Mollies wiggling in one corner of the tank (one specific corner)(pls help)

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Your biggest problem is you need less fish or a bigger tank or ridiculously more plants or all of the above. The fact that your tank is quite small suggests to me the weird behaviour is caused by irritation from ammonia. Gasping at the surface is possibly from lack of oxygen, but likely nitrite poisoning.

What you describe sounds frighteningly similar to what I went through at the same age you are now. I tried to keep several goldfish in a 18 by 10 inch (so not even 10 gallons, and that was an upgrade from a 3.5 gallon starter kit) with a tiny air driven box filter using an air pump that didn't really pump much air. They died within weeks. A 100% water change might make them well for 24hrs, but no doubt, I was poisoning them with chlorine due to lack of funds of buying conditioner (though the advice in books and mags of the time was to let the water stand). This wasn't even dark ages, it was the 90s. I knew about the nitrogen cycle, but I told myself I knew better. I started changing 50% water each day instead of the 100% I had been because I thought I would disrupt the cycle if I changed water too often. Obviously I just hastened the fishes deaths. After attempting this fishtank thing again with new fish after the first deaths (this time I had the bright idea of using common goldfish because they might be hardier than the fantails I'd had before) - I had exactly the same results. I even tried 10 or 15 (yes you heard me) sticklebacks caught from the local steam..... to exactly the same results.

I spent the next 20 or 25 or so years of my life out of the hobby (thankfully for the poor fish I might have killed) but maintained an interest, reading books, magazines and soon along came the internet. I went window shopping in LFS for fun. I did research. I started lurking on this forum on and off without ever joining. I'm probably one of the people Bruce was thinking about as passing off other peoples teaching as my own... but that's because I found myself able to answer people's problems in my head just because I'd read the same problems over and over.

It's hard to know what's going on in your tank without testing.... but it is what it is and people muddled along blindly in the bad old days with sometimes surprising success. On the plus side you are probably already doing better than I was at your age as it sounds like you may well have a working and mature filter allbeit insufficient to your bioload. If you are using RO water, it is likely soft, cherry barbs, small gourami, etc might be appropriate (although the tank's footprint is likely too small for many fish).

I assume you will be keeping the mollies if you are attached to them, although I do not think they will survive long.

While I can't condone that (and that's coming from me, even now I know what I'm doing I willfully ignore stocking limits, though I did so in gradual manner monitoring nitrate), my advice would be to have no more than 2 or 3 mollies, as in don't go out and buy new friends, they will grow quite large if they survive, and that tank is really too small to allow them swimming space. If mollies are only type of fish, I would be seriously tempted to just try you tap-water.... they like water hard enough that I hear idiot americans (no offense to the non-idiots reading this) will deliberately put them in brackish or marine tanks. And hopefully you do not have both genders for obvious reasons.

As you have no idea on conditions be prepared to do 75% water changes more than once a week, hopefully your parents will let you buy enough water conditioner; I don't imagine they will live long even if you change water often enough if you continue using 100% RO water (which likely doesn't require conditioner).

If they all die, and I am guessing they will, and you want to continue, I would suggest planting the empty tank of RO very heavily, maybe add a pinch of flakes or something to act as fertiliser, and leaving a little for the plants to start growing. At that point start to gradually stock and appropriate number of SMALL soft water fish.

I won't judge on the shubunkin being cold water, as I assume in India many unheated tanks are warm enough for most tropical fish anyway.

Apologies for the rambling long post.... I agree with what everyone else has said, but I can tell you will not listen, so I am hoping sharing my experience might help.
 
Excellent post Myraan and great advice on how to go forward.

I was thinking we are at an impasse, so hopefully the advice and knowledge will be used to progress with the hobby. I don’t think much more can be said really, without the OP getting a test kit and water changing each day, but I too don’t think this will happen.

Have a google for seriously fish to help research what is suitable for your water chemistry and tank size. Good luck, but please don’t buy any more fish for the tank until you know what is going on. Save that money for a test kit!
 
At the end of the day @sanchay , you have fish that are experiencing serious and life threatening issues and you came here asking for help, which is absolutely fine and understandable.

It has become sadly obvious that the choice of species mix, aquarium size and basic equipment is incompatible, but as you rightly state, its what you are able to afford and obtain and your family are not as keen as you are to keep the fish. You are not the first to get into this situation and you certainly will not be the last.

I understand your frustration and feeling of helplessness...you want the best for your fish but I think you know deep down that you cannot give the best for them, and that realisation is now showing with your frustrated responses.

