Time, please.

I recently retired early and couldn't wait to get the fish stuff out again. So it is partly that too, but mostly just my impulsive nature and getting too many ideas churning around in my head that I can't possibly execute all at once. :nod:
That's what I found helpful about joining this forum. All of the different sections about things I could read up on, and seeing peoples responses to topics on the daily updates board. Really good.
 
I see you, @Chickadee and I raise you a million projects... I retired (early) almost 6 years ago now. I thought I'd have more time, but somehow, the vacuum I expected was filled with the ability to do things my working hours either didn't allow, or didn't allow me to savour. I had tanks and enjoyed them, but I had to unlearn a little efficiency, and relearn just straight up enjoyment.

I had always done poorly with planted tanks. I had a set group of plants that thrived here, and that was that - unchanging. With retirement, I've been able to experiment a bit, and give more time to learning that side of the hobby. It's starting to bear fruit, and I'm becoming more and more pleased at what is happening in my tanks. I've slowly added trick after trick, to see what works.

We give and get a lot of advice here, and sometimes we lose track of the simple fact that the environment in tank A in country B can be radically different from tank C in country D, even if outwardly, they're the same. We may report the same water hardness and pH, but are those parts per million we quote the same minerals? I have 85 of something in my water, and my plants like it. If you have even a slightly different chemistry there, different plants sometimes thrive.

You'll find clashes of opinion here, different systems, crazy ideas and scientifically tested ones. We end up at opposites sometimes, but please bear with us as there are many ways to the same result. There are also plans and ideas that aren't good ones, and there you have to figure it out.
 
I didn't start by doing any type of cycling as I had fish before I had a tank - my teenaged sons won goldfish at the fair. Once they outgrew the tank we bought (within a year) we gave them away to someone with a pond and I bought a heater and tropical fish. My main tank has been upgraded a few times, always by transferring the filter and decor - no live plants for a few years just plastic then silk.

I have done a fishless cycle though on a small tank for a betta, just to see how TwoTankAmin's method worked. I felt I couldn't really help anyone if I hadn't done one myself. Yes, it is only the first step on the staircase; cycling with ammonia is just the beginning.

Plants can take a lot of patience when first trying them. At first every plant I tried died, then I discovered epiphytes - Java fern and a couple of species of anubias were the first plants I has success with. I still have epiphytes on wood. Later I had too much success - the hornwort I kept took over the tank in a tangled mess so it had to go. More recently I have have discovered cryptocorynes and have several species growing well, if slowly.
I have java fern and anubias, and also bought some hornwort (at least thats what I think it is, we just used to call it oxygenating plant in the 70's. ;-p I can always pull bits off and chuck it out when it gets a bit too much, or tether it in a place I want a bit of shade. I've also got water lettuce that I must get around to getting a suction loop for to stop it moving all over the surface everywhere. I want it in one place so it does not overshadow a lily bulb I have just left on the surface and a reddish plant that I would like to grow in the gravel substrate.

I am thinking of getting a second little tank to possibly get a betta for, but if I'm not careful, I will end up with the little filters that come with these.... can always keep them as secondary or spares I suppose. I'm using little sponge filters on the little tanks so can put cherry shrimps in. Too small for a betta in my opinion really at just 24 litres, although I do really like them.
 
Never cycled a tank once, I prefer to start with a heavily planted tank wait a few weeks and add a very small population of fish. As the tank and vegetation grow I add more fish. I suspect for some types of fish in might be better to cycle with ammonia first but haven't had an issue with the method I use. I do tend to keep the more robust fish so that might have a factor.
 
My names Tom, I am an impulse buyer.
My behavior is really pretty good now but I have a past and some of it was spontaneous~!
I was lucky enough to have many extra cycled filters when my fish room was running so additions were easy.
Every tank had several sponge filters and most also had HOBs [I love Aquaclears.]
Most everyone got their own tank so the sudden choice made at the LFS or auction was not a big risk for a tank.
I never did the ammonia thing but way back I cycled a marine reef tank with fish food like many do today with fresh water.
It wasn't perfect and took all of 30 days but the first fish introduced was placed in a cycled tank and lived.
Way way back I started doing fish in cycles for fresh water and had success.
You know how?
I learned to change water.
Fast forward 40 years I still change water.
Being a fish first person I found plants much harder to manage.
It took much longer for the level I thought I was at than I thought it would.
I am not a master plant keeper.
I'm a pretty good fish breeder though.
 
@Tomsfish - those of us with fishrooms can safely be impulse buyers. I do the same as you did - I have extra tanks and new fish go into them for what's often a permanent QT. The ugly side of impulse buying is the introduction of diseases when you have only only one tank. I tried never to buy fish the first time I saw them in a local store. I studied them, and then went back back a few days later to look closely again. If they were selling fast, then I'd jump. If not, I'd buy on the 3rd visit. Let the store quarantine for you, even if it is time consuming.
Now I'm 4 hours from a large fishstore, so that technique is out.
The elderly gentleman who taught me how to keep fish handed me a book with drawings and photos of common fish diseases and had me sit and study it. His store was a great one, but he said he had no control over what diseases and parasites could show up. He didn't sell sick fish, but when he got them, he'd get me to identify the disease based on the shelf of books behind the cash. It's been a valuable skill - I recommend all new fishkeepers learn what the common problems are and try to spot them.
My biggest concern with online ordering is you put your trust in a stranger with a profit motive, or with zero skills or interest in a dead end fish catching job.
Retirement budgets can help cure impulsive buying of fish stuff.
 
