Help! Lethargic betta!!

[Newbie283]

Hi there,

I recently completed my first aquabid purchase--a gorgeous big fin koi half moon male that came from Thailand. I unboxed him Thursday evening, he wasn't dead but arrived with a good bit of his tail fin missing. I couldn't tell if it was fin rot or if he was tail nipping during shipping because of stress. Either way there was some pink color in the rotted parts and some melting starting to occur. I had planned to temporarily keep him in a new uncycled 3.5 gallon until his permanent 10 gallon finished cycling (which happened 2 days after I got him!!!) But I kept him in the 3.5 so I could dose him with API fungus cureto kill off any bacteria. I've had him in there for about 4 days now with daily 100% water changes. Temp is 80 and while I have the filter running for aeration the carbon cartridge is out because of the medicine. He had 2 days of regular dosing and then per API instructions he has a double dose for the past 2 days. I've noticed his fins starting to have some new growth on the chewed up ends so hopefully he recovers.

Onto the current problem-
Last night I did his usual water change, I always temp match the water and dose with prime. I use api master test kit and know my tap contains nothing in it. Since arrival he has been happily swimming around (I doubt he's ever been in a tank that big his entire life) eating and pooping fine. But I woke up this morning to him just laying limp in his silk plant. I tried to get him to move which he did but he's just been laying either at the bottom or in his plant, his gills not even moving. He did eat but needed some encouraging. Does anyone have any ideas on what's going on with him? I had to go to work so I hurried up and put him in a cup, gave him another 100% WC and even spraying out the tank in case there was some debris stuck to the bottom and wascausing the new water to immediately gunk up or something. I had to go to work so I'm praying Idon't come home to a dead $100 betta...my only though is the stress of constantly being cupped to get his water chang3s every day. His 10 gallon is done cycling so today I have to scrub the algae and do a 100% WC but I really want to put him in yet because I plan to stock it tomorrow with some shrimp and Cory cats which id like to give them 24 hrs to get comfortable before I put him in.


***I should note that he's acting like my other betta mushu did when he had bad fin rot and nitrite poisoning from a fish in cycle 2hich the daily WC and fungus cure did wonders for him. Just wond3ring why my new betta seemed to get deathly ill over night. I'm not able to test the water because the fungus cure has green dyes in it.

 

[FroFro]

Hi there,

I recently completed my first aquabid purchase--a gorgeous big fin koi half moon male that came from Thailand. I unboxed him Thursday evening, he wasn't dead but arrived with a good bit of his tail fin missing. I couldn't tell if it was fin rot or if he was tail nipping during shipping because of stress. Either way there was some pink color in the rotted parts and some melting starting to occur. I had planned to temporarily keep him in a new uncycled 3.5 gallon until his permanent 10 gallon finished cycling (which happened 2 days after I got him!!!) But I kept him in the 3.5 so I could dose him with API fungus cureto kill off any bacteria. I've had him in there for about 4 days now with daily 100% water changes. Temp is 80 and while I have the filter running for aeration the carbon cartridge is out because of the medicine. He had 2 days of regular dosing and then per API instructions he has a double dose for the past 2 days. I've noticed his fins starting to have some new growth on the chewed up ends so hopefully he recovers.

Onto the current problem-
Last night I did his usual water change, I always temp match the water and dose with prime. I use api master test kit and know my tap contains nothing in it. Since arrival he has been happily swimming around (I doubt he's ever been in a tank that big his entire life) eating and pooping fine. But I woke up this morning to him just laying limp in his silk plant. I tried to get him to move which he did but he's just been laying either at the bottom or in his plant, his gills not even moving. He did eat but needed some encouraging. Does anyone have any ideas on what's going on with him? I had to go to work so I hurried up and put him in a cup, gave him another 100% WC and even spraying out the tank in case there was some debris stuck to the bottom and wascausing the new water to immediately gunk up or something. I had to go to work so I'm praying Idon't come home to a dead $100 betta...my only though is the stress of constantly being cupped to get his water chang3s every day. His 10 gallon is done cycling so today I have to scrub the algae and do a 100% WC but I really want to put him in yet because I plan to stock it tomorrow with some shrimp and Cory cats which id like to give them 24 hrs to get comfortable before I put him in.


