Started Fishless Cycle

[Zachary1941]

Hi,
Being completly new to fish keeping, your advice would be appricated....Have read many articles on fishless cycling and as per my last post felt confident to do it... O.k... 125 litre jewell tank, set up and ready to go.. Fake plants and gravel all well washed...Added a small Air Pump and stone at opposite end to filter so have a little extra oxygen.. Surface of water has a good amount of movement....Raised temp to 29C as i understand a little highter temp help the bacteria to grow..(Hope im right ?).....so far so good lol But here is the first problem...Measured the amount of Ammonia i need in a 2 gallon bucket so i get the right amount to raise Tank up to 5 ppm....When felt right added the amount to tank.Now when i took a test reading with the API kit..Had a problem deciding if reading was 4 or verging on the 8 .. So removed 25% of water and took another reading ..this was between the 2 and 4 once again problem reading the slight change in the green chart..have called it 4 .as would rather be low than high Am i right to do this ? Second question.. When hopefully i get to the stage whgere ammonia reads 0 after 12 hours.. do i then add the same amount of ammonia to bring it back up to 4 or 5 then.. Or wait till the 24 hours are up

Regards Zac

 

[DaveyG]

Hi,
Being completly new to fish keeping, your advice would be appricated....Have read many articles on fishless cycling and as per my last post felt confident to do it... O.k... 125 litre jewell tank, set up and ready to go.. Fake plants and gravel all well washed...Added a small Air Pump and stone at opposite end to filter so have a little extra oxygen.. Surface of water has a good amount of movement....Raised temp to 29C as i understand a little highter temp help the bacteria to grow..(Hope im right ?).....so far so good lol But here is the first problem...Measured the amount of Ammonia i need in a 2 gallon bucket so i get the right amount to raise Tank up to 5 ppm....When felt right added the amount to tank.Now when i took a test reading with the API kit..Had a problem deciding if reading was 4 or verging on the 8 .. So removed 25% of water and took another reading ..this was between the 2 and 4 once again problem reading the slight change in the green chart..have called it 4 .as would rather be low than high Am i right to do this ? Second question.. When hopefully i get to the stage whgere ammonia reads 0 after 12 hours.. do i then add the same amount of ammonia to bring it back up to 4 or 5 then.. Or wait till the 24 hours are up

Regards Zac

Hey Zachary

Being new myself I've also done a lot of reading up on the fishless cycle and have recently started one as well. Your second question - once your bacteria can munch ammonia down from ~4ppm to 0 in 12 hours you need to keep adding the same to get it back to 4ppm but start checking the nitrites. Once the nitrites follow the same pattern as the ammonia (down to 0 in around 12 hours) your tank is cycled and you can do a big water change and add fish.

Once cycled you need to keep adding ammonia so the bacteria don't starve until you can add your fish, which then obviously become the source of ammonia.

As for your first question I'm not sure I understand it fully - I think you need to do the ammonia test again and make a call on what the reading is. If you've done the calculations right then you have probably got it to 4, but I'd check!

 

[Zachary1941]

Hi,
Being completly new to fish keeping, your advice would be appricated....Have read many articles on fishless cycling and as per my last post felt confident to do it... O.k... 125 litre jewell tank, set up and ready to go.. Fake plants and gravel all well washed...Added a small Air Pump and stone at opposite end to filter so have a little extra oxygen.. Surface of water has a good amount of movement....Raised temp to 29C as i understand a little highter temp help the bacteria to grow..(Hope im right ?).....so far so good lol But here is the first problem...Measured the amount of Ammonia i need in a 2 gallon bucket so i get the right amount to raise Tank up to 5 ppm....When felt right added the amount to tank.Now when i took a test reading with the API kit..Had a problem deciding if reading was 4 or verging on the 8 .. So removed 25% of water and took another reading ..this was between the 2 and 4 once again problem reading the slight change in the green chart..have called it 4 .as would rather be low than high Am i right to do this ? Second question.. When hopefully i get to the stage whgere ammonia reads 0 after 12 hours.. do i then add the same amount of ammonia to bring it back up to 4 or 5 then.. Or wait till the 24 hours are up

Regards Zac

Hey Zachary

Being new myself I've also done a lot of reading up on the fishless cycle and have recently started one as well. Your second question - once your bacteria can munch ammonia down from ~4ppm to 0 in 12 hours you need to keep adding the same to get it back to 4ppm but start checking the nitrites. Once the nitrites follow the same pattern as the ammonia (down to 0 in around 12 hours) your tank is cycled and you can do a big water change and add fish.

Once cycled you need to keep adding ammonia so the bacteria don't starve until you can add your fish, which then obviously become the source of ammonia.

As for your first question I'm not sure I understand it fully - I think you need to do the ammonia test again and make a call on what the reading is. If you've done the calculations right then you have probably got it to 4, but I'd check!