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I’ve never cycled an aquarium ever . I set ‘em up and put the fish in . It’s always worked . Many years ago I do remember having one aquarium that got cloudy and I did water changes until it cleared up . Just that once was the only time anything ever went goofy on me . I’ve never had any success with aquarium plants . I can kill them faster than Matt Dillon . Suits me , I like the fish better .
 
I love how people think they never cyled a tank or never used ammonia. Nothing could be farther from the truth. The term cycle a tank became used to mean adding ammonia to get there. But lets get something straight from the get go.

There are multiple ways ammonia gets produced in an aquarium. it is not limited to just adding it. Fish make ammonia, decaying organic matter makes ammonia and this include dying plant matter. Even dead microrganisms make ammonia. Soi if we want to keep living things surviving in a tank,, there must be a way to handle ammonia, Pretty much, all the plants we might put into tank come with the microorganisms which handle the nitrogen complex, living on them.

However, handling ammonia is what I consider the term cycling to mean. Live plants are very effective at handling ammonia because they love ammonium. However, they do not do so well with ammonia as NH3. If levels of ammonia get high enough your plants will die just like your fish will.

There is only one way not to :"cycle" a tank and have it be safe for the fish- big water changes almost daily. But consider nature where ammonia is also being created in bodies of water. Unless something deals with the ammonia, most living things would die from it. Nature is smarter than most fish keepers. It evolved methods for dealing with ammonia before there were people. It is done by both plants and microorganisms. And, just as the case in aquariums, it is possible for there to be mostly microrganisms when there are not plants or sufficient algae, which we mostly may not want in our tanks. However, many keepers do want some amount of algae.

How one goes about making as tank ammonia safe varies. What I do know is, no matter how many live plants one has in a tank, you still have some amount of microorganisms handling some of the ammonia. These want the real deal- NH3. Plants want NH4. In tanks with a pH low enough to make all the ammonia NH4, the bacteria can switch to using it but do so much less efficiently.

So no matter what one posts about not doing a cycle, they really are doing one just using a different method than just mocroorganisms. There is one big advantage to doing a fishless cycle without having any plants. When it is done, one can stock a tank completely all at once. Of course, there ae some fish which need an even more mature tank to thrive. Just because one can cycle a tank in a matter of days or weeks, this doesn't mean that this is what will ultimately be all that is needed in a tank to make it the best it can be for all species which have similar parameter tolerances/needs more time is needed for this.

While plants use NH4, they don't make nitrite or nitrate. That is the way the microorganisms work. and since there are always some amount of therse in even the most heavily planted tanks, there will be some amount of nitrite and nitrate created. The plants do not use nitrite but that do use nitrate, especially when ammonia is in short supply. In a heavily planted tank any nitrite created will almost instantly be converted to nitrate and then this is gobble up by the plants and is also instantly used up. So, in a heavily planted established tank one may never test any nitrate being present.

When I did my one high tech pressurized CO2 added planted tank, I used to add potassium nitrate among the other ferts I needed. In tanks with close to a neutral or higher pH there will be some amount of the ammonia in the form of NH3. There is no way around this. No matter how many plants one has they will not be using this. As they use the NH4 in such a tank some of the NH3 present will become NH4. the porblem is the NH3 will still exist if there is nothing to use it. Thankfully, there is assome amount of bacteria in all planed tanks and they will handle that NH3.

I stopped cycling tanks individually a long time ago. Instead I ran bio-farms and cycled filters. I actually began by using a tank to keep filters cycled. I would dose that filter tank with ammonia to hold keep the bacteria awake and working. Soooner or later, because I was ramping up my tank numbers, having a few fully cycled filters available but not on going stocked tanks, this was a big help. From there, it was easy to start cycling from scratch using a bio-farm with nothing but water, a heater, some crushed coral, filters and added ammonia. The bacteria need inorganic carbon which includes carbonates and bicarbonates and which are what makes KH in most tanks.

When I needed to set up 6-8 new tanks it was a lot easier to cycle the filters in one tank than to cycle 6-8 individual tanks. I could cycle those filters in 10-14 days but single tanks took longer. Right before teh bio-farm filters were fully cycled I was adding 20-25 ppm of ammonia to the tank daily, but in several smaller doses multiple times. If I added it all at once, it would have harmed or killed that bacteria and would have attracted different ammonia oxidizers. They would be more like what is used in waste water treament. This is why for the ammonium chloride solutions we are told not to allow ammonia to exceed 5 ppm as ammonia-N. This would equal about 6.4 ppm om the total Ion scale used by most hobby ytest kits.

Most, but not all of my summer tanks were without plants. However, some did have them. For the pleco tanks there were none but for Q tanks for community fish, I always used live plants.

Live plants are one of the best filters we can have. But not all tank have them. None of my plecos tanks use live plants. The lightd on them are only on when I have to work in them. otherwise they only get ambient roomlight, often this is sunlight.

So the next time I read about how somebody doesn't cycle their tank because they have so many live plants, explain to me why you have to add fish gradually if the plants make the tank fully cycled. Using my bio-farm method I can fully stock multiple tanks as soon as I have enough bacteria thriving in the filters. I also seed live bacteria and archaea. When I need to cycle a single new tank, I usually also use some live plants as well. But not for the pleco tanks.

Live pants make the best filtration, but if one doesn't want or cannot have them, the next best form of filtration would be a Hamburg Mattenfilter.

(edited for typos, bad spelling and to fix bad sentence structure)
 
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