Cycling Lecture

[jeff1969]

Hi. I'm a newbie - just bought and set up a 10 gallon tank for my 6 year old daughter's birthday present. Not knowing better I went to the pet store the day after setting up the tank with a water sample, hoping to pick up our first fish or two. The test showed ammonia and the guy recommended waiting several days and testing for ammonia levels prior to buying fish. After doing my research here and elsewhere it is obvious that cycling the tank to achieve optimal conditions is the preferred route to go. I personally could wait several weeks for this, but am not so sure about making my small children stare at an empty tank for that long. It seems that tropical fish will often live in less than perfect conditions in a tank and experioence some stress from time to time, so I am wondering if the perfect conditions are necessary prior to introducing the first fish to the tank. I understand that this thinking will probably bring the lecture that I alluded to in the subject of this post So, I guess these are my questions:
- will ammonia currently in the water trigger bacteria growth over several days? Would that potentially make the tank less than deadly? I hear of people introducing a couple of "hearty" fish immediately to set the process in motion, which I don't want to do.
-Will the ammonia eventually drop off enough naturally over a few days without going through weeks of cycling? Is it really "all or nothing" in terms of cycling - perfect conditions or don't introduce fish?
It just seems like many people set the tank up, put in fish and things eventually level off with regular testing and water changes.
Thanks in advance for any advice.

 

[Tolak]

What you're considering doing would be a traditional cycle with fish. It is tough with younger kids, they sure don't want to look at an empty tank for weeks, probably seems like years to them.

The tank will cycle, regardless of methods, if there is a source of ammonia. If fish are the source there are a few things you can do to have some fish in there, and maintain a happy household. First, for stocking, you want to start with no more than one inch of hardy slim bodied fish that grow to no larger than 3 inches per 5 gallons of tank space. This is when you want to consider the final stocking, and how these initial fish will fit into that plan.

Plan on getting a liquid test kit, the most often suggested is the API Master kit. You will be doing large frequent water changes, most probably daily, and for several weeks. If you can get some mature filter media from another tank this will shorten the time, with enough media it will be for all practical purposes an instant cycle.

Plan on feeding lightly, less food means less waste produced. Having had younger kids this probably means hiding the food, kids love to feed all animals, and will feed them most anything, been there! You could probably involve them at looking at the final stocking, decorations & so on to keep their mind off of feeding their new pets.

Keeping an eye on water test results, changing water when needed, and limiting feeding will result in a relatively safe cycle, while minimizing the chance of any losses. We don't want to see any fish harmed, or fish deaths, I'm sure your kids don't want to see this either.

We do have a list of members who donate mature filter media, found here; http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?/topic/150631-list-of-members-willing-to-donate-mature-filter-media-to-newbies/

While some members may be inactive, there are other active members who donate mature media, which can be shipped if need be. Just be aware that with a traditional cycle there will be more work, most often heavy buckets of water. If you don't mind the extra work there is no reason for it not to end up with success.

 

[FishFanatic04]

I have been through a fish-in cycle...but I bought my fiss before I knew about it. Luckily I found out the same day and was prepared. You are certainly in the right direction by researching.

No lecture from me either. A fish-in cycle is very possible, especially on a 10 gallon. I did mine on a 46g and had to do TWO 96% water changes a day to keep the ammonia and nitrite below .25 ppm. On a 10g that will be easy as pie. I would suggest, along with a test kit, for you to get a water siphon. Mine has a bulb that you squeeze which starts the water flowing out. It helps me do the water changes much easier, I have two buckets so while one is filling, I can dump the other.

If you keep the water levels safe, then you should be fine. The good thing is that your daughter is 6, which means you can explain the process to her and have her help you with every step, including comparing test results. My son is only 3 and while I think he is a mini genius he doesn't understand a lot of what goes on with the fish tanks so far.

 

[jeff1969]

Just be aware that with a traditional cycle there will be more work, most often heavy buckets of water. If you don't mind the extra work there is no reason for it not to end up with success.
[/quote]
Thanks. Your response does not sound nearly as gloom and doom as I expected to hear from people

 

[jeff1969]

Does your 3 year old mess with the fish? My 3 year old has a mind of his own. My 19 month old pulled a chair over to the tank today and was trying to get her hands in it. I guess I need to buy tough fish

 

[FishFanatic04]

lol do you have 3 kids then? I have a 7 month old, and a "almost" 3 year old. My oldest is so smart though and does that...pulls his chair up and gets into everything. I keep the fish food very high up on a shelf. Fish are faster then his little fingers so thats a good thing. The hamster is fast too!

Good luck with your cycle however you do it. If you do get fish, just remember that all the extra daily effort will be worth it, and once the cycle is over you only have to change the water once a week. lol When my cycle was over after daily water changes for 5 weeks, I actually felt lazy because I only had to do them once a week

 

[Lufbramatt]

get some fish that bite back like certain types of cichlid. they will soon learn to not mess with the fish hehe. Scared the life out of me the first time I got bitten

 

[jeff1969]

If I were to go with a fish-in cycle, what would be some ideas for good fish to start with?

