Newbie Needing Help And Advice Please!

[waterdrop]

Thanks Schmill for saving me just rushing and having a bad day. Made a mess there combining fish-in and fishless info, sorry! I should just take a nap, lol.

 

[B13]

Aaaaaaaaaand today's news is:

Fish-in Cycle
83 Gallon tank
6 lunatic Danios, 3 Coolies (somewhere...), 1 Siamese Flying Fox, 1 still-tiny Sailfin Plec, a small rogue snail that's nibbled a plant...


And after yet another 50% water change:

pH - 7.5
Ammonia - 0.1
Nitrite - 0.2
Nitrate - 30-ish


So the Nitrite is down by 0.05 since yesterday, but there's no real change in the Nitrate. Does Nitrate take longer to balance out than Nitrite?



FYI:

I've got rid of two fish: a Sailfin Plec that looked decidedly ill also and a Siamese Flying Fox who was mercilessly bullying the other Siamese Flying Fox (after being told by the LFS that they get along OK, contrary to my own research and now experience...) Another LFS kindly took 'em off my hands- which I'm happy about because a. the fishes' health and welfare is more important and b. I got 'em for free anyway from the original LFS when the newbie cashier forgot to charge me for m'fish...

So having two less fish in the tank will probably help, am I right?

 

[Schmill]

Yup less fish load should help, as in there will be less ammonia being produced each day, (just remember to reduce the feeding as well now you have less fish )

Unless your tank is REALLY heavily stocked, or you have some really fancy-pants filtering your Nitrates won't 'balance out'. One reason for the frequent water changes on a tank that IS cycled, is to remove the excess Nitrates. Your aim is to get the ammonia and the nitrIte down to 0 (due to filter bacteria growth), and keep the nitrAtes at a reasonable level by water changes. (Of course doing a fish-in cycle you also have to do the water changes at the moment to keep the ammonia and nitrIte levels reasonably low).

Ok, I might have waffled there and confused you, (I know I certainly started confusing myself!)

In summary:

Less Fish = Good
EVENTUALLY Ammonia and NitrItes will = 0
NitrAtes are very unlikely to ever FALL in value, and will actually increase in most established tanks. Water changes are used to keep this under control.

 

[Miss Wiggle]

yeah don't overly worry over the nitrate for now, there's a number of reasons basically

1 - nitrates are the least toxic of all the levels we test for, they are toxic to fish but only in massive concentrations, there's very little evidence done but what has been done indicates that nitrates will not start to harm fish until around 400ppm (with the exception of a few species which are particularly sensitive to nitrate).

2 - nitrate tests are notoriously dodgy, even the good quality home tests available to us are inaccurate and sometimes will give different readings from the same water sample so readings should be taken as indicative at best.

and some more things that i'm struggling to write right now as my heads really hurting.

you get the jist anyway, test the nitrate and monitor it, but unless it's off the scale on the tests don't worry over it

 

[B13]

and some more things that i'm struggling to write right now as my heads really hurting.

*winces*

It's not a migraine, I hope...

Ok, I might have waffled there and confused you, (I know I certainly started confusing myself!)

I'm permanently confuzzled. That is 'normal' for me. The day I know what the hell's going on is the day I know I've woken up in a different universe...

In summary:

Less Fish = Good
EVENTUALLY Ammonia and NitrItes will = 0
NitrAtes are very unlikely to ever FALL in value, and will actually increase in most established tanks. Water changes are used to keep this under control.

So... should I carry on (trying) to do daily 50% water changes for now? Or is 50% a bit much?

 

[Miss Wiggle]

and some more things that i'm struggling to write right now as my heads really hurting.

*winces*

It's not a migraine, I hope...

docs don't really know what it is tbh, had severe headaches and problems with my field of vision for 6 weeks now, it got better then flared up last weekend, they thought it was a migraine but now they're saying it isn't. Booked in to see some super senior consultant tomorrow morning to hopefully get a diagnosis, as it is I'm in quite a bit of pain and can't see properly.

all a bit worrying but hopefully this doctor tomorrow will have more of an idea.

