My 24g And It's Evolution

[bennett]

bloozoo2 has suggested I do a thread on the evolution of my dismal 24g (my words not hers). As a result here it is!

I started a thread on the chit chat section here And it grew from there.

The basics- I started fish keeping on the 27th December and it has consumed me entirely. I recognize my fish quicker than my girlfriend (she lives with us ). I bought the setup complete second hand for a, now realized, astronomical price. We reasoned it was complete and all we’d have to do would be set the tank up and everything would be excellent, and to be fair it has been relatively easy! However this section is the only section I check regularly (I press f5 a lot) and I want to construct my 24g into a planted tank, the whole works.

Equipment-
24(us)g tank
fluval 304 (occasional help from fluval one kept wet between uses)
nutrafin co2 set up (home made mixture, jimboo’s recipe tweaked)
20w lighting*
100w massive heater**
horrendous substrate***

Stocking-
3 keyhole cichlids
5 harlequin rasboras
5 glowlight rasboras (tiny)
3 rosy tetra
3 bronze cory
2 panda cory (tiny)
1 clown loach****
1 clown pleco*****

Plants-
Egeria densa
Anubias nana
Cryptocoryne undulata
Echindorus subulatus
Java fern(attached to bogwood)

Plants on their way from greenline-
CEROPTERIS SILIQUOSA (FINE LEAVED INDIAN FERN/WATER SPRITE)
SHINNERSIA RIVULARIS (MEXICAN OAK LEAF PLANT
VESICULARIS DUBYANA (TRUE JAVA MOSS)
PTEROPUS (JAVA FERN TRUE FORM) x3
LILEOPTERUS (MICRO/CARPET SAGITTARIA) x2
PARRULUS (DWARF MINI HAIR GRASS)

Ferts-
JBL ferropol
First layer pure laterite mixed into gravel (and subsequently under sand)


*on its way: be joined by a dual 20w starter set. To give me 2.5wpg
**on its way: 100w hydor theo heater
***to be replaced with sand when planting
****to be rehomed
*****tempted to replace with a smaller pleco


Short term plan-

1. To install new substrate (inc laterite)
2. take delivery of new plants/lighting.
3. Finalize layout and install new lighting


Ongoing-
1. Pester the kings of planted tanks for assistance.
2. Attempt to understand EI
3. Re-home clown loach
4. Replace with fancy/expensive pleco (make sure it doesn’t eat plants)



That’s about all I can think of at the moment. Suggestions/ideas/criticism are all very welcome, plus cheaper ways of doing things are always massively appreciated!

Sit back and enjoy me get frustrated!

Andy

 

[penguinpimp1990]

how does your nutrafin c02 work? Im setting up a 29 gallon planted and looking around for co2 units as i hate DIY's.

 

[Jen]

Sounds like a good plan.

Don't let the EI article overwhelm you. It seemed really confusing to me at first, but after a few reads jotting down the key things to do, it all of a sudden became the most simple thing. Its wierd. There is somuch information to take in, but after a while, it becomes second nature.

Have you done any research with the keyhole cichlids? My limited knowledge of cichlids is that they turn plants into a lunch buffet. Again... I know next to nothing about them, I just dont want to see all your hard work turn into an all you can eat salad bar.

 

[bennett]

penguin-
it works ok. the sachets are rubbish though. it's purely through the use of the ladder that i spent money on it. sadly i've got no results to show yet! only been in a week

basically i only got co2 as it should improve the plants. but i had done pretty much everything apart from lighting and wondered why i didn't get results! lighting seemed v expensive when starting up, not sure why. £30+ isn't that bad, cheaper than replacing plants every month that's for sure!

jen-
they'll have me to answer to if they do! nah they're leaving the plants i have in there at the mo so i hope they do the same with the new plants

i need to order the additional test kits and then i'll take it from there. all you clever people expect pm's asking about this!

 

[paulioo]

The only advice i can give is that there are no short cuts in learing how to maintain a planted tank, especially if you want to have a serious attempt at aquascaping.

Your right to improve your substrate, a good substrate will always help you, its something thats not easily changed/upgraded once your tank has been setup so its better to do that first.

2.5 WPG is ample lighting and you will be able to grow just about anything under that lighting. The down side to that much lighting is that your bound to have algae problems in the begining and/or if your Co2 and fert routine isn't worked out.

I wouldn't worry too much about this, its all part of learning about your tank. You will strike a balance eventually . Every tank is different and each is an independant little world with different conditions. Therefore what works for one person may not work for someone else. I found the EI method caused me more algae than i had ever had before. Whereas other people experienced no algae when using EI method.

If you get the basics right at the begining then you'll have more room for error. i.e Good substrate, adequate lighting and proper ferts and a stable Co2 level. You'll need both macro and micro with 2.5 wpg as well.

