Another Newbie For You Guys :)

[Josiee]

Hai

I'm Josie (but the username was taken so went for Josiee... hope this isn't too confusing!) I live in Hertfordshire, UK and I will be 17 next week. I am just getting in to the hobby. I have decided to get a Betta fish as my first little project I didn't do enough research before getting my tank and thought that a 1.2gallon plastic 'kritter keeper' would be okay, but I have it next to me with some gravel, a plant and full of water and every time I look at it I feel bad that I will be subjecting this beautiful little fish to something that small for the rest of its life! So I am going out with my mum and her boyfriend tomorrow and they are going to get me something a little bigger for my birthday Probably a 5-10gallon, and I'm thinking I'll probably put an ADF in there too once things are settled down. With the bonus that now I have my little plastic tank to put the frog in if for some reason they don't get along

So... that's me! This is my little plasticky tank... Including hideous gravel that will be replaced with some black gravel asap

I've bought my heater as well, it is made by Interpret and is a 25W Delta Therm. Decided not to put it in until I get the new tank I will get a filter before I get my fish too... hopefully will get a tank that has one included. I hope it doesn't keep me awake at night !

Errr... that was nice and rambly Please if I've made any glaring mistakes already do tell me, but please be nice, I'm new to this!

 

[Wills]

Hi welcome to the forum! When you go out to get your new tank make sure you go as big as you can If you want a male betta with tank mates if you go for the 10g you could perhaps do the male betta 5 small tetras or rasboras and the dwarf frog

Make sure you head over to the begginers resource section and read up on fishless cycling - its the best piece of advice you wont get in the shops! It takes a while and you dont start with fish but when you do add fish they wont die in a matter of days like most peoples tanks start out when first set up.

Look forward to seeing what you get and happy birthday for next week!

Wills

 

[Curiosity101]

Sounds like you're pretty switched on, and that critter keeper would be fine for a few cherry shrimp. If you swapped some things around and made it comfortable for them. Ie. put lots of moss in an a few little hidey holes. You'd also need to filter it somehow... I'm thinking sponge filter due to the size of the tank but you'd need a super small air pump and the noise could get quite annoying.

Any idea where you're going to look for a tank yet? Pets at home sometimes have some good deals available.
The only tanks I would suggest you avoid is the biorb and the fluval edge. Although the main problem I have with them is the small surface area for gas exchange and the functionality. Ie. fluval is a funny shape due to the small maintenance hatch making them harder to maintain properly and the biorbs sphere also it's great for keeping fish.
On top of all that they're like 3x the price of your average rectangular tank!

If you fancy something a bit fancy then I suggest the arcadia arc tanks. Or if you want something just for a betta then pets at home have a lovely looking 17l at the mo for £29 inc filter and light. 20l + is preferable for the betta (as you seem to have read) but 17l shouldn't be a problem. You would probably have to change to a smaller filter though as apparently that one is a bit powerful. An alternative is to just stuff it with loads and loads of foam though... this slows the water flow down.

Anyways... maybe more of a reply than you expected lol.
Welcome

 

[Josiee]

Thank you for the speedy and informative replies

Wills - I will be going as big as the bank of mum and mum's boyfriend will allow Of course I'm joking! I'm not that much of a brat I hope! I think realistically the max I can go sizewise is a 7gallon, as that's what my heater says it goes up to and I really don't fancy taking it back and spending more money on a more powerful one Do they tend to do 7gallon tanks? Or just generally more 'whole' figures like 5,10,15 gallon? A 5 wouldn't be the end of the world, I will be careful not to over stock it

I have just tried to locate the beginners resource section and failed miserably Clever me

Curiosity101 - I was in Pets At Home yesterday and I got my plant and heater there, but I wasn't impressed with the guy who was helping me. He seemed to have had a charisma bypass, and that isn't even an over-exaggeration. Or maybe I'm being mean and he was having a bad day. Who knows! But he was very patronising and made me feel quite uncomfortable when I was just trying to be friendly. Ahh well. I'm going to Aquatic Fanatics in Bishop's Stortford, it seems on their website that they have a great range of tanks and I'm hoping they will be friendlier I can't stand it when people working in shops clearly just don't want to be there! I'm thinking RE the small tank that I will keep it as a spare, maybe keep my bag of gravel etc in it until it becomes useful What is 17l in gallons? About 5?

Again, thanks for all help, it is appreciated

 

[Curiosity101]

17l = 4.5 US Gal

As for tanks...most come as full set-ups so you may not need that heater.

Also second hand is often better in the sense of you get more for your money... so may well be worth checking ebay + classifieds in your area. You'd expect to pay in the region of £30-60 for a full 2ft set-up which normally would be around 60l (15gal)
You never know... you might even get two tanks... one dedicated betta tank and a small community Not that I'm trying to get you into bad habits of buying numerous tanks.

 

[Josiee]

Hmm... I guess if I get something bigger than the heater will put up with and I don't need it anyway, I'll have a spare for if I accidentally-on-purpose end up with more That wouldn't be happening for ages yet anyway, as we're moving house in about eight weeks! One tank will be stress enough to move I think

I'm so excited haha... I want to do it right though, and not rush. Looking forward to my trip tomorrow... Should I start a diary in the Betta section do you think?

 

[Assaye]

Definitely start a diary in the betta section!

Last time I was in P@H I noticed that they have a 25 litre Aqua One tank for about £20. I think it comes with a filter but I don't think it has a heater. Looked lik a good deal, anyway!

I would recommend something 20 litres and above. That's 5 gallons. You want something long and short (like a traditional fish tank), rather than tall and thin as som of the more 'designer' tanks are. This allows the betta to reach the surface more easily. Don't worry too much about the filter flow - as Curiosity said, most filters can be 'baffled' to reduce the flow by putting sponges across the outlet or pointing the outlet towards the back wall.

