Tank Stocking

[ajvoss]

Hello people!! I just rehoused my 4 Platies to a 10 gallon tank and they are loving it!!! So right now I have a 21 gallon tank with 12 neon tetras. They are fun to watch because half the time they school in one giant group and the other half of the time they are all over the place! Maybe the feel more comfortable without the Platies lol. Also found out that neon tetras love my veggie rounds after I accidently dropped one in that was meant for my BR Pleco in another tank. Oh btw my parameters for my 21g tank - everything 0 are there ever too many water changes lmao

Anyways to the real questions....

1) I have a few ghost shrimp in the tank and am debated whether to add some red cherry shrimp to add more variation. Would they get along well? Or should I just add some snails instead? (Like a few nerite snails and 2 assassins).

2) Is there any fish that's 3-5" that I could put into my tank? I don't want a schooling fish. I want one that stays alone and is a bit larger than my neon tetras. Or maybe a pair could work as long as they can get along. Please don't tell me that 5" is too big for my tank, it would only be temporary Bc my 55 gal is just starting to cycle. Thx

3) I have a betta in a 10gal tank with 5 neon tetras and they get along very well, no deaths, no fun nipping, no chasing. I was debating about putting in the betta and the 5 tetras into my 21 gal tank. So the final would be one female halfmoon betta with 17 neon tetra and three ghost shrimp. Would this work or would it stress out my betta?

4) how would you stock a 21 gallon tank that has 12 neon tetras? Don't worry about overstocking a little bit because I'm a slave when it comes to maintenance.

Sorry for all the questions. I just want some reassurance and some opinions. I'm not very good at making decisions lol.

 

[Byron]

2) Is there any fish that's 3-5" that I could put into my tank? I don't want a schooling fish. I want one that stays alone and is a bit larger than my neon tetras. Or maybe a pair could work as long as they can get along. Please don't tell me that 5" is too big for my tank, it would only be temporary Bc my 55 gal is just starting to cycle. Thx

I strongly suggest you wait until the 55g is cycled and ready for fish before acquiring fish that are not going to remain in the 20g. For one thing, moving fish from tank to tank only increases the stress. For another, new fish may have pathogens/disease and this you do not want in the 20g if it is now stable. And for another, just in case the 55g takes longer... .

3) I have a betta in a 10gal tank with 5 neon tetras and they get along very well, no deaths, no fun nipping, no chasing. I was debating about putting in the betta and the 5 tetras into my 21 gal tank. So the final would be one female halfmoon betta with 17 neon tetra and three ghost shrimp. Would this work or would it stress out my betta?

Betta is not a community fish. The fact that some people have them in with other fish and thiknk it works does not mean it is, nor that it will continue if it is. This works both ways. I had a Betta easily eat a neon years ago before I learned this lesson. And the Betta may seem OK now, but at some point it may decide to exert its aggressiveness which is inherent. But in reverse, small fish can decide to nip the flowing fins of a Betta. Even if they don't, they may be "thinking" it and the Betta can read these allomone chemical signals. We cannot change nature, so leave a male Betta on his own in his own space. He will be happier, meaning less stress, guaranteed.

4) how would you stock a 21 gallon tank that has 12 neon tetras? Don't worry about overstocking a little bit because I'm a slave when it comes to maintenance.

There is much more to stocking than maintenance. Many think that having larger or more filters, or doing more water changes, solves overstocking, but it does not. There is physical space for the individual fish, or the species requirements. Having said that, 12 neons is not going to fill a 21 gallon aquarium, though they might. The aquascape, and live plants, factor in. But I would look to maybe substrate fish, like a small cory species (in a group of 7-8), perhaps a whiptail but only the smaller species in Rineloricaria, not one of the large "Royal" species. Another shoal of a small characin perhaps.

By the way, the four platy in a 10g will very soon need at least a 20g tank, just so you realize.

Byron.

 

[ajvoss]

I strongly suggest you wait until the 55g is cycled and ready for fish before acquiring fish that are not going to remain in the 20g. For one thing, moving fish from tank to tank only increases the stress. For another, new fish may have pathogens/disease and this you do not want in the 20g if it is now stable. And for another, just in case the 55g takes longer... .