***I should note that he's acting like my other betta mushu did when he had bad fin rot and nitrite poisoning from a fish in cycle 2hich the daily WC and fungus cure did wonders for him. Just wond3ring why my new betta seemed to get deathly ill over night. I'm not able to test the water because the fungus cure has green dyes in it.

I've told you once and I'm going to tell you AGAIN. You ordered a new betta before your current betta were completely healed from their ordeal. You then purchased a new tank after you purchased the betta with no gaurantee the ten gallon would be cycled in time. Before your new betta arrived and you planned to keep him in another UNCYCLED tank while the other one "finished cycling"! Not to mention the moment you put him in there you began to treat him with heavy medication in an uncycled tank after he endured weeks of being in the mail! His lethargy and hard time breathing is because he is too weak to swim to the surface for air and the medicine and higher temperature are making it hard for him to get oxygen.

Stress is the number one cause of illness in fish. Stress is what he's been through and now you are just putting icing on the cake. You need to do a 100% water change in the quarantine tank, or better yet put him in the ten gallon since you claim its completely cycled. You need to allow him to adjust to his new environment and water source (which I can promise you is totally different from water in Thailand!). Keep his lights off to reduce stress and keep testing your water to make sure it really is stable. If his fin rot persists and it isn't just fin biting you need to treat him with a combination of daily water changes and aquarium salt. This is the guide I used when I was new to the hobby and had the same problem with my first betta. http://bettasplendid.weebly.com/fin-rot-101.html. Follow it to the letter other than removing him from the 3.5 gallon as it is already a small enough tank to treat.

More knowledgable folks I'm sure will have more advice to offer if they feel the need to do so.

 

[Newbie283]

Thank

I've told you once and I'm going to tell you AGAIN. You ordered a new betta before your current betta were completely healed from their ordeal. You then purchased a new tank after you purchased the betta with no gaurantee the ten gallon would be cycled in time. Before your new betta arrived and you planned to keep him in another UNCYCLED tank while the other one "finished cycling"! Not to mention the moment you put him in there you began to treat him with heavy medication in an uncycled tank after he endured weeks of being in the mail! His lethargy and hard time breathing is because he is too weak to swim to the surface for air and the medicine and higher temperature are making it hard for him to get oxygen.

Stress is the number one cause of illness in fish. Stress is what he's been through and now you are just putting icing on the cake. You need to do a 100% water change in the quarantine tank, or better yet put him in the ten gallon since you claim its completely cycled. You need to allow him to adjust to his new environment and water source (which I can promise you is totally different from water in Thailand!). Keep his lights off to reduce stress and keep testing your water to make sure it really is stable. If his fin rot persists and it isn't just fin biting you need to treat him with a combination of daily water changes and aquarium salt. This is the guide I used when I was new to the hobby and had the same problem with my first betta. http://bettasplendid.weebly.com/fin-rot-101.html. Follow it to the letter other than removing him from the 3.5 gallon as it is already a small enough tank to treat.

More knowledgable folks I'm sure will have more advice to offer if they feel the need to do so.

Thank you again for the uninformed and extremely snarky response. Not to mention not helpful at all. My other fish is and has been healed from his "ordeal" and has been back in his 5 gallon for weeks. I'm simply waiting for fin regrowth. As for my new tank it IS COMPLETELY CYCLED and ready for fish for the past 3 days. Why is there a problem with me keeping a new fish in a quarantine tank? And why does it matter if the tank is cycled if it gets 100% water changes? And why would I medicate a cycled tank? Also I did not just plop my new betta in a fully dosed tank. He sat in the new tank for 24 hours before I put any medicine in it and also started with a half dose as well. If you were smart you would know my fish did not spend "weeks in the mail" he was in transit for 2 days then at the transhipper for 2 days and in the mail for 12 hours before I got him. He also doesn't have problems due to lack of oxygen. If you read the thread you would know that he just started acting weird half a day ago. You would also know that he is getting DAILY 100% water changes, and just got two in the last 12 hours. Thank you for turning me off to fish forums with your snarky know-it-all attitude. Not sure how you find your attitude helpful at all.