Bettas also like lots of soft plants to hide in. If you get a tank without a light or are worried about keeping plants alive, get some silks. They are ace and never die on you see about getting him a little cave as well. Whatever decorations you get, make sure they are soft and smooth. Any jagged bits will damage the betta's fins. I use terracotta pots for caves - just normal garden pots that have been washed. With any decorations also make sure there are no small holes the betta could get stuck in. You can easily block small holes with some aquarium sealant and a piece of button/sponge/rock.

Before you get the fish, be sure to read the beginner's resource centre. The information on cycling is a bit baffling for newcomers, especially as many people are not aware of what goes on in the fish tank at a bacterial and chemical level. Understanding a cycle and being ready to handle it will sav you heartbreak later on and will sav your fish a lot of suffering!

Here is a link.

 

[Josiee]

Thank you very much for your helpful post I am going to do some eBay stalking tonight to see if I can grab a bargain. Thanks for the link as well! I will definitely start a diary in the next few days

 

[OldMan47]

Welcome to the forum Josie.
Your small tank will be fine for a single betta if you are willing to do the extra work to keep the fish healthy. (You may not want your mom reading this.) It does require more personal maintenance effort to keep fish in small containers but it can be done if you have no room for more. There are tons of folks who will disagree with me but I have actually done it while most of those people have been listening to each other on the internet and the minimum tank size keeps growing with the telling. A professional breeder, the kind who make a living producing superior betta stock, would think I was crazy giving my bettas a whole gallon as a space to grow bigger. They use much smaller containers at one or two litres and just do complete water changes every couple of days. I normally don't like that much work so I tend to go with tanks of 10 gallons minimum but in those the betta is an afterthought, not the main fish.

 

[Assaye]

Welcome to the forum Josie.
Your small tank will be fine for a single betta if you are willing to do the extra work to keep the fish healthy. (You may not want your mom reading this.) It does require more personal maintenance effort to keep fish in small containers but it can be done if you have no room for more. There are tons of folks who will disagree with me but I have actually done it while most of those people have been listening to each other on the internet and the minimum tank size keeps growing with the telling. A professional breeder, the kind who make a living producing superior betta stock, would think I was crazy giving my bettas a whole gallon as a space to grow bigger. They use much smaller containers at one or two litres and just do complete water changes every couple of days. I normally don't like that much work so I tend to go with tanks of 10 gallons minimum but in those the betta is an afterthought, not the main fish.

A question that is not intended to start an arguement:

What is the expected lifespan of bettas kept in smaller containers? These breeders who keep show stock - the bettas that need to look good are the ones that sell and will be unlikely to spend their entire lives in small containers unless they are also intended for breeding. The ones that are used for breeding are only useful for a year or so, as far as I know. I very rarely hear of 3 or 4 year old bettas being used for breeding. Plus bettas used for breeding don't need to look perfect (intact fins, etc), they just need good genes. Of course, show bettas are frequently kept in small tanks but who shows old bettas? Most are shown in their prime and they don't need to last many years.

From what I have read (and I'll admit that I have little direct experience), small, relatively bare tanks are great for keeping a betta looking good while they are young. I don't tend to hear much about old bettas that have been kept in very small tanks or jars.

If bettas can be kept in 1 gallon 'tanks' and not suffer any problems with lack of fitness, not get bored, not suffer lethargy and other depressive behaviours, then I can only say that my gut instinct is that bettas should have larger tanks and that this gut intinct is not supported by fact.

This is a genuine matter of curiosity. It's all very well stating that breeders use small tanks and jars but that isn't quite the whole story.

 

[OldMan47]

I have no idea what quality of life really means to a fish. I try to provide my fish with plenty of variety and swimming room because I tend to think of them s being similar to people where they would become bored with anything less. I must say that a betta kept with other fish in a large tank, my usual practice, tends to hang out in much the same place all the time rather than swim throughout the tank with the other fish. Bettas, contrary to the reputation people would like to give them, are slow moving docile fish that quickly become victims in an aggressive environment. The purpose built tank that our new member is exploring can be fitted with a few ornaments to provide some interest for the fish to explore and provide a nice long term home. My own bettas run to 5 or 6 years but I just don't follow the breeder pattern of keeping fish in small containers. My fish are for me to enjoy, not to lock away in huge numbers as commercial stock. As you have surmised, a 2 year old breeder is getting to be past his prime and will likely be sold in favor of breeding younger stock. Even the livebearers that I frequently breed in much larger tanks are best if the adults are removed periodically and the younger fish are used as the new breeders. Keeping your breeding stock young and vigorous is a key for almost any breeding project.

 

[Josiee]

Thank you members who have posted It is good to see some different opinions on the matter.

Well, today I got an Arcadia Arc 20L! As well as being suggested here it was really what I thought was most suitable and was the only 20L they had apart from the plastic tanks similar to my 5L. I am really really pleased with it It looks lovely and included the filter and a light. I was very tempted to go for the 35L but they didn't have the light for it and I didn't want to bite off more than I can chew so to speak! I'm going to keep the little plastic one as it will be handy to have in terms of cleaning and transporting etc when we move

Where we stand so far!

I'm going to start cycling the tank tomorrow, once I've bought some better gravel so I can plant my plant (Anyone got any idea what it is btw? Pets@Home man couldn't tell me)

Off to start a journal

 

[Curiosity101]

I see no plant...

 

[Josiee]

The plant is still in my little plastic tank (as shown in first post) until I get some better gravel, which is when I will start to cycle it

 

[Curiosity101]

Ah right. That's cabomba, I suggest you remove it from it's little ceramic pot/ring and remove the rock wool from the roots to allow it to grow properly.