There is no easy answer to your difficulties in getting appropriate testing equipment, aquariums etc to keep these fish safe and healthy and you know and understand that - even if you are trying to deny it.

I would rehome the fish, pack away the aquarium and wait til you have a job and a home of your own and can afford to buy everything that you need without having to deal with the family arguments. Take time to learn how to keep fish properly so that you do not repeat these errors again. Fishkeeping is not for everyone, its not as easy or as inexpensive as people assume that it is. It is time consuming, financially and emotionally draining and if you find that you truly cannot give fish the care that they need, then you should wait until you are in a better position and if you still want to keep fish, then waiting a few years til you are independent and can afford it all is the best way forward at this point in time.

Deep down you KNOW that you are not going to be able to keep fish healthy in your present situation, you are fighting to prove your family and everyone else wrong....its not working, you know its not working. Rehome the fish, take a break from trying to keep fish for a few years, get yourself independent and maybe look at keeping fish later in life when the only one you have to answer to is you and not your family. You have tried to do the best that you can but as things stand right now, its never going to be enough and you KNOW that matey. It's time to make a grown up decision and admit defeat....its not your fault, its just not the right time or situation.
 
At the end of the day @sanchay , you have fish that are experiencing serious and life threatening issues and you came here asking for help, which is absolutely fine and understandable.

It has become sadly obvious that the choice of species mix, aquarium size and basic equipment is incompatible, but as you rightly state, its what you are able to afford and obtain and your family are not as keen as you are to keep the fish. You are not the first to get into this situation and you certainly will not be the last.

I understand your frustration and feeling of helplessness...you want the best for your fish but I think you know deep down that you cannot give the best for them, and that realisation is now showing with your frustrated responses.

There is no easy answer to your difficulties in getting appropriate testing equipment, aquariums etc to keep these fish safe and healthy and you know and understand that - even if you are trying to deny it.

I would rehome the fish, pack away the aquarium and wait til you have a job and a home of your own and can afford to buy everything that you need without having to deal with the family arguments. Take time to learn how to keep fish properly so that you do not repeat these errors again. Fishkeeping is not for everyone, its not as easy or as inexpensive as people assume that it is. It is time consuming, financially and emotionally draining and if you find that you truly cannot give fish the care that they need, then you should wait until you are in a better position and if you still want to keep fish, then waiting a few years til you are independent and can afford it all is the best way forward at this point in time.

Deep down you KNOW that you are not going to be able to keep fish healthy in your present situation, you are fighting to prove your family and everyone else wrong....its not working, you know its not working. Rehome the fish, take a break from trying to keep fish for a few years, get yourself independent and maybe look at keeping fish later in life when the only one you have to answer to is you and not your family. You have tried to do the best that you can but as things stand right now, its never going to be enough and you KNOW that matey. It's time to make a grown up decision and admit defeat....its not your fault, its just not the right time or situation.
ok.....maybe you are right....currently I wont be able to rehome these guys.....like i already tried it....the local shopkeeper refused to take them....a few of my friends dont want the fish I have in my tank....i will try my best to keep them happy as much as i can...maybe until they die due to age reasons or whatever it may be....i dont have the heart to euthanise them (I tried once before with one of my molly and it was a failed euthanisation....i am scared the same might happen again...)

also is taking a water test every 2 weeks valid? like my local shopkeeper does that for his customers who have been getting products from him for more than a year....like he told me he uses API...i will be giving a sample tomorrow...he would test it right there and give me the values alone

like currently this is the only way i can test my water...is that valid in ay way
 
Excellent post Myraan and great advice on how to go forward.

I was thinking we are at an impasse, so hopefully the advice and knowledge will be used to progress with the hobby. I don’t think much more can be said really, without the OP getting a test kit and water changing each day, but I too don’t think this will happen.

Have a google for seriously fish to help research what is suitable for your water chemistry and tank size. Good luck, but please don’t buy any more fish for the tank until you know what is going on. Save that money for a test kit!
what about a water test every 2 weeks or so....or maybe whenever i face an issue...

my local shopkeeper gives a free water test for customers who are buying products from him for more than a year.....i will be giving a sample tomorrow...will that be valid....

like i started giving my water for testing from the previous month and from the values he gave...nothing seemed wrong with the parameters.....atleast when it comes to ammonia,nitrities,nitrates and the pH of the water....maybe i will try asking for the GH values too...if he has the equipment

i did a 50% water change on 10th september

even though i wont be able to get the values everyday.....would this be valid?
 
i did a 50% water change on 10th september
Why aren't you changing water every day?