 

[FishFanatic04]

Platies are great. They are hardy and amusing for kids to watch.

 

[Curiosity101]

If I were to go with a fish-in cycle, what would be some ideas for good fish to start with?

FishFanatics suggestion is good, a couple of male guppies might also be a nice starting option if you want a colourful tank. It really does depend what you want in there in the end though. If you come up with a stock list then people could advise which would be the best to add first from what you want. Or if there isn't anything suitable on the list then give you a similar alternative.

If you were still considering a fishless cycle instead (links to both fishless and fish-in are in my signature if you'd like more information), then you could always distract the kids with planning what fish are going to go into the tank eventually? It would probably keep them busy for a little while.

Also you don't necessarily have to stick to fish, avoid aquatics crabs like the plague, but there are plenty of other freshwater inverts to choose from. Apple snails, shrimp (not for cycling with) and nerite snails spring to mind.

You could also consider getting some live plants growing before you put any fish in. Actively growing plants will help to remove a small amount of ammonia from the water which will can make the time between water changes easier on the fish.

 

[Bugdozer]

Curiosity, you suggest guppies but everything I have read about them says don't use them as starter fish due to being more inbred than a European royal family, leading to them being weak little things. Now I'm confused!

 

[Curiosity101]

It depends where you get the from to be honest. A good strong stock of guppies that haven't had to go through shipping and transport could be fine. It also depends on what conditions they were kept in at the store.

Aswell as that just cause something is inbred doesn't mean that it will definitely be weak. Some guppies have had a weakness bred into them, but just a few outcrossings can fix that without losing the colouration.

Generally speaking I don't find guppies to be high risk to a well managed fish in cycle.

 

[eaglesaquarium]

I have been through a fish-in cycle...but I bought my fiss before I knew about it. Luckily I found out the same day and was prepared. You are certainly in the right direction by researching.

No lecture from me either. A fish-in cycle is very possible, especially on a 10 gallon. I did mine on a 46g and had to do TWO 96% water changes a day to keep the ammonia and nitrite below .25 ppm. On a 10g that will be easy as pie. I would suggest, along with a test kit, for you to get a water siphon. Mine has a bulb that you squeeze which starts the water flowing out. It helps me do the water changes much easier, I have two buckets so while one is filling, I can dump the other.

If you keep the water levels safe, then you should be fine. The good thing is that your daughter is 6, which means you can explain the process to her and have her help you with every step, including comparing test results. My son is only 3 and while I think he is a mini genius he doesn't understand a lot of what goes on with the fish tanks so far.

I would say that little kids can actually be far more patient than we adults give them credit for. I did a fishless cycle with a huge tank with my son (he was 4 at the time). He asked for a tank, and I made him wait for that. Then we added some decor and started a fishless cycle. He lost interest in it for a while, but every now and then he would ask me if he could help test the water. I let him drop the test solutions into the tubes and then shake them up. He liked to see the liquids change colors. We spent a lot of time looking at fish in the fish stores. He liked EVERY fish he saw! We talked about why we couldn't get certain fish, and what fish would live happily together. It was fun for him to see all the different fish (and me too! ) and to learn about all the different aspects of fishkeeping that are necessary for success. He still doesn't know much (6 years old now), but he does understand that the fish need to be well cared for, and they need certain things. He helps me feed them, he still helps sometimes with the testing, and so on. But mainly, this is my tank. It is his in name only, as it is with most parents and pets, I believe. I wasn't about to let it fail, so I did a TON of research before I got started, and learned a great deal. He needs to get a lot more maturity before I even think of letting him take over.

 

[Alm0stAwesome]

In reference to the patience of small children, I saw a member on this forum say that they told their child that the fish was still in it's mommy's tummy and they would go to the pet store to look at "mommy and daddy" while they were waiting for the tank to cycle. I thought it was a cute idea that small children may buy into!

 

[Salam]

In reference to the patience of small children, I saw a member on this forum say that they told their child that the fish was still in it's mommy's tummy and they would go to the pet store to look at "mommy and daddy" while they were waiting for the tank to cycle. I thought it was a cute idea that small children may buy into!

That was me

It kept my son happy throughout the cycling process. We now have our puffer fish and he is well pleased with it.

I am also getting him involved with testing water. He loves seeing the colours change and he knows that ammonia should stay yellow and if it is green it is 'poorly water' and nitrites should be blue (API test obviously).

He also feeds them 'sweets' which is the bloodworm pellets. I wouldn't trust him with flakes, but the pellets is fine, he counts them out for each tank and then puts them in.

Kids learn very fast, don't underestimate their knowledge.