take ages boiling the kettle everytime

I know where you are coming from, that was my initial take on things too...I just took the cautious approach after discussions with WD that's all...worked out fine in the end too

I think it would be a good thing to discuss in the scientific section where experiments can be done to make sure manufacturers claims are true, that's where I would have taken my findings had I tested +ve for copper in my hot water...

 

[ChilliPepper]

I think there is a chance that people can have metals in their water, which is why the tap water conditioners contain compounds to neutralize it just in case

 

[Curiosity101]

thers nothing wrong with under gravel filters they work as good as any.

I never said there was anything wrong with under gravel filters... Not in terms of their filtration capabilities anyways. All I said was I'm shocked the OP managed to find one, they're not easily sourced from most shops.

I only said I don't like them cause they're messy, you can risk a mini cycle if you do a thorough clean of the substrate and you can't use sand. But having said that... I said that right at the beginning of the thread.

 

[AlanTh]

Curiosity101.

I'm not sure what books you have been reading, but I would throw them all away. Your advise here certainly does not come from experience (if you have any at all it isn't a great deal of it).

I have just "cycled" a tank in under 20 days. How do you explain that? Eight fish in - all healthy - zero readings on the Nastys - Nitrate fine.

I know how I did it. I didn't use small (disposable and expensive) sponges. Three inches of gravel. Two powerhead pumps.

Please stop trying to teach people that know better than you how to suck eggs.

 

[-Craig-]

I normally order fish online, if its a Exotic fish that are hard to track down, then its the internet, if its common like Guppies, Platies, Tiger barbs, ect, then i just get them at my LFS, every month or two its guaranted that it would be a package with Fish in lol, before, you would get them from your LFS, now its the internet and LFS. I like these days.

 

[BethK]

Curiosity101.

I'm not sure what books you have been reading, but I would throw them all away. Your advise here certainly does not come from experience (if you have any at all it isn't a great deal of it).

I have just "cycled" a tank in under 20 days. How do you explain that? Eight fish in - all healthy - zero readings on the Nastys - Nitrate fine.

I know how I did it. I didn't use small (disposable and expensive) sponges. Three inches of gravel. Two powerhead pumps.

Please stop trying to teach people that know better than you how to suck eggs.

She is not teaching anyone how to 'suck eggs', Curiosity has the scientific upper hand,to those in the hobby she's given some great advice and is very appreciated on this forum.

Things have changed over the years, a better understanding of water chemistry and the biology of it all, has given us the chance to raise/keep much healthier fish and given the step up to breeding better strains.

You have made a public post, asked questions but if the answer is not to your liking, you will deny it.

Please respect the advice of others, instead of making tedious insults and accept the fact that times have changed.

 

[Tolak]

I stand corrected. Although I wouldn't run a 100 Ltr + tank with air pumps.

The tubs might say 568 Liter, at 150 gallons they probably do;

Don’t buy cheap pumps;

You can run as large a tank as you want on air, as long as you have enough air. This includes tubs.

I am getting ready to add fish to my new tank now. Just a couple.

I am doing it the "old" way

I just wonder .....

Could it be that the modern way of fishkeeping is because you all seem to be using small internal/external filters? They might be more delicate than three inches of gravel, and two strong powerhead pumps? I don't really like the look of filters in a tank.

We will see what happens ..

In my neck of the woods we all run large box & sponge filters;

We all run a lot of tanks, my buddies & I, we all aren’t into delicate in any way. If it doesn't work it goes away.

What do you think about the "old ways" compared to what you all seem to do these days?

What do I think? Use the best of both. Many of the old ways are still viable & efficient ways of doing things, coupled with the ever-increasing knowledge science has to offer gives you the best of both. But….

Curiosity101.

I'm not sure what books you have been reading, but I would throw them all away. Your advise here certainly does not come from experience (if you have any at all it isn't a great deal of it).

I have just "cycled" a tank in under 20 days. How do you explain that? Eight fish in - all healthy - zero readings on the Nastys - Nitrate fine.

I know how I did it. I didn't use small (disposable and expensive) sponges. Three inches of gravel. Two powerhead pumps.

Please stop trying to teach people that know better than you how to suck eggs.

You asked about what people think about the old ways, are given intelligent and thoughtful input. When it doesn’t agree with what you think you start flaming. You asked the question, right? If you didn’t want what people think why did you ask?

Flaming will not be tolerated on this forum. This isn’t old way or modern way; it’s the only way here.

I can cycle an empty & dry 40-gallon tank in under 20 minutes, it’s called cloning. That’s how long it takes to leisurely fill the tank with a hose, drop in a cycled sponge filter, heater and fish. You aren’t on to anything earthshaking with an under 20-day cycle. I’m certainly not on to anything new with cloning. Cycles measured in days may be part of the old way of doing things, though from some of the old timers I hang out with cloning has been around for decades.

 

[Inchworm]

I agree with Tolak on this. Click the link in my signature and take a look at my tanks. The larger ones are 55 gallons each and all of the tanks are run on little air pumps and old fashioned box filters.

As I've just posted earlier today, I have some F1 CW016s coming to me and will be cloning a tank for them once they have been shipped. By the time they arrive the next day, they will have a nicely cycled tank to go in. Do I trust this method of cycling? Absolutely!

BTW, if you haven't been keeping fish lately, you probably never heard of CW016s. They are a rare species of corydoras that were only discovered a few years ago. To date they have only been successfully bred by one person in the world. These are some of those young fish.

 

[AlanTh]

Curiosity101.

I'm not sure what books you have been reading, but I would throw them all away. Your advise here certainly does not come from experience (if you have any at all it isn't a great deal of it).

I have just "cycled" a tank in under 20 days. How do you explain that? Eight fish in - all healthy - zero readings on the Nastys - Nitrate fine.

I know how I did it. I didn't use small (disposable and expensive) sponges. Three inches of gravel. Two powerhead pumps.

Please stop trying to teach people that know better than you how to suck eggs.

She is not teaching anyone how to 'suck eggs', Curiosity has the scientific upper hand,to those in the hobby she's given some great advice and is very appreciated on this forum.

Things have changed over the years, a better understanding of water chemistry and the biology of it all, has given us the chance to raise/keep much healthier fish and given the step up to breeding better strains.

You have made a public post, asked questions but if the answer is not to your liking, you will deny it.

Please respect the advice of others, instead of making tedious insults and accept the fact that times have changed.

I never asked a "question". I made an introduction post - I mentioned UGF - she jumped and flamed.

 

[electropunk06]

What do you think about the "old ways" compared to what you all seem to do these days?

you may be mistaken there, sure looks like a question. lol