Hi,
Being completly new to fish keeping, your advice would be appricated....Have read many articles on fishless cycling and as per my last post felt confident to do it... O.k... 125 litre jewell tank, set up and ready to go.. Fake plants and gravel all well washed...Added a small Air Pump and stone at opposite end to filter so have a little extra oxygen.. Surface of water has a good amount of movement....Raised temp to 29C as i understand a little highter temp help the bacteria to grow..(Hope im right ?).....so far so good lol But here is the first problem...Measured the amount of Ammonia i need in a 2 gallon bucket so i get the right amount to raise Tank up to 5 ppm....When felt right added the amount to tank.Now when i took a test reading with the API kit..Had a problem deciding if reading was 4 or verging on the 8 .. So removed 25% of water and took another reading ..this was between the 2 and 4 once again problem reading the slight change in the green chart..have called it 4 .as would rather be low than high Am i right to do this ? Second question.. When hopefully i get to the stage whgere ammonia reads 0 after 12 hours.. do i then add the same amount of ammonia to bring it back up to 4 or 5 then.. Or wait till the 24 hours are up

Regards Zac

Hey Zachary

Being new myself I've also done a lot of reading up on the fishless cycle and have recently started one as well. Your second question - once your bacteria can munch ammonia down from ~4ppm to 0 in 12 hours you need to keep adding the same to get it back to 4ppm but start checking the nitrites. Once the nitrites follow the same pattern as the ammonia (down to 0 in around 12 hours) your tank is cycled and you can do a big water change and add fish.

Once cycled you need to keep adding ammonia so the bacteria don't starve until you can add your fish, which then obviously become the source of ammonia.

As for your first question I'm not sure I understand it fully - I think you need to do the ammonia test again and make a call on what the reading is. If you've done the calculations right then you have probably got it to 4, but I'd check!

 

[Zachary1941]

Hi,
Being completly new to fish keeping, your advice would be appricated....Have read many articles on fishless cycling and as per my last post felt confident to do it... O.k... 125 litre jewell tank, set up and ready to go.. Fake plants and gravel all well washed...Added a small Air Pump and stone at opposite end to filter so have a little extra oxygen.. Surface of water has a good amount of movement....Raised temp to 29C as i understand a little highter temp help the bacteria to grow..(Hope im right ?).....so far so good lol But here is the first problem...Measured the amount of Ammonia i need in a 2 gallon bucket so i get the right amount to raise Tank up to 5 ppm....When felt right added the amount to tank.Now when i took a test reading with the API kit..Had a problem deciding if reading was 4 or verging on the 8 .. So removed 25% of water and took another reading ..this was between the 2 and 4 once again problem reading the slight change in the green chart..have called it 4 .as would rather be low than high Am i right to do this ? Second question.. When hopefully i get to the stage whgere ammonia reads 0 after 12 hours.. do i then add the same amount of ammonia to bring it back up to 4 or 5 then.. Or wait till the 24 hours are up

Regards Zac

Hey Zachary

Being new myself I've also done a lot of reading up on the fishless cycle and have recently started one as well. Your second question - once your bacteria can munch ammonia down from ~4ppm to 0 in 12 hours you need to keep adding the same to get it back to 4ppm but start checking the nitrites. Once the nitrites follow the same pattern as the ammonia (down to 0 in around 12 hours) your tank is cycled and you can do a big water change and add fish.

Once cycled you need to keep adding ammonia so the bacteria don't starve until you can add your fish, which then obviously become the source of ammonia.

As for your first question I'm not sure I understand it fully - I think you need to do the ammonia test again and make a call on what the reading is. If you've done the calculations right then you have probably got it to 4, but I'd check!

Thanks Davy,
What my second question is basically.. Reading the different shades of green......from 2 to 4 is a very slight difference to me.. Would rather err on the side of safety.and call a 2 reading 4 That way no fear of adding too much ammonia ??? sorry for confusion.. Good luck with your cycle . ..Regards Zac

 

[Bobtastic]

Erring on the side of caution seems like the best idea until one of the more experience forum type and answer your question. As I understand it that you don't want the level too high as u'll grow the wrong type of bacteria.

Did you use the Aquarium Calculator to work out how much ammoina to add?

 

[Zachary1941]

Erring on the side of caution seems like the best idea until one of the more experience forum type and answer your question. As I understand it that you don't want the level too high as u'll grow the wrong type of bacteria.

Did you use the Aquarium Calculator to work out how much ammoina to add?

Hi Bob,
I did thanks..But believe when i measured the tank measured the whole thing, did not allow for the fact there is a 3" gap at the top which houses the lights etc.. The tank is 80 x 36 cms.. so would add up to quite a difference in litres...However the fact i measured also in a 2 gallon bucket gave me a more accurate reading (Well thats my excuse) Its those darn green colours that thro me off a little.. all the rest no problem...such a sutle shade difference.. still if thats the least of my problems , guess i will be very lucky.. Thanks Bob

 

[backtotropical]

Hi Zachary and to TFF,

Interpreting the colours of test kits is always a problem, but people usually devise their own methods as they use the test kit more and more. Reading it in the same place under the same light each time should give you some consistency.

With regard to other fishless cycling queries, you are in good hands. We have many members who have gone through it, and advised hundreds of others how to do it too.

I wish you luck with your fishless cycle, and remember, the only stupid question is the one you don't ask.........

