First Five Days...

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MikeO

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Hi Again!

I have had the tank up and running five days now (fishless) - Here is the current state of play..

Day 1 - Water Added
Day 2 - Left to filter
Day 3 - Added 13ml Ammonia. Ammonia 7ppm. 25% Water change. Ammonia 3ppm. 2ml Ammonia added. Back up to 5ppm
Day 4 - Ammonia 5ppm. Didnt test for NO2 / NO3
Day 5 - Ammonia 2.4ppm NO2 0.4ppm NO3 8ppm

Should I be looking at another water change now - 50% ? Then take the ammonia back up to 5ppm?
 
once you have the correct level of ammonia you want to cycle the filter at then there is no need to change the water, this apart from not killing fish is the good thing about fishless cycling. the ammonia levels will not go anywhere until the cycle has started and as nothing is living in the tank there is no need for fresh water/ water changes constantly.
 
The only water change you will have to do is at the end of the cycle to lower you nitrates.
 
Yup, there is no need at all during a fishless cycle to do a water change. Sometimes people have a pH issue, which a water change might help out by reaching an equilibrium, but this may not be in your case.

Like stated above, the only water change in a fishless cycle that is necessary is at the end after the qualifying week, at which point a water change of 90% should be done to lower the high nitrate level.

-FHM
 
Excellent, thanks. That makes it easier.

So if I have understood the guide correctly, I should keep topping up to 5ppm ammonia until this drops to 0 in roughly 12 hours?

Seems easier than it seemed upon first reading!


Back in the old days I would have just decholronised the water, left it a week, put some mollies in and keep it as clean and stable as possible with small water changes! But then as I discovered, things have changed a lot as far as understanding tanks goes since my last one.
 
Add ammonia back up to 5 ppm, if and only if the ammonia drops down near 0 ppm. Also, you should be adding the ammonia only at the 24 hour mark, not just at random times. When the ammonia drops to 0 ppm within 12 hours, do not add ammonia then, wait another 12 hours (the 24 hour mark), to add ammonia back up to 5 ppm.

-FHM
 
Yeah I am doing the testing at the same time every night so that its 24 hours between whatever I am doing. Thanks :)
 
Yup, good to know! So 12 hours past your testing point(the "24 hour mark" I like to call it), will be where you will know if your tank is cycled or not. If at 12 hours past the 24 hour mark your ammonia and nitrite are at 0 ppm, then you are cycled! :hyper:

After this happens, continue cycling the tank for one more week. This is called the qualifying week where nitrite is sometimes prone to fluctuate; for unknown reasons. It is best to have this happen without fish in the tank.

After the qualifying week is up, go ahead with a 90% water change, re-add dechlorinated, hand-temp-matched water and and fish!

Here is the fishless article I wrote taken from the book I am writing:

Fishless cycling:
Since fish produce ammonia and since ammonia is what the Autotrophic bacteria need to start the nitrogen cycle, why can we not just buy a bottle of ammonia to simulate fish?
*It is a really good idea to start a log of your tank for a fishless cycle.* So for each day you take a reading of ammonia, nitrite, nitrate and pH, you can then put that in your log so you can see how the cycle is coming along.
Step 1: Buy a bottle of ammonia, usually ammonia comes in bottles with 9.5% or 10% diluted ammonia, both will work. Ammonia like this can usually be found at your local hardware store. What is very important about what ammonia you select is that it must only contain ammonia and water. Other additives will hinder the ammonia useless and will not allow the bacteria to grow. If the bottle of ammonia does not list ingredients, then that bottle of ammonia is most likely okay to use, but to make sure give the bottle a good shake. If the ammonia foams up, it is no good. If there are a few air bubbles, then that is nothing to worry about.
Step 2: Add up to 5 ppm of ammonia to your tank by looking at the table below. It is very important that you add the ammonia on a 24 hour schedule.
Step 3: Check the ammonia level by using your test kit to make sure you have added the correct amount of ammonia.
Step 4: Check the ammonia level every day at the 24 hour mark. If the ammonia at the 24 hour mark starts to go down, this means that you are starting to colonize bacteria that process ammonia. At which point the nitrite level will begin to rise. You can then use your nitrite test kit to monitor your nitrite level.
Step 5: At the 24 hour mark, if your ammonia level is nearing 0 ppm, add ammonia back up to 5 ppm. You will soon see that your ammonia level is dropping faster and faster and that your nitrite level is rising. Over time, after adding ammonia back up to 5 ppm at the 24 hour mark for a couple weeks, you will begin to see your ammonia level will soon go down and hit 0 ppm at every 24 hour mark and your nitrite will be either rising, or starting to fall. At this point your nitrate will start to rise.
Step 6: If your ammonia and nitrite are at 0 ppm every 24 hours, then it is time to start taking ammonia and nitrite readings every 12 hours. So let’s say you add ammonia back up to 5 ppm at the 24 hour mark, and then 12 hours later you test your ammonia and nitrite, this is where you will be able to tell if your tank is cycled or not. At this point, your nitrate level will be at a pretty high level, but do not worry about this yet.
NOTE: It is VERY important to ONLY add ammonia at the original 24 hour mark! Not the 12 hour mark! If you are reading 0 ppm of ammonia at 12 hours, then wait until the 24 hour mark (12 hours later) to add ammonia back up to 5 ppm.
Step 7: Once your tank is reading 0 ppm of ammonia and 0 ppm of nitrite at 12 hours, (12 hours after the 24 hour mark) you are nearly there! At this point, continue dosing ammonia up to 5 ppm at the 24 hour mark for one more week! This last week is called the “qualification week.” During this week you may have a slight nitrite spike; this is why you should always perform the “qualifying week.” Once the week is over, and you are getting both 0 ppm of ammonia and 0 ppm of nitrite (double 0’s) then you are cycled!
Step 8: Now do a 90% water change, this is to lower the level of nitrate. Add water back up to full in your tank and add the proper amount of water conditioner. Then you are ready to add your full stocking of fish!

