Hardy Cycling Fish For Angelfish Tanks

[nwzzz]

Hi, after my recent failure of my tank due to disease, I have decided to scrub it clean and start over. I have changed the substrate, filters, and washed everything. My tank specs are:
29 gallon, Aquclear 70(or AC 300), 150W Heater, 18000k 20W light(changing it to 4200k for low light plants soon), flourite base, and sand on top.

I want to start an angelfish tank and through research I have found that the indigenous mates of angels are Ram Cichlids, 2 types of plecos, and Silver Dollars. I want to start cycling my new tank but I don't really like the way Silver Dollars look and Ram Cichlids would be a very expensive fish to start the cycle with. I definitely don't want to cycle with feeders as the bacteria will develop for coldwater goldfishes and not for warmwater tropicals. So my question is:

"What good tankmates for angelfish are there that are hardy enough to start cycling? And I'm looking for active fish, not lethargic ones, and doesn't have to be as colorful as Golden Rams."

Thanks.

 

[Wills]

Hi I would just do a fishless cycle with ammonia and water tests to see how far along you are.

Also its worth pointing out that Angelfish are quite a wide spread fish all over South America and are found with many many fish not just the ones you listed above.

Wills

 

[ZoddyZod]

Silver dollars will get far too big for your tank, so you should rethink that option.

As Wills said, go for fishLESS cycling with ammonia.

 

[nwzzz]

I have a feeling if I do fishless, I'm gonna mess it up >.<
Isn't there any fish that I can cycle to settle bacteria for tropical fishes in my tank?

And, if I did go fishless, is this a good article to follow: http/www.aquahobby.com/articles/e_fishless.php

 

[ZoddyZod]

I have a feeling if I do fishless, I'm gonna mess it up >.<
Isn't there any fish that I can cycle to settle bacteria for tropical fishes in my tank?

can you explain what you are expecting to do when you fish-IN cycle? Are you expecting to simply pop the fish in and leave the tank to sort itself out, more than likely harming the fish in the process, or are you preparing to do large water changes, most likely daily, to ensure that harmful levels of ammonia/nitrite are not present?

There is no fish that is immune to ammonia/nitrite, but some are more resiliant to them. This doesn't mean that they are 'ok' to cycle with, just less likely to die.

I got stuck in a fish-IN situation when I first started (didn't know any better) and I was doing 50% water changes almost daily for around 3 months. Much harder work than a fish-LESS process.

 

[nwzzz]

Yea.. I was prepared to do that. It's just that in many places, I read articles against fishless cycling and more on fish-in cycling. But I'm not sure what to believe. And I was looking for fish that would survive and fishes I want to keep.

 

[waterdrop]

Believe me, Fishless Cycling is easier than fish-in cycling when done right. I'm biased but I feel we have great members here who will band together to help you all along the path of fishless cycling. We have a great Fishless Cycling article and in your thread we can take it into a lot more detail, answering your questions usually daily. Its a great feeling, adding fish to a fully cycled system and leaves you with a new confidence about the hobby.

With fish-in cycling, as a beginner, you are left wondering whether you left your cycling fish with permanent damage to their gills or nerves and you are often exhausted from all the water changing. With fishless cycling (which still takes plenty of patience) you are left with a new respect and understanding about the most core aspect of the hobby.

I hope you'll choose to fishless cycling with us, it can be a great experience in the long run.

~~waterdrop~~

 

[nwzzz]

Ok. I've also ordered some Java Moss and they should arrive within the week. Since the java fern will use the ammonia as fertilizer, should I not put it in the tank during fishless cycling? Should I keep it in a jar and add it when Nitrates start to go up? I did a search of the keywords "fishless" + "planted" and didn't find a topic covering this question. Would live plants mean I should go fish-in...?

 

[ZoddyZod]

Would live plants mean I should go fish-in...?

I think that depends on how many plants you have in the tank. A single piece of java moss is not going to soak up all the fish waste, if your tank was heavily planted then there is an argument that fish-in is better. However, I am no expert at all with this theory, there is a great pinned topic about it here...

http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?/topic/299827-why-we-should-not-fishless-cycle-planted-tanks/

 

[nwzzz]

Thanks Zoddy, I am going to read and then bombard them with the questions I have .

 

[waterdrop]

Right, if you do get serious about the plants (perhaps 70% substrate coverage and more) then it might be a good path for you to follow Dave's article and try for a silent cycle with plants. Let us know how it goes. WD

 

[nwzzz]

Hi, I have found my plants and lighting solution, and now moving onto fishes before going to the fish store. I am thinking of starting with these,

1. Emperor Tetra (about 6 since they are schooling)
2. Black Phantom Tetra (probably 4)

I read that these do not fin nip, as that would be a problem for angels.

3. Crimson Rainbow fish/Bosemani Rainbow fish (only two, but I don't want to keep these just yet =/)

They'll be going straight in with plants so ammonia shouldn't be an issue.

 

[ZoddyZod]

Hi, I have found my plants and lighting solution, and now moving onto fishes before going to the fish store. I am thinking of starting with these,

1. Emperor Tetra (about 6 since they are schooling)
2. Black Phantom Tetra (probably 4)

I read that these do not fin nip, as that would be a problem for angels.

3. Crimson Rainbow fish/Bosemani Rainbow fish (only two, but I don't want to keep these just yet =/)

They'll be going straight in with plants so ammonia shouldn't be an issue.

I cant really comment on adding fish with plants straight away. Have you asked this question in the Plants section? They should be able to give you detailed advice.

 

[OldMan47]

Fish can be added with plants right away if you are that skilled at plants to start with. If you are new to plants, it is a quick way to find yourself doing those 50% daily water changes of a fish-in cycle. Although it can be done, it is always best to start by establishing the plants and get them growing well before you add the fish for a "silent cycle". That way you won't be trying to learn plants while fighting ammonia and nitrites to keep the fish alive.

 

[ZoddyZod]

That way you won't be trying to learn plants while fighting ammonia and nitrites to keep the fish alive.

wise words.

I think the OP may be suffering from the same condition that I, and many others found themselves in at the start of fishkeeping.....the overwhelming need to get the fish as soon as possible! However, it is well worth resisting that urge.

I think you may be viewing adding plants as a quick way of being able to get your fish in the tank. As OldMan says, plants need a bit of skill (more than fish keeping some would say) so planting should not be seen as a 'quick fix'. Have a read of some of the planted pinned topics and you may quickly see how much additional thought and skill can be required to successfully plant a tank.