Cheers

BTT

 

[Zachary1941]

Hi Zachary and to TFF,

Interpreting the colours of test kits is always a problem, but people usually devise their own methods as they use the test kit more and more. Reading it in the same place under the same light each time should give you some consistency.

With regard to other fishless cycling queries, you are in good hands. We have many members who have gone through it, and advised hundreds of others how to do it too.

I wish you luck with your fishless cycle, and remember, the only stupid question is the one you don't ask.........

Cheers

BTT

Thanks backtotropical,
its good to know there is a weath of experience here that can help me along the way, now after the cycle...Reading your answer about using the same light and place regarding test reading.. Dont laugh, but took reading in kitchen to read, then lounge,in fact everywhere except toilet.. maybe do that next time.. Thanks for your welcome Regards Zac

 

[Bobtastic]

I wish you luck with your fishless cycle, and remember, the only stupid question is the one you don't ask.........

There are no stupid questions, only stupid people.

Yeah, I've had the same sort of problem with the Nutrafin test kit. I'm pretty much guesstimating if the colours aren't spot on.

 

[OldMan47]

I must agree with both you and BTT that the color charts can be a challenge to read. I usually only care about one thing, is the sample yellow or green. In my case I seldom cycle a new filter using ammonia dosing, instead a new filter joins a mature one on an old established tank and after a few weeks it is ready to go. If I don't have the time for that, I clean a mature filter in my new tank and then dose once or twice to check before adding my fish. The filter is almost always ready to go but if not, I have lots of filters that always need cleaning.
Something to add to BTT's post Zachary. Since the 4 or 5 ppm target is based on a final stocking level, you are much better off using a smaller value than a bigger value. The smaller value will do just as much bacteria growing as the larger dose until it gets to the point that you are reducing the levels in 12 hours. At that point it would be nice if you could get a close to 4 ppm dosing but even then it would just mean that you would need to start with a smaller stocking. It would not mean that you would have trouble adding fish and keeping them healthy.
When you get to the stage that your ammonia is gone in 12 hours, wait the full 24 hours before raising the levels again. There is no need to boost your bacteria levels as high as they could go with the ammonia dose at 12 hour intervals. You will never need that much bacteria if you are at all reasonable with the fish stocking levels.
The bump up to 29C was a good idea and may slightly shorten your cycle time.

 

[waterdrop]

Yes, agree with OM47 on both points:

You always add the 4 to 5ppm of ammonia at your 24-hour-point of the day, regardless of when during the previous 24 hours you might have measured that it had gone down to zero ppm.

Erring to the low side is better than the high when trying to guesstimate what 5ppm is. Luckily, getting close to a real 5ppm is not so important until much later at the end of fishless cycling and by then you usually have more confidence in the guesswork! The 5ppm ensures a very robust set of bacterial colonies to start the tank off.

~~waterdrop~~

 

[LionessN3cubs]

I am HORRIBLY confused.

Last time AND this time I cycled...to get a reading of 4-5 ppm, I had to add WELL over what that calculator says. It says for a 10 gallon tank I should be using 1.99 mls. I added 4 mls and the reading to me shows about 2-3..hubby says closer to 4ppm on the color chart.

If that calculator is right....then something is very off. Im using a medicinal syringe from a pharmacy so I KNOW its right there....

I dont get it? Should I take some out and dilute it and stick to adding 1.99 if I ever get there?

 

[Bobtastic]

The calculators default is for 9.5% ammonia, is that the same as you're using? Personally I kinda of assumed that the calculator was a rough guide to save you the brain strain in trying to calculate if for yourself, rather than an exact measurement.

 

[waterdrop]

The calculators default is for 9.5% ammonia, is that the same as you're using? Personally I kinda of assumed that the calculator was a rough guide to save you the brain strain in trying to calculate if for yourself, rather than an exact measurement.

Yes, this is correct. The two main areas of confusion with the use of the ammonia calculator are:
1) The ammonia concentration (5%, 9.5%, whatever) is unmarked on the household ammonia bottle the fishless cycler has purchased.
2) The actual concentration of ammonia in the bottle has changed (different evaporation rates of ammonia and water, or for whatever reason) from when it was shipped out by the manufacturering plant.

For both these reasons, the calculator should only ever be used as a "quick and dirty starter guide" to figuring out the *real* volume you should be squirting in to your tank to achieve the desired 5ppm guesstimate for fishless cycling. My own feeling is the calculator should be used to "come in low," test, add, test etc. but there's nothing wrong of course with using what it says straight out the first time. You can always remove some water if it went over.

~~waterdrop~~

 

[OldMan47]

If it takes 4 ml to get you 4 ppm, that is what you need to add to get to 4 ppm. I know that sounds circular and simplistic but I live in the real world, not the calculator world. Whatever actually works is what I will do. When you open the ammonia bottle, the concentration goes down. You already knew that if you think about it because the odor that almost knocks you over means that ammonia is escaping from the bottle. Do not intentionally put your nose to the bottle, it is not good for you any more than it is for fish. What the odor means is that the highest concentration you will ever have in the bottle is the concentration the day it was made. After that it continually becomes less and less concentrated. Come back in a hundred years and it won't be much more than maybe some smelly water.