Help Planning And Cycling My New Tank...roma 125

some of the other dwarf cichlids are nice, but i'm not sure on how they'd be with your other fish. They'll eat anything that fits in there mouth...

I like most fish, but I guess you've just gotta keep looking until things stand out :nod:

i quite like black phantom tetra though, they'd possibly fit in
 
The ph has now dropped to 6.0. All the other levels are zero. Going to go and do a large water change now!
 
As a beginner, its just going to be hard to incorporate all the little bits of information coming at you about stocking lists and individual species. You are correct, don't let my comment about the low pH cause you to be paranoid about putting fish in somewhat different pH water than would be ideal for them. Stability is the most important and for most of our fish the full 6 to 8 range sort of thing can often work out. There will be particular fish that are more sensitive than others, but members will usually make noise about them when they see them. We are all better and worse about knowing different species - I'm not an expert on very many at all and many of our experienced members are better at some species than others, so you have to work at it sometimes.

~~waterdrop~~
 
Thanks Waterdrop.

I just done a 50% water change and cleaned away as much of the brown algae as I could. I also removed a couple of the small plants at the front which weren't looking so good and removed the outer leaves of the healthier ones. I will check the levels again later on tonight.

When I asked if the tanks ph is normally lower than the tap water ph, does anyone know how much lower? I'm not destined to have a ph of 6.0 am I?
 
Following this afternoons water change the readings are: (Day 15)

ph 6.4
ammonia 0.25 ppm
nitrite 0 ppm

I will check the readings again tomorrow morning to see what the ph is. I really hope this ph drop doesn't last long!

EDIT: May have been too quick posting the ammonia reading, went to clean the tube out and seen it was at 0 ppm.
 
Day 16

ph 6.0
ammonia 0 ppm

The ph has dropped down to 6.0 again, I have carried out a 50% water change.
 
Day 17

ph 6.4
ammonia 0 ppm
nitrite 0 ppm
nitrate 0 ppm

When I carried out yesterdays water change (including my daughters tank, both ph 6.0) I changed dechlorinator back to the Nutrafin Aquasafe stuff (I had been using API Stresscoat plus). Today both tanks have a ph reading of 6.4 again. Could a declorinator have been responsible for both tanks having a ph crash? Stresscoat breaks the chloramine/ammonia bond, so I wonder if that has anything to do with it? It certainly seems funny that around the time I use stresscoat the ph crashes on both tanks, then as soon as I stop using it I get a reading for ph again!
The ammonia level in my daughters tank has crept up over 0.25 ppm again, but I dont think the bacteria are harmed or killed off in low ph water, it just means they cant multiply? Is that right?
 
I'm finding myself more and more concerned about my low ph. If its at 6.4 now (and has crashed down to 6.0 recently) with only three fish, how low will it drop as the stock is gradually built up? Should I be thinking about raising it up a bit? And if so, whats the best way? I have read about using crushed coral but I believe that will take me into the higher ranges of 7. So what about adding small measured amounts of baking soda to my buckets as I do water changes?
 
Hi kaiser, I keep having such small snippets of time that I can't ever piece together all the details of your case and then have time to comment or make any suggestions, lol. Maybe we can do it little bit by little bit.. its a fish-in cycle? What kind of pH range are you hoping to keep the fish in? Your tap water won't take you any higher than 6.4 it seems?

As a quick answer to your latest question there, I would not consider baking soda (bicarb.) It makes its hardness changes much too quickly! Crushed coral is indeed the method of choice when fish are involved. Its possible you could use a really small amount in a mesh bag in your filter and obtain a small KH/pH rise. My idea would be for us to try and get Robby and OM47 on board and all discuss it as an ideal way to go. If we can't catch them though we may be able to piece together the right direction from your answers to the above questions, given some time.

WD
 
It's a fish-in cycle, where his tap water pH is 6.4 but it keeps dropping to 6.

As WD said, you can't use bicarb with fish but crushed coral is probably the way foward. Keep up the waterchanges and the answer should soon arrive :good:
 
Hi kaiser, I keep having such small snippets of time that I can't ever piece together all the details of your case and then have time to comment or make any suggestions, lol. Maybe we can do it little bit by little bit.. its a fish-in cycle? What kind of pH range are you hoping to keep the fish in? Your tap water won't take you any higher than 6.4 it seems?