...also is taking a water test every 2 weeks valid? like my local shopkeeper does that for his customers who have been getting products from him for more than a year....like he told me he uses API...i will be giving a sample tomorrow...he would test it right there and give me the values alone

like currently this is the only way i can test my water...is that valid in ay way

ANY water tests are valid and, in your case, the more the better.
When I'm setting up my tanks, I was testing daily and sometimes even twice daily. (It gave me something fish-related to do whilst I was waiting for the tank to cycle! ;) )
This comes back to the recommendation to buy your own test kit.

I appreciate that you are currently unable to look after the fish you acquired and you should have taken on some hard lessons.
That said, I don't see why your LFS would not accept the fish back, given that you can't look after them.
He might not be willing to refund you, but he could take the fish.
I agree totally with @wasmewasntit , who makes excellent points and suggestions. This is a battle you have lost and, if you don't know when to quit, you will lose the war and this experience will haunt you forever.

If you remain on good terms with the LFS owner, then perhaps you could hang around his shop more and learn what you can. Perhaps you could even offer to do some free work for him?Before I set up my tanks, I spent ages in different shops, learning what I could and simply enjoying the fish on display. This also gave me the opportunity to talk to the staff.
 
Your biggest problem is you need less fish or a bigger tank or ridiculously more plants or all of the above. The fact that your tank is quite small suggests to me the weird behaviour is caused by irritation from ammonia. Gasping at the surface is possibly from lack of oxygen, but likely nitrite poisoning.
i recently started giving my water for testing every once in every 2 weeks to my local fishstore...they do a free checkup.....and for the both times i checked...i never had ammonia more than 0ppm....also none of my fish gasp at the surface....other than while feeding...they try jumping out of the tank to get food

and the RO water i use is not really soft like you think....it has a TDS around 200-250 and i heard mollies do well around 300-500

and about using tap water...the tap water in my region is considered unfit for consuption due to its high TDS(1200ppm) and pH(around 9)...

they are going great as of now(they eat normally,are active....i see no gasping at surface...no fast breathing....no red or clamped fins...they interact with me)....other than that weird wiggling in that particular corner which is scaring me

ngl even i dont understand about shubunkin being cold water....like they are doing quite well (again the same list of things i have in check)....

about adding plants...yes i am adding more and more over the time...initially only had a small java fern with exactly 4 leaves
 
Why aren't you changing water every day?



ANY water tests are valid and, in your case, the more the better.
When I'm setting up my tanks, I was testing daily and sometimes even twice daily. (It gave me something fish-related to do whilst I was waiting for the tank to cycle! ;) )
This comes back to the recommendation to buy your own test kit.

I appreciate that you are currently unable to look after the fish you acquired and you should have taken on some hard lessons.
That said, I don't see why your LFS would not accept the fish back, given that you can't look after them.
He might not be willing to refund you, but he could take the fish.
I agree totally with @wasmewasntit , who makes excellent points and suggestions. This is a battle you have lost and, if you don't know when to quit, you will lose the war and this experience will haunt you forever.

If you remain on good terms with the LFS owner, then perhaps you could hang around his shop more and learn what you can. Perhaps you could even offer to do some free work for him?Before I set up my tanks, I spent ages in different shops, learning what I could and simply enjoying the fish on display. This also gave me the opportunity to talk to the staff.
i did a heavy gravel clean this time....so i just want those destroyed bacteria (if any ) to get replenished


i will update my values tomorrow...so that you guys can tell whether is it normal or not...
 
i did a heavy gravel clean this time....so i just want those destroyed bacteria (if any ) to get replenished


i will update my values tomorrow...so that you guys can tell whether is it normal or not...
Changing the water will not replenish the bacteria. The bacteria lives on surfaces in your tank. You could change 100% of the water and not affect the bacteria, PROVIDED you use appropriate water conditioner. (If you don't, then the tap water will kill your bacteria).

When you cleaned the gravel, did you do it in aquarium water, (good), or tap water, (bad)?
 
i recently started giving my water for testing every once in every 2 weeks to my local fishstore...they do a free checkup.....and for the both times i checked...i never had ammonia more than 0ppm....also none of my fish gasp at the surface....other than while feeding...they try jumping out of the tank to get food

and the RO water i use is not really soft like you think....it has a TDS around 200-250 and i heard mollies do well around 300-500

and about using tap water...the tap water in my region is considered unfit for consuption due to its high TDS(1200ppm) and pH(around 9)...

they are going great as of now(they eat normally,are active....i see no gasping at surface...no fast breathing....no red or clamped fins...they interact with me)....other than that weird wiggling in that particular corner which is scaring me

ngl even i dont understand about shubunkin being cold water....like they are doing quite well (again the same list of things i have in check)....

about adding plants...yes i am adding more and more over the time...initially only had a small java fern with exactly 4 leaves
It sounds like you are not doing as badly as I thought, certainly better than I was. I still think you might want to use a small amount of tap-water, but it also sounds like you are buying water that vaguely adequate for most kinds of fish if not necessarily perfect.

