Water changes

[Metalhead88]

I understand Colin's concern from what he has previously posted in other threads. I would modify it somewhat, by saying that if you have problem source water (the tap water has issues needing to be addressed, such as high nitrate, toxins, copper) then preparing water in containers and then filling the tank can resolve these. But where I differ is in not considering chlorine or chloramine to be such problems. The water conditioners today work instantly. I have used a Python to fill my tanks, some of them over one hundred gallons, ever since I bought my first large tank (a 90 gallon) in 1995. I have high chlorine in my tap water. I begin to refill the tank (having adjusted the temp at the tap before turning the valve to fill) and add the conditioner to the tank in front of the Python for the volume being added. I have never had issues.

If one has the space and the containers large enough to dechlorinate first, then fine; over caution is not usually a bad thing. But I do not consider it necessary, so decide for yourself.

Well said.

I've been using water conditioner as you have since I first took on a big tank as a teenager. No issues ever.

I'd also fall under the no issues with tap water situation.

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[Colin_T]

Whilst you might all be getting away with running straight tap water into your tank and adding dechlorinator to the tank, you cannot guarantee the chlorine/ chloramine levels remain constant. If the water company does work on the pipes or you have unexpected warm weather, the amount of chlorine/ chloramine could be increased without your knowledge, and it can poison the fish.

People choosing to add chlorinated tap water to an aquarium containing fish, and hoping all the chlorine/ chloramine is neutralised before it comes in contact with the fish, are playing Russian Roulette and running the risk of harming or even killing the fish.

Add chlorinated water to your aquarium at your own risk. In my experience, it eventually goes wrong, and with climate change and warmer weather, it might happen sooner than expected.

 

[Metalhead88]

Whilst you might all be getting away with running straight tap water into your tank and adding dechlorinator to the tank, you cannot guarantee the chlorine/ chloramine levels remain constant. If the water company does work on the pipes or you have unexpected warm weather, the amount of chlorine/ chloramine could be increased without your knowledge, and it can poison the fish.

People choosing to add chlorinated tap water to an aquarium containing fish, and hoping all the chlorine/ chloramine is neutralised before it comes in contact with the fish, are playing Russian Roulette and running the risk of harming or even killing the fish.

Add chlorinated water to your aquarium at your own risk. In my experience, it eventually goes wrong, and with climate change and warmer weather, it might happen sooner than expected.

Just out of curiosity, how much water do you keep and where do you store it?

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[Colin_T]

I had triple tier stands and used the top tanks to hold water for water changes. It was dechlorinated, aerated and the GH and pH adjusted for whatever species it was used on.

 

[Lilyann]

Whilst you might all be getting away with running straight tap water into your tank and adding dechlorinator to the tank, you cannot guarantee the chlorine/ chloramine levels remain constant. If the water company does work on the pipes or you have unexpected warm weather, the amount of chlorine/ chloramine could be increased without your knowledge, and it can poison the fish.

People choosing to add chlorinated tap water to an aquarium containing fish, and hoping all the chlorine/ chloramine is neutralised before it comes in contact with the fish, are playing Russian Roulette and running the risk of harming or even killing the fish.

Add chlorinated water to your aquarium at your own risk. In my experience, it eventually goes wrong, and with climate change and warmer weather, it might happen sooner than expected.

Its worked for 13 years- and that's alotta water changes.
I am not gonna sit and stress over that 1% risk of the sky falling on my head.
There are 100 more likely things working in my aquariums that are more likely to happen then this.

 

[AbbeysDad]

@Colin_T just has the old school gremlins to worry about <g>

I use an Eco 396 submersible pump hooked to a Pyhon hose (about $24 on Amazon).
I either pump the water to a drain or outside on the lawn. To refill I often use the same pump to move water from buckets or my 45g rubbermade trash can that's dedicated for this purpose (I have to pre-filter to remove nitrates). My well water nitrates are much lower now so with a sink adapter, I may fill some tanks with water directly from the tap (well water - no chlorine/chloramine to worry about). On the other hand, many, many hobbyists fill their tanks directly from the tap when using the proper amount of conditioner first. There is some debate on whether to use the amount of conditioner for the amount of new water vs. the entire tank volume. Perhaps safest is to use the amount for tank volume based on mfg recommendations. Then again, many seem to only use the amount relative to water being added with repeated success.

 

[FishGuest5123]

Whilst the Python gravel cleaner can be used to drain tanks, it is not suitable for filling them due to the fact it allows untreated tap water to get into the tank. You are better off using a gravel cleaner with a long hose and running it out the door, and a pump and big tub of water to fill the tank back up.

People using the Python gravel cleaner could kill all the fish in their tanks if chlorinated water enters the tank.

. Colin and I disagree on this. Too many people in se the Pythons with no issues at all. I use one in most all of my tanks and I could not clean the tanks without. At least not the large ones. If you use your dechlorinator as you are adding your water, your fish will be fine. I have never had an issue.

 

[Fishmanic]

Has anyone ever figured out how much excess water the python uses to syphon tank water when hooked up to sink tap. I would really like to know how much water we waste when doing that with the python.