 

[B13]

Flippin' 'eck!!

I hope they sort that out for you coz that sounds AWFUL!!!!!




I get severe migraines from time to time, so I kinda know how you must be feeling, but if it's been happening for a while, that's just horrible!!

 

[waterdrop]

Yes, we're hoping they'll allow her to keep her current head, as the feeling on TFF is that's its been a great aid at times to her "flying keyboard fingers."

As you can see a coupl' posts back, she'd need to be around to correct my mistakes even if they've got tubes feeding her.

Agree with schmill & MW up there, only beginners get very worried about nitrates, understanding them will come with time, B13, and not a worry now.

Your water changes look like they are doing good!! .. and I'd keep them up unless you are getting pure zeros..

~~waterdrop~~

 

[Miss Wiggle]

thanks guys, it's pretty grim but I'm coping.

and my Mummy's being great, driving half way across the country first thing tomorrow morning to take me to a private hospital to see a decent doctor rather than the NHS monkeys who've so far been slightly less useful than a chocolate teapot (a chocolate teapot is at least tasty! ) so at least I'm in good hands and touch wood tomorrow they'll at least be able to give me a diagnosis which is really half the battle. Nowadays they can fix most things as long as they know what's wrong. It's when they've no clue what's wrong that they get a bit stumped fixing it.

 

[B13]

First things first:

Good luck for today, Miss Wiggle and let us know how you are and what the docs say. Keep us posted!!

*fingers crossed*




Speaking of medical matters, my remaining Plec has a SERIOUS problem. His eye looks like it's popped out of it's socket.

I've put a thread and some pictures up HERE


The pictures don't look anything like as bad as it does in real life! The eye really DOES look like it's out of the socket!!!

 

[Miss Wiggle]

thankyou, the consultant said today that he thinks it's most likely an inflamed optical nerve, I'm getting an MRI scan in the next week or so which will confirm or deny the diagnosis. it should just fix itself within 4-6 weeks with no lingering problems, there s a slight chance that it's something more serious but it's only a very slim chance so for now it's just waiting for the MRI scan to confirm the diagnosis and resting until I'm better.

not looked over at the pics yet but it sounds very much like pop eye which is often related to poor water. best way to treat it is to keep the water spotless with 0 ammonia and nitrite. you'll know from your reading that the process of cycling is dangerous to fish and despite our best risk mitigation things like this do happen. You can get a medication for pop eye so if it's agreed on the other thread that that's the cause then pop some of that in, keep up or increase water changes to keep the water clean and firmly cross your fingers.

 

[B13]

Blimey!

An inflamed optic nerve? How did that happen - or is it just 'one of those things'?

Either way, at least it's been looked at and you've got the good news that it will heal OK. Something like that must be downright scarey, not to mention horribly painful!




On a more fish-y note, the plec seems to be back to pretty much normal today. They eye is back in it's socket and the membranes aren't red anymore. That said, I'm gonna be watching the little fella like a hawk.

Meds-wise, Wilder recommended Interpet Anti Internal Bacteria, but when I went to the pet shop to get some, they guy behind the counter wouldn't sell it to me!



He said that I should leave well alone and see what happens!!

 

[Miss Wiggle]

yeah they said it's just one of those things, got to take ibuprofen to try and reduce the inflamation which will hopefully speed up the recovery process. so I've been on maximum dosage of it today and I have to say while the vision is the same it does feel a little bit less sore so fingers crossed it's having some effect.

good good, again maybe just one of those things, like the docs don't know everything about the human body we don't know everything about fish. if it's gone back to normal then i agree not to medicate, as you say, watch it like a hawk and keep as on top of water quality as is possible.

 

[Schmill]

So is that both MW and the Pleco that have Pop-eye now?

 

[B13]

...or my lil' plec has 'come out in sympathy'...



(I was gonna call my plec Popeye, but it might now have to be called Wiggle...)