Betta is not a community fish. The fact that some people have them in with other fish and thiknk it works does not mean it is, nor that it will continue if it is. This works both ways. I had a Betta easily eat a neon years ago before I learned this lesson. And the Betta may seem OK now, but at some point it may decide to exert its aggressiveness which is inherent. But in reverse, small fish can decide to nip the flowing fins of a Betta. Even if they don't, they may be "thinking" it and the Betta can read these allomone chemical signals. We cannot change nature, so leave a male Betta on his own in his own space. He will be happier, meaning less stress, guaranteed.



There is much more to stocking than maintenance. Many think that having larger or more filters, or doing more water changes, solves overstocking, but it does not. There is physical space for the individual fish, or the species requirements. Having said that, 12 neons is not going to fill a 21 gallon aquarium, though they might. The aquascape, and live plants, factor in. But I would look to maybe substrate fish, like a small cory species (in a group of 7-8), perhaps a whiptail but only the smaller species in Rineloricaria, not one of the large "Royal" species. Another shoal of a small characin perhaps.

By the way, the four platy in a 10g will very soon need at least a 20g tank, just so you realize.

Byron.

At my LFS they have some scarlet badis¿ and they ten to stay small. Do you think I could add three of them to my 21 gal tank? Also is there a bottom feeder that grows to about 3" that I could put it my tank?

Thx so much, oh btw i will put the platys in the 55 so don't worry about them!

 

[Byron]

At my LFS they have some scarlet badis¿ and they ten to stay small. Do you think I could add three of them to my 21 gal tank? Also is there a bottom feeder that grows to about 3" that I could put it my tank?

Thx so much, oh btw i will put the platys in the 55 so don't worry about them!

Size-wise, the Scarlet Badis (Dario dario) is fine, but there are some other factors to consider. I don't know how thick the plants are, but this fish should be in a very thickly-planted tank. The main issue though is food. Being a micro-predator, it needs very small live or frozen foods. Some have reported success with prepared foods in time, but this has not been my personal experience. So not always an easy fish to keep alive. You can read more here:
http://www.seriouslyfish.com/species/dario-dario/

As for bottom feeder, in the 21 gallon with neons, I previously mentioned the common (smaller) whiptail, which reaches 4-5 inches but is very, very thin and inactive so it is suited to a smaller tank like a 20g. You could get one, or two. A group of cories is another substrate-level option.

 

[Ch4rlie]

A couple of this spring to mind here.

First point is you say-

Oh btw my parameters for my 21g tank - everything 0

Am assuming this means zero for nitrates as well?
If so, then that concerns me because I tend to take this as a sign of either the tank is not cycled as a cycled tank will always produce nitrate UNLESS you have a densely planted tank, if its the case of having lots of plants in the tank then thats not so much of a concern at all in that case.

So, for the first thing, it would be good if you can clarify if you have cycled the tank/s or not, and how did you do this cycle.

Second thing, you say you have platies and neon tetras, albeit in separate tanks, the platies tend to be hard water species while the neons ar soft water species.

Do you happen to know what your water parameters are in terms of water hardness is?
This can be found on your local water authority website, if unsure, simply copy and paste the whole website water quaility/hardness page onto here and we can check it out for you.

This is important as hard water fish will not fare very well in soft water and vice versa, its well worth finding this out for future refences for potential stocking options.

I completely concur with Byron about the stocking compatibilties as well as the suggestions of cories or the whiptail catfish, btw cories are soft water fish and the whiptail is more of a hard water specie though not exclusively as it has a broad water parameter range, and the tank size of 10 gals for the platies definitely being unsuitable long term.

I'd leave the betta in the 10 gal tank on its own tbh, with just a snail or two perhaps, shrimps tend to be favoured as food for bettas so that may not work but some bettas are more tolerant than others, up to you to gamble shrimps with the betta.


Paracheirodon innesi - Neon Tetra

Xiphophorus maculatus - Platy

Rineloricaria lanceolata - Whiptail Catfish


Nerite snails and assassin snails in the same tank, would not advise this simply because the assassin will likely eat the nerites.