Just enjoy the ride, its a learning curve. Dont be affraid to try new things/ideas, it might take a while to discover the correct balance that your tank needs. But DONT give up. It all comes good in the end.

p.s Check ebay for bargains, it can save you a small fortune.

Goodluck
Paul

 

[Jen]

Feel free. I'm always happy to help.

 

[bennett]

ebay is my best friend paul! shame posties are my nemisisis's;s (what is multiple of nemisis?)

the substrate has to go purely on asthetic reasons THEN on the fact it's not beneficial to plants, so that was on the cards. i'm starting to think i should've ordered more of the fast growers to counter the algae, we'll see on that one.

would it be ok to home my fish in a bucket (plus heater) for 20 mins whilst i add the sand/laterite then sand, plant and generally arrange things?
i just thinking that getting the gravel up. then cleaning. then sand etc wouldn't be the best idea, but then a bucket isn't exactly a good shout either

 

[Bloo]

We all have to blame someone - I blamed Jimbooo for having those beautiful pictures of his tanks in his signature.

Great to see you made that thread . It really does help to motivate & inspire yourself when people ask how it's going - especially in times when algae takes a grip (it happens to all of us at some time or another) and you pretend your tank doesn't exist. Or if you don't look, the problems will go away.
Warning: they don't !

The good news is that there are loads of great plant boffs to help you out here. And even from others with limited (plant) experience like myself.
I've harassed many people with pm's (probably mostly George!) for help and guidance.

Look forward to seeing some pictures as you go along.

would it be ok to home my fish in a bucket (plus heater) for 20 mins whilst i add the sand/laterite then sand, plant and generally arrange things?

Absolutely fine that's exactly what I did. Though it took a tad longer than 20 minutes (more like 2 hours)
Edit: though I did add the filter and heater (to the bucket) during this time.

 

[Jen]

Your fish will be fine in a bucket for that lenght of time. Make sure you use tank water to fill the bucket (obviously). If it is going to take longer than, say an hour, I would put your filter in there if you can.

 

[bennett]

awesome. shame i'm going to football saturday, then working sunday!!!! it's going to have to be an all nighter sunday (assuming everything turns up)!!!

dammit gotta buy some sand now

 

[bennett]

no progress on tank, i only ordered things a day ago!

however i have dibs on a 2nd hand pressurized co2 system and EI chems

hurrah

 

[jimbooo]

it sounds like you have a good plan there. i'll just reiterate the substrate change, you will have issues until you get laterite, eco complete or something like it under your gravel. that plus the co2 and things get a lot easier.

feel free to pm me with any questions. i'm happy to help out where needed.

i too have issues with EI. basically it caused big algae problems but to be honest i've put it down to the fact that i am very heavily stocked as far as planted tanks go and i have almost enough nutrients occuring naturally through fish waste. i'd run the tank for a while with the new substrate and co2 and see what happens after a few weeks. then test the water, look closely at the plants and then decide which nutrients you are deficient of.

dont just pile in a load of ferts on day 1 or you'll have no idea what caused the inevitable algae - too many variables.

best of luck and keep us posted.

i'm not saying EI doesn't work as it has been proven but just go slowly.

 

[lljdma06]

Congratulations Bennett, enjoy your tank! I love evolution threads, they are so fun.

 

[bennett]

it sounds like you have a good plan there. i'll just reiterate the substrate change, you will have issues until you get laterite, eco complete or something like it under your gravel. that plus the co2 and things get a lot easier.

feel free to pm me with any questions. i'm happy to help out where needed.

i too have issues with EI. basically it caused big algae problems but to be honest i've put it down to the fact that i am very heavily stocked as far as planted tanks go and i have almost enough nutrients occuring naturally through fish waste. i'd run the tank for a while with the new substrate and co2 and see what happens after a few weeks. then test the water, look closely at the plants and then decide which nutrients you are deficient of.

dont just pile in a load of ferts on day 1 or you'll have no idea what caused the inevitable algae - too many variables.

best of luck and keep us posted.

i'm not saying EI doesn't work as it has been proven but just go slowly.

i wasn't going to start adding things to the water without knowing exactly what i was doing. i'm far too timid for such actions!

i've tried to order a few fast growing plants so hopefully that may nullify some of the algae, along with the millions of snails that seem to live in my tank!

there's already laterite in there, probably not enough though. i felt a bit weird adding it to an already established tank. so when everything comes (monday at the latest) i will be effectively starting from scratch the prospect of this excites me greatly

i'm sure i'll be in touch soon jim

 

[Waterloo Kid]

Just to let you know, I have 4 Keyholes in my tank and they only peck at the plants. They,ve been in there 3 years now!

WK