Nitrate Farms??

[Sky042]

I'm a little confused. people here are refering to cannister filters as nitrate farms. since I'm just starting to research for a possible SW setup this term is confusing since in a freshwater setup you want nitrates produced since they show your biological filter is working and make for good plant food.

Are nitrates undesireable in a SW setup?

 

[impur]

Nitrates are undesirable in all aquariums. In freshwater, nitrates are the result of fish waste and uneaten food not being consumed by the fish and bacteria. The ONLY way to reduce nitrates is by water changes. In a SW tank, nitrates lead to various algae outbreaks. SW has different kinds of algae to combat than FW. Using a canister filter or biowheel gives nitrates an area to collect and grow. It will lead to a nice green aquarium

 

[Sky042]

Nitrates are undesirable in all aquariums. In freshwater, nitrates are the result of fish waste and uneaten food not being consumed by the fish and bacteria. The ONLY way to reduce nitrates is by water changes. In a SW tank, nitrates lead to various algae outbreaks. SW has different kinds of algae to combat than FW. Using a canister filter or biowheel gives nitrates an area to collect and grow. It will lead to a nice green aquarium

In my FW aquarium the nitrates are nicely consumed by my live plants and I usually have a nitrate level of 0ppm. I'm then to assume that there isn't an organism in a SW tank that consumes nitrates like this other than algae.

 

[Stryker]

yes there are, all sorts of anerobic bacteria.... I'm sure someone will be along to tell you of the benefits of live rock and sand

 

[Sky042]

yes there are, all sorts of anerobic bacteria.... I'm sure someone will be along to tell you of the benefits of live rock and sand

isnt' live rock and sand capable of doing the same thing as the biological portion of a FW setup?

I was asking if there was anything that can use nitrate like live plants do in a FW setup

 

[leanne]

nitrates lead to various algae outbreaks

in other words algae uses up (and thus neutralises) nitrate. So if you get something to eat and keep up with the algae growth... I have some algae on my back wall but my turbo snails get rid of it. My nitrates have never been higher that 5 - even though everyone says I stocked my tank too quickly.

 

[Stryker]

When you grow plants or even algae, then trim the plants and clean out some of the algae..... then yes you are efectivley removing the nitrates and minerals that the plant has used to grow.

Even in a FW tank a sump could be handy.... if its in a cupboard under the tank you could leave a tank light on 24/7 in the sump and put plants in it.... do this would also effectivley encourage algae to grow down there, thus using up nitrates.

..... just an idea.

 

[Navarre]

There are ways of removing Nitrates in a seawater aquarium.

I have a completely natural system, no skimmer, no canister filters, no UV.. just Natural seawater, liverock and Mineral mud (in the sump with caulerpa).

Caulerpa (and any algea for this matter) is excellant at removing Nitrates. Caulerap is usually used as it grows very aggressively and thus utilises more nitrate than other slower growing algeas.

Live rock is another excellant way of removing Nitrate.

To move the Ammonia cycle along its natural path you have to have an environment that is Oxygen rich for the bacteria to use when converting Ammonia to nitrite and nitrite to nitrate.
Canister filters are considered by many to be poor filters and nitrate factories as they build up alot of bacteria that turn out alot of nitrates. The problem here is that they use alot of the oxygen in the water and thus deprive the fish of their much needed oxygen (as opposed to trickle filters that uses oxygen from the atmoshpere.).

Many still use cannister filters though and to be honest i have never seen much problem with oxygen levels. As liong as the tank has a large turnover of water then there should be good oxygen exchange.

Anyway.. I digress...

TO be able to finish off the Ammonia cycle and thus convert Nitrate to Nitrogen gas to be released into the atmoshpere (and thus rendering the total safe end of the ammmonia cycle). the bacteria that do this work live in an oxygen poor envirnment. Thus this means that almost any filter will fail to accomplish this task as they are designed to be oxygen rich. Live rock on the otherhand is porous, on its outter surface it has great colonies of bacteria that utilises oxygen and thus start the natural cycle. However, as this water passes deeper into the rock, its oxygen is reduced significantly until its alomst deprived of oygen altogether in the center of the rock.. This is where the most precious bacteria that can render an end to the cycle "hang out" in great numbers. Good quality live rock will be a great filter for finishing the cycle and turning Nitrate to Nitrogen gas.

I hope this helps clear up the way that Nitrates are created and handled in a Seawaer aquarium.

Cheers

Navarre

 

[leanne]

Thanks for that Navarre - you explained it so eloquently

I have a wet/dry trickle filter that has carbon and is also part canister. I also have an anaerobic sandpit - basically I have a corner where the sand is about 4-5 inches deep (but not very wide) where the sand isn't getting turned over so can become anerobic (the rest of the sand is about 1inch deep). I believe it is based on - god I forgot his name as I was typing - "xxxxxxx"'s principle.

 

[Navarre]

I know what you mean leanne but the name escapes me too

With regards to you deeper sand, i would advise not to let anything disturb it. It will have alot of very poisonous gasses and toxins in that sand, if its released into the water it could cause trouble for the tank. Not a good idea if you have sand dwelling wrasses and similar etc.

If its in a seperate part of a tank (sump area) then it should be protected enough.

If its possible to increase this sand depth to 7insh you might find better results. Im not talkinf fromexperience here but merely from reading many other posts from people that have kept DSB systems. (Has something to do with the dpth needed to get a good population of oxygen poor bacteria)

 

[leanne]

It's got live rock bridged across and round it so hopefully it will remain undisturbed. I gave a bit of thought into how to keep everything away from it so I've used the "barrier method"

 

[Navarre]

If it works for you then dont change it

I can honestly say that there is no set in stones rule for this hobby. guidelines maybe but rule.. well for every hard fast rule there will be an example where it actually works for someone else.

 

[leanne]

That's why these forums are so good - you can share experinces and make an informed choice. Far better than just reading from a book and doing it beacuse "it must be true becuase it's written down..."