Here is a little example on what I mean about the 24 and 12 hour marks.
Let’s say you start your fishless cycle at 8:00 pm. This means you add your first batch of ammonia up to 5 ppm. The next time you check your ammonia level then would be the following day at 8:00 pm (24 hour later, hence the “24 hour mark”). When your ammonia level starts to drop near 0 ppm at the 24 hour mark (8:00 pm) then go ahead and dose the ammonia back up to 5 ppm. If you are consistently getting a reading of 0 ppm of ammonia every 24 hours after you have added the ammonia back up to 5 ppm the following day, then go ahead and start test for ammonia at 12 hours. EX. Add ammonia up to 5 ppm at 8:00 pm, then at 8:00 am check the level of ammonia. If the level of ammonia is at 0 ppm at 8:00 am, DO NOT add ammonia until the 24 hour mark (8:00 pm).



-FHM
 
Yes, Hi Mike,

You've started a good log style up in your first post. I would just add am or pm right after the day and I'd also test for pH and add that in the daily line. Its not that pH or nitrate(NO3) need to be tested for daily but once or twice would be nice for pH and perhaps weekly for NO3.

~~waterdrop~~ :)
 
That is a very nice write up fat minnow and very easy to understand. You should sell that to the people who make those dummy books and call it cycling for dummies!
 
That is a very nice write up fat minnow and very easy to understand. You should sell that to the people who make those dummy books and call it cycling for dummies!
lol...Thanks a lot, I am glad you like it!

It is currently part of of the book I m writing, which should be done within a year or so.

Thanks again!

-FHM
 
Updated..

Day 1 am - Water Added
Day 2 - Left to filter
Day 3 pm - Added 13ml Ammonia. Ammonia 7ppm. 25% Water change. Ammonia 3ppm. 2ml Ammonia added. Back up to 5ppm
Day 4 pm - Ammonia 5ppm. Didnt test for NO2 / NO3
Day 5 pm - Ammonia 2.4ppm NO2 0.4ppm NO3 8ppm
Day 6 pm - Ammonia 0ppm NO2 3.3ppm NO3 30ppm pH 7.5 - Added 5ml Ammonia - Level up to 6ppm, but think this may be a little higher than actualy as I only left 30 mins to re-test after adding, so leaving as is and might re-test later on once it has been filtering longer, then do a partial change if its still over 5. I think the concentration of the ammonia I have must be really high, as I origianlly added 13ml based on the calculator, but even the 5ml I have added today has taken it over 5ppm. Might start doing it in 1ml addidtions to try and get it spot on next time it drops to 0.


Thoguht I would test the NO2 and NO3 again today just out of interest since the ammonia has gone to zero.

I am pleased the pH has gone up a bit as I plan to keep some cichlids which like slightly more alkaline water - I will be adding bogwood too which I understand can increase the pH.

Suprised to see that a brand new filter has taken 5ppm of ammonia down to 0 so quickly on the first run - hopefully I will be fully cycled in no time! (watch it take 2 months now I have said that. lol).
 
the bogwood leaks tannins into the water which are slightly acidic so if anything it will reduce the pH a little. once the tannins are all gone which will take a while depending on the size of the wood then the pH will not be effected.

also dont forget that the pH will not be at its stabalised level during cycling as it may rise with the cycle and when cycled the pH will be that of the tap water added to the tank unless you add coral etc which will increase it. unless you try to change the pH of your tap water then your tank will be that of the tap water.
 
Updated...

Day 1 pm – Tap pH 6.5 Ammonia 0 Nitrite 0 Nitrate 0
Day 2 pm – N/A
Day 3 pm - Ammonia added to 5ppm
Day 4 pm – Ammonia 5ppm
Day 5 pm – Ammonia 2.4ppm NO2 0.4ppm NO3 8ppm
Day 6 pm – Ammonia 0 ppm NO2 3.3ppm NO3 30ppm pH 7.5 Added ammonia to 6ppm
Day 7 pm - Ammonia 0ppm NO2 3.3ppm NO3 NO TEST Added ammonia to 5ppm
Day 8 pm – Ammonia 0.6ppm NO2 NO TEST NO3 NO TEST Added ammonia to 5ppm
Day 9 pm – Ammonia 0ppm NO2 0.8ppm NO3 NO TEST Added ammonia to 5ppm


Should I be starting to get exicited that it might be almost ready now the nitrite has started to get close to 0? I am hoping to have fish in on the 13th of Feb.
 

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