Also nerites, especially if wild caught can be very difficult to feed as they tend to only eat a specific algae, green algae form the walls / glass of the tank, once this algae runs out then the nerite will simply starve to death unfortunately. However if its tank bred nerite and eats algae wafers then thats obviously much easier to keep alive.
http://www.seriouslyfish.com/species/rineloricaria-lanceolata/
You can mix Red Cherry Shrimps with Glass / Grass Shrimps, they are different species so they will not interbreed and will get along quite amicably.

Though have heard folks mention glass shrimps can be aggressive to small fish, but am not quite certain if this is the case tbh as they may have mistakenly bought a different specie of shrimp altogether.

Red Cherry Shrimp

Glass Shrimp
http://www.seriouslyfish.com/species/rineloricaria-lanceolata/

 

[ajvoss]

A couple of this spring to mind here.

First point is you say-



Am assuming this means zero for nitrates as well?
If so, then that concerns me because I tend to take this as a sign of either the tank is not cycled as a cycled tank will always produce nitrate UNLESS you have a densely planted tank, if its the case of having lots of plants in the tank then thats not so much of a concern at all in that case.

So, for the first thing, it would be good if you can clarify if you have cycled the tank/s or not, and how did you do this cycle.

Second thing, you say you have platies and neon tetras, albeit in separate tanks, the platies tend to be hard water species while the neons ar soft water species.

Do you happen to know what your water parameters are in terms of water hardness is?
This can be found on your local water authority website, if unsure, simply copy and paste the whole website water quaility/hardness page onto here and we can check it out for you.

This is important as hard water fish will not fare very well in soft water and vice versa, its well worth finding this out for future refences for potential stocking options.

I completely concur with Byron about the stocking compatibilties as well as the suggestions of cories or the whiptail catfish, btw cories are soft water fish and the whiptail is more of a hard water specie though not exclusively as it has a broad water parameter range, and the tank size of 10 gals for the platies definitely being unsuitable long term.

I'd leave the betta in the 10 gal tank on its own tbh, with just a snail or two perhaps, shrimps tend to be favoured as food for bettas so that may not work but some bettas are more tolerant than others, up to you to gamble shrimps with the betta.


Paracheirodon innesi - Neon Tetra

Xiphophorus maculatus - Platy

Rineloricaria lanceolata - Whiptail Catfish


Nerite snails and assassin snails in the same tank, would not advise this simply because the assassin will likely eat the nerites.

Also nerites, especially if wild caught can be very difficult to feed as they tend to only eat a specific algae, green algae form the walls / glass of the tank, once this algae runs out then the nerite will simply starve to death unfortunately. However if its tank bred nerite and eats algae wafers then thats obviously much easier to keep alive.
You can mix Red Cherry Shrimps with Glass / Grass Shrimps, they are different species so they will not interbreed and will get along quite amicably.

Though have heard folks mention glass shrimps can be aggressive to small fish, but am not quite certain if this is the case tbh as they may have mistakenly bought a different specie of shrimp altogether.

Red Cherry Shrimp

Glass Shrimp

Thanks for the reply. I was wondering about African Dwarf Frogs too. Do you know anything about them? Online it says they are really peaceful but I don't know if they would make a meal out of my tetras. The tank is cycled and I had it running for two months before I put in my Tetra and it has been about a month since I put them in.

I think I'm just going to put some more shrimp in and then add a school of other tetras (7-9).

Thanks for the help

 

[Ch4rlie]

ADF is one thing that am not knowledgable about at all to be entirely honest am afraid.

But what I do know is that there seems to be mixed reiews about them but the most common is that they can go for particularly small fish, especially fry if they can catch them.

ADF in a tank of their own works best to be fair, but they CAN go in a community tank but they can be a bit finicky to feed and with platies or other fish to compete with, they may not get enough food.

Also the types of compatible tank mates can be a bit conflicting. But from what I've learned that what tankmates NOT to have, as far as I know - any large fish or aggressive fish, cories or plecos, crayfish, turtles and other amphibians (newts, salamanders, African Clawed Frogs, etc) as well as goldfish not being really suitable to keep with ADF's.

In the case of ACF - the general rule of thumb with them is - claws and fins don't mix!