 

[FroFro]

Allow me to quote a previous post you made on January 6th of 2018 where you mention you only have about two weeks (18 days to quote your estimate) to cycle a tank before he arrives. This means if you started cycling your tank the same day you made this post and up to the current date of me writing this (January 29th by my calender) your tank has been running for only 23 days. This is also assuming you are following the cycling process correctly. I will post a link to your previous post to remind you to check yourself before you start slinging derogatory remarks at me. I am not intending to insult you, only to prove my point by showing you evidence for my arguments. Offense is not given, it is taken. Perceive my post as you wish, but don't disregard that offense is not my intent.

"I am starting a new 10 gallon low tech planted aquascape. I won an aquabid auction for the most GOREGOUS and unique half moon koi here is a picture for those who are curious:
https://ibb.co/dcH4hG
Since I am spending close to 100 dollars on this fish I'm hell bent on doing this cycle properly. I have about 18 days to get the tank cycled before he arrives in the mail however he well be out into the hospital tank for a few days upon arrival for monitoring."

The link to your post is here http://www.fishforums.net/threads/new-10-gal-seeking-cycle-advice.447295/

And a screen shot can be provided if you wish.

The tone of my previous post was not snarky, it was scathing. You failed to follow advice well enough the first time and your betta was sick.

I am not all knowing, but I do know a thing or two about betta. Not as well as a marine biologist or heck, even NickAu, but I DO KNOW that you shouldn't even entertain the idea of purchasing another animal while you were responsible for the illness of your first betta and were taking the steps to correct your error. You also didn't take advice on tank cycling and how important it is that you are READY for your betta when he arrives. I've also got plans in the works to make a divided ten gallon for two new betta I plan to rescue from the horrible petco down the road from me. Being ready means having all the tools, environment, and KNOWLEDGE up and ready to go so that if any problems arise you are well equiped to handle them.

I've been keeping used filter media running in a seperate filter on my main tank for when I am ready to kickstart the cycle of my ten gallon. I'm experienced in caring for sick betta that I acquire, as I am choosing to rescue two betta I know will need a lot lf TLC once I get them. You may find me scathing, you may choose to be offended, but you need to realize that coming onto a forum and asking for advice after you've been advised before any of this happened is going to grind some gears. Criticism is part of learning. I am trying to help you as I am concerned for the well being of your animals. Being ignorant in this hobby leads to a lot stress and loss for your tanks and YOU. Owning an animal; fish, dog, bird, you name it, is to put its well being above your own interests. Do you know how often I see beautiful betta on aquabid that I want to buy? I don't because I know my tank wouldn't be ready for them and that I would only cause them harm by not having the best possible environment for them the MOMENT that package was in my hands and opened.

I am asking you to follow my advice and use the treatment in the link provided. If I had no interest in helping your betta I would not have responded or included a link. A link that I've used in the past with success and that I trust to use again in the future. If I had no care for your betta I would've shrugged after reading your post asking for help again and not give a hoot if your betta died due to lack of knowledge on your part. I care about your betta just as I care for other member's sick fish and often check posts to see if any improvement is made. I'm not always able to offer help on things I'm not knowledgable on, but I do try to help when I am. In this case, it's you.

 

[Newbie283]

Allow me to quote a previous post you made on January 6th of 2018 where you mention you only have about two weeks (18 days to quote your estimate) to cycle a tank before he arrives. This means if you started cycling your tank the same day you made this post and up to the current date of me writing this (January 29th by my calender) your tank has been running for only 23 days. This is also assuming you are following the cycling process correctly. I will post a link to your previous post to remind you to check yourself before you start slinging derogatory remarks at me. I am not intending to insult you, only to prove my point by showing you evidence for my arguments. Offense is not given, it is taken. Perceive my post as you wish, but don't disregard that offense is not my intent.