I am almost inclined to not worry about the weird behaviour, maybe the lighting or the curve of the tank corner makes them see a reflection or something interesting in the room.

I think the odd unexplained death does happen to us all, but if they occur often something might be wrong. We all suspect overstocking, but the deaths themselves kind of reduced stocking; your next problem if you keep the mollies and they survive is that they can get massive, so the lack of swimming space will stress them even if you are managing their water correctly.
 
I will just say I agree with all the others. I think you should just hold off on trying to keep fish for right now. I don't think you are in the right situation to do so. You aren't even able to afford medications or test kits or basic things all fish keepers need.

On another note - the picture of the tank and fish doesn't look very clear... but that fish doesnt look like a Shubunkin. Shubunkins have CALICO coloration (not orange/black) and their tails don't tend to look like that. That fish looks more like a baby long finned Koi than a Shubunkin. He may be a Comet coloring up but he isn't a Shubunkin. But be he Shubunkin, Comet, or Koi, he ideally doesn't belong in that tank.
 
Excellent post Myraan and great advice on how to go forward.

I was thinking we are at an impasse, so hopefully the advice and knowledge will be used to progress with the hobby. I don’t think much more can be said really, without the OP getting a test kit and water changing each day, but I too don’t think this will happen.

Have a google for seriously fish to help research what is suitable for your water chemistry and tank size. Good luck, but please don’t buy any more fish for the tank until you know what is going on. Save that money for a test kit!

At the end of the day @sanchay , you have fish that are experiencing serious and life threatening issues and you came here asking for help, which is absolutely fine and understandable.

It has become sadly obvious that the choice of species mix, aquarium size and basic equipment is incompatible, but as you rightly state, its what you are able to afford and obtain and your family are not as keen as you are to keep the fish. You are not the first to get into this situation and you certainly will not be the last.

I understand your frustration and feeling of helplessness...you want the best for your fish but I think you know deep down that you cannot give the best for them, and that realisation is now showing with your frustrated responses.

There is no easy answer to your difficulties in getting appropriate testing equipment, aquariums etc to keep these fish safe and healthy and you know and understand that - even if you are trying to deny it.

I would rehome the fish, pack away the aquarium and wait til you have a job and a home of your own and can afford to buy everything that you need without having to deal with the family arguments. Take time to learn how to keep fish properly so that you do not repeat these errors again. Fishkeeping is not for everyone, its not as easy or as inexpensive as people assume that it is. It is time consuming, financially and emotionally draining and if you find that you truly cannot give fish the care that they need, then you should wait until you are in a better position and if you still want to keep fish, then waiting a few years til you are independent and can afford it all is the best way forward at this point in time.

Deep down you KNOW that you are not going to be able to keep fish healthy in your present situation, you are fighting to prove your family and everyone else wrong....its not working, you know its not working. Rehome the fish, take a break from trying to keep fish for a few years, get yourself independent and maybe look at keeping fish later in life when the only one you have to answer to is you and not your family. You have tried to do the best that you can but as things stand right now, its never going to be enough and you KNOW that matey. It's time to make a grown up decision and admit defeat....its not your fault, its just not the right time or situation.

Changing the water will not replenish the bacteria. The bacteria lives on surfaces in your tank. You could change 100% of the water and not affect the bacteria, PROVIDED you use appropriate water conditioner. (If you don't, then the tap water will kill your bacteria).

When you cleaned the gravel, did you do it in aquarium water, (good), or tap water, (bad)?

It sounds like you are not doing as badly as I thought, certainly better than I was. I still think you might want to use a small amount of tap-water, but it also sounds like you are buying water that vaguely adequate for most kinds of fish if not necessarily perfect.

I am almost inclined to not worry about the weird behaviour, maybe the lighting or the curve of the tank corner makes them see a reflection or something interesting in the room.

I think the odd unexplained death does happen to us all, but if they occur often something might be wrong. We all suspect overstocking, but the deaths themselves kind of reduced stocking; your next problem if you keep the mollies and they survive is that they can get massive, so the lack of swimming space will stress them even if you are managing their water correctly.

I will just say I agree with all the others. I think you should just hold off on trying to keep fish for right now. I don't think you are in the right situation to do so. You aren't even able to afford medications or test kits or basic things all fish keepers need.