As a quick answer to your latest question there, I would not consider baking soda (bicarb.) It makes its hardness changes much too quickly! Crushed coral is indeed the method of choice when fish are involved. Its possible you could use a really small amount in a mesh bag in your filter and obtain a small KH/pH rise. My idea would be for us to try and get Robby and OM47 on board and all discuss it as an ideal way to go. If we can't catch them though we may be able to piece together the right direction from your answers to the above questions, given some time.

WD
Thanks, I will try and give a brief description of events so far regarding the ph. This is a fish in cycle with three platies.
First, my tap water...

ph 6.6
ammonia 0.25 ppm
nitrite 0 ppm
nitrate 0 ppm

My tank held a stable ph around 6.6 for the first 12 days or so. Around this time I switched dechlorinator to API stresscoat plus, to help deal with the ammonia in my tap water, as it breaks the chloramine/ammonia bond in a similar way to prime I believe. A couple of days (or rather water changes) later the ph crashed to 6.0 or below and stayed there for a few days. Water changes were carried out everyday during this time to try and bring the ph back up. After realising the crash coincided with the declorinator change, I switched back to using the Nutrafin Aquasafe which came with the tank. Aquasafe does not break the chloramine/ammonia bond. Since then for the last three days the tank has had a ph of 6.4.
I dont know if stresscoat plus was to blame, but my daughters tank had the exact same ph crash and it too only stabilised when I stopped using it.

I know that cycling and other factors drive ph downward, which worries me because I have such a low ph to begin with. If its at 6.4 with three platies now, what can I expect it to be six months or a year from now with even more fish in? Last night I read another members fish in cycle diary in the pinned topics. By the end of his cycle the ph had dropped 0.6. I know all tanks/cycles are different but reading it was enough to make me think I should maybe take action now, to safeguard against possible ph drops in the future. Not to mention the slow bacteria growth in such low ph.

As far as what ph range I want to keep the fish in, I dont really have a number in mind. But I know I didnt like it at 6.0 or below. Bearing in mind my tap water is blessed with ammonia, it makes sense to me to keep it acidic, to keep the ammonia less toxic. But at the same time I want to encourage bacteria growth and whatever I decide to do, I want the ph to remain stable.

It's a fish-in cycle, where his tap water pH is 6.4 but it keeps dropping to 6.

As WD said, you can't use bicarb with fish but crushed coral is probably the way foward. Keep up the waterchanges and the answer should soon arrive :good:
Thanks Simon :good:
From what I understand about crushed coral, in acidic water like mine the acid eats away at the coral, which in turn raises ph above 7.0. This brings a few questions to mind. The first one being, it raises ph into the high 7 range, is this true? Or is it possible to use a specific amount to set ph at a number of your choice? ie 7.0. How fast does it raise?

Thank you both!


Day 19

ph 6.4
ammonia 0 to 0.25 ppm
nitrite 0 ppm
 
I would personally just look at fish suitable for your normal pH as of now and see what you think...if you don't like the look of what you see (I doubt it, lots of people would kill for that natural pH) then look into raising it.....if at all possible I think it just best to keep with the natural pH if you can, it makes things much easier and more importantly stable!

If you like the look at south american cichlids your pH would work very well with them I believe...e.g. apistogramma being one of the smallest that would be lovely in that tank

Also the pH ranges mentioned for fish species on sites are a guide based on natural habitat parameters but a lot of fish do fine outside of their natural pH range...they just need acclimatizing slooooowly, e.g. I would put new bagged fish in the tank with the lights off and first get them up to a better temp (maybe 10 minutes) then add a little tank water every 10 minutes for an hour until the water has doubled in volume in the bag...then release

Saying all this I really don't know why we're not seeing any nitrite levels. I did a fish-in cycle with 4 danios when I started out in the same size tank and I am sure it was speedier than this. I didn't do a log though so I can't be sure how long each stage took for me.

Can I make a suggestion, it would really help if all the readings you've taken are also put into one post. When you post as you do already, if you also edited the first post putting the readings taken in there it would help anyone see what the trend is much much easier. Just a thought, having all the results in one place to read rather than over several pages is far more useful
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