"I am starting a new 10 gallon low tech planted aquascape. I won an aquabid auction for the most GOREGOUS and unique half moon koi here is a picture for those who are curious:
https://ibb.co/dcH4hG
Since I am spending close to 100 dollars on this fish I'm hell bent on doing this cycle properly. I have about 18 days to get the tank cycled before he arrives in the mail however he well be out into the hospital tank for a few days upon arrival for monitoring."

The link to your post is here http://www.fishforums.net/threads/new-10-gal-seeking-cycle-advice.447295/

And a screen shot can be provided if you wish.

The tone of my previous post was not snarky, it was scathing. You failed to follow advice well enough the first time and your betta was sick.

I am not all knowing, but I do know a thing or two about betta. Not as well as a marine biologist or heck, even NickAu, but I DO KNOW that you shouldn't even entertain the idea of purchasing another animal while you were responsible for the illness of your first betta and were taking the steps to correct your error. You also didn't take advice on tank cycling and how important it is that you are READY for your betta when he arrives. I've also got plans in the works to make a divided ten gallon for two new betta I plan to rescue from the horrible petco down the road from me. Being ready means having all the tools, environment, and KNOWLEDGE up and ready to go so that if any problems arise you are well equiped to handle them.

I've been keeping used filter media running in a seperate filter on my main tank for when I am ready to kickstart the cycle of my ten gallon. I'm experienced in caring for sick betta that I acquire, as I am choosing to rescue two betta I know will need a lot lf TLC once I get them. You may find me scathing, you may choose to be offended, but you need to realize that coming onto a forum and asking for advice after you've been advised before any of this happened is going to grind some gears. Criticism is part of learning. I am trying to help you as I am concerned for the well being of your animals. Being ignorant in this hobby leads to a lot stress and loss for your tanks and YOU. Owning an animal; fish, dog, bird, you name it, is to put its well being above your own interests. Do you know how often I see beautiful betta on aquabid that I want to buy? I don't because I know my tank wouldn't be ready for them and that I would only cause them harm by not having the best possible environment for them the MOMENT that package was in my hands and opened.

I am asking you to follow my advice and use the treatment in the link provided. If I had no interest in helping your betta I would not have responded or included a link. A link that I've used in the past with success and that I trust to use again in the future. If I had no care for your betta I would've shrugged after reading your post asking for help again and not give a hoot if your betta died due to lack of knowledge on your part. I care about your betta just as I care for other member's sick fish and often check posts to see if any improvement is made. I'm not always able to offer help on things I'm not knowledgable on, but I do try to help when I am. In this case, it's you.

Are you trying to tell me because my tank has been running for 23 days that it isn't cycled? Do I need to post pictures of my water parameters to get you to shut up? My tank processes 3ppms of ammonia in under 24 hours with 0ppms of nitrite showing 24 hours after ammonia dose. I did my fishless cycle by the book with ammonium chloride. It's extremely irritating that you continuously going back to my mushu fish, which is a moot point to argue with me because he's been healed up and back in his tank for weeks. How was I not prepared for my new betta? I had a perfectly acceptable quarantine tank set up for him and the transhipper also got confused and ended up keeping him for a few extra days which is why I got him with fin rot. My 10 gallon is cycled and my new betta has actually been there for the last 12 hours. It even has copepods swimming on the glass. I appreciate you trying to quote my own words and also again give me info on how you are SO PREPARED with your tanks which I didn't ask about and doesn't even pertain to my post. Your help isn't needed, because there was nothing wrong with my betta. He was being lazy and I over reacted. Every step I took was appropriate. I came home to him swimming around no clamped fins and flaring at his heater like usual. I'm not posting on this site anymore because you are that off putting. You aren't even giving advice just giving unsolicited criticism with an uncalled for self righteous attitude like my bettas are in awful shape and I don't take care of my fish. I have 3 established tanks and none of my fish are sick and none of them aren't getting proper care. I'm offended because you talk to me like I'm a 10 year old child that got my fish on an impulse and plopped them in a one gallon bowl with no heater or filter.

 

[FroFro]

I hope you learn to care for yuour betta properly and to put their well being above your own interests. Also, to get a tougher skin. Have a wonderful day.