On another note - the picture of the tank and fish doesn't look very clear... but that fish doesnt look like a Shubunkin. Shubunkins have CALICO coloration (not orange/black) and their tails don't tend to look like that. That fish looks more like a baby long finned Koi than a Shubunkin. He may be a Comet coloring up but he isn't a Shubunkin. But be he Shubunkin, Comet, or Koi, he ideally doesn't belong in that tank.
so i gave my water for testing this morning and here are the results

AMMONIA : 0 ppm
NITRITE : 0ppm
NITRATE : 10 ppm
pH : 7.2
TDS : 265 ppm
GH : 14
TEMP : 24c (taken with the thermostat I have)



and little did I know that the fish keeper at the LPS was a retired vet (never thought of this when i gave one of my mollies for anchorworm removal)I was casually talking with him and he told me this

so i asked about the death of my mollies....he was like that could most probably be a death caused by age (my balloon mollies were around 2.5 y/o)....he told that balloon mollies usually dont live as long as the normal mollies as they have compressed spines which could easily trigger swim bladder disorder....

For the wiggling,he told that the mollies might be bored with the surroundings and are trying to go somewhere else via the corner (my tank is surrounded by walls except the front and the tank is surrounded by darkness...i rely on my tank lights for the plants)...you guys were right with the wiggling...so thats no matter of concern now

he accepted that my tank is overstocked...but not the worst one...he asked me to do a heavy gravel vacuum once in every 2 weeks instead of 2 months or a month....he also asked me to mix a little bit of tap water with the RO water to get the required hardness(1 litre of tap water per 10 litres of RO)

he told that shubunkins are actually fish that should be in ponds...but as the ones in my tank have reached their max size(he told these goldfishes reach their max size before 1 year) (one is 2.5y/o while the other is 1 y/o)....he also told that shubunkins can do well in temps below 27c

and for the rainbow which does an S-shape...he told that is some kind of intestinal parasite (he told some biological name which i apparently forgot)...he asked me to isolate it and observe for 3 days and check whether is it doing that again...if so he asked me to bring that fish...so that he can observe it and do the required

currently I am in a dilemma whether to go with you guys or go with the vet
 
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I will just say I agree with all the others. I think you should just hold off on trying to keep fish for right now. I don't think you are in the right situation to do so. You aren't even able to afford medications or test kits or basic things all fish keepers need.

On another note - the picture of the tank and fish doesn't look very clear... but that fish doesnt look like a Shubunkin. Shubunkins have CALICO coloration (not orange/black) and their tails don't tend to look like that. That fish looks more like a baby long finned Koi than a Shubunkin. He may be a Comet coloring up but he isn't a Shubunkin. But be he Shubunkin, Comet, or Koi, he ideally doesn't belong in that tank.
wait what...that guy calls that koi or SK gold...and when i searched up SK gold...shubunkin is the one which i found and looks almost close to this one (actually i remember seeing black and white coloured fish of the same kind...but i went for the yellow)

idk why the pic is not clear...
 
It sounds like you are not doing as badly as I thought, certainly better than I was. I still think you might want to use a small amount of tap-water, but it also sounds like you are buying water that vaguely adequate for most kinds of fish if not necessarily perfect.

I am almost inclined to not worry about the weird behaviour, maybe the lighting or the curve of the tank corner makes them see a reflection or something interesting in the room.

I think the odd unexplained death does happen to us all, but if they occur often something might be wrong. We all suspect overstocking, but the deaths themselves kind of reduced stocking; your next problem if you keep the mollies and they survive is that they can get massive, so the lack of swimming space will stress them even if you are managing their water correctly.
yea...that vet told that the mollies would have wiggled coz they were bored...

he tells that the death is caused by the age....and ngl...with all the mollies i had....none of them grew more than 1.5 inches (i had balloon mollies)
 
Changing the water will not replenish the bacteria. The bacteria lives on surfaces in your tank. You could change 100% of the water and not affect the bacteria, PROVIDED you use appropriate water conditioner. (If you don't, then the tap water will kill your bacteria).

When you cleaned the gravel, did you do it in aquarium water, (good), or tap water, (bad)?
yes i use water conditioner

while cleaning the gravel i do it with the aquarium water....i remove some amount of water into a bucket...move all me decors there...then would gently started vaccuming the gravel by disturbing it slowly....i remove the fish if i had to do a complete gravel vaccum(only did it once when i had some random white worms) where i would just move the disturb the gravel in an aggressive way making my tank from transparent to translucent
 

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