 

[Metalhead88]

Has anyone ever figured out how much excess water the python uses to syphon tank water when hooked up to sink tap. I would really like to know how much water we waste when doing that with the python.

It's a whole lot. I plugged my sink to check this one day. It's a huge double sided basement sink that is probably around 50 gallons. When it was about full, I stopped flow and came to the conclusion that maybe 15 gallons was taken out of the tank. So around 35 gallons was tap water.

I now run 2 hoses to drain. One is attached to a pump that goes directly into the tank, the other is attached to the python which I allow to syphon across the room slowly as I gravel vac.

I refuse to waste that much clean water. I don't think it would cost me a whole lot but that isn't the point. Some people in the world and even in the US don't have safe water from their tap.

These are just estimates as I'm not exactly sure how many gallons was removed from the tank or exactly how many gallons my sink can hold. It's gotta be more than double what your removing. It would also depend on length of the hose and height of sink and tank.

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[AbbeysDad]

Has anyone ever figured out how much excess water the python uses to syphon tank water when hooked up to sink tap. I would really like to know how much water we waste when doing that with the python.

Uhm....Once the siphon has started you could turn the tap off!!!

 

[seangee]

Has anyone ever figured out how much excess water the python uses to syphon tank water when hooked up to sink tap. I would really like to know how much water we waste when doing that with the python.

I bet its less than I use to make RO
When I had my 125G I installed a hosepipe adaptor into the lid. It only ever got filled directly from the tap - I just added dechlorinator first.

 

[Metalhead88]

Uhm....Once the siphon has started you could turn the tap off!!!

Depending on how large of a tank you have, the slow syphon can take hours. So many people leave the water running to suck water out faster.

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[Fishmanic]

Uhm....Once the siphon has started you could turn the tap off!!!

If the outlet is higher than intake height, siphoning would not work.

 

[FishGuest5123]

Whilst you might all be getting away with running straight tap water into your tank and adding dechlorinator to the tank, you cannot guarantee the chlorine/ chloramine levels remain constant. If the water company does work on the pipes or you have unexpected warm weather, the amount of chlorine/ chloramine could be increased without your knowledge, and it can poison the fish.

People choosing to add chlorinated tap water to an aquarium containing fish, and hoping all the chlorine/ chloramine is neutralised before it comes in contact with the fish, are playing Russian Roulette and running the risk of harming or even killing the fish.

Add chlorinated water to your aquarium at your own risk. In my experience, it eventually goes wrong, and with climate change and warmer weather, it might happen sooner than expected.

Uh, it’s been 100F here almost daily recently. Only time I do have to use buckets to fill the tanks so I can cool the water first. Ready for Fall!

 

[Jan Cavalieri]

I have a love/hate relationship with the Python. It's very cool that it can both remove water and replace water (and replace it at the water temperature you set it at). You can do it from over 50 feet away. Like many of the others, when I switch it to replace the water I put in the dechlorinator first as well. Sometimes I use a little pitcher to pour a little more in halfway. If you're super cautious remove your fish to a bucket for 20-30 minutes and then put them back in when the water is ready.(highly recommended for those of us that worry a lot). In theory this thing is an absolute miracle.

But make sure your plumbing is in really good shape. What I HATE about it is that you feel like you need to be in two places at once - especially when the water source is 50 feet away. Python is a HUGE water waster (but realistically compared to toilet flushes not that bad), to remove water you connect it to your faucet and have it set to siphon water then you turn your facet on full blast for it to get enough suction power from the water to siphon the water to your sink. So, far so good. All that siphon water just goes down the drain Walk 50 feet and you'll see water running out of your tank and follow it and all the gunk down the hose. For a ridiculous amount of money you can buy a 25 cent worth of plastic "hook" that will keep your hose from falling out (or in) your tank - or just balance the hose on some rocks or pay a somebody to hold the hose. (When your're done, flip the lever on the Python in the opposite direction and set the water temperature to what you want it too and let it fill the tank). This is truly the wonderful part - no messy water spills, no buckets.

BUT, this is no problem if your house plumbing drains quickly ALL the time because remember you have it going FULL BLAST at the other end to act as a suction device, as well as have 100 or more liters of water going down the drain. A bathroom sink is generally not the place to connect this to because you will fill up the sink before all the water is siphoned. So you take it down to your kitchen sink (there isn't a bathtub adaptor unfortunately-that would be perfectly safe) and if you have a 60 yr old house like I do you probably have a lot of gunk in your pipes - or suppose the last person that used your sink halfway clogged it up. In that case you may come back to your siphon end and find water all over your floor because it filled up the sink while it was running full blast. Now if you could just stand there and monitor it (which is what I generally do) then you can stop it, let the sink drain and start it running again. But if you didn't bribe somebody to watch the other end then you'd also better be running back to your tank and making sure your fish still have enough water to breathe in. The easy solution is just to stop the process occasionally then walk to the other end and see how close you are to emptying (or filling ) your tank. You get a feel for it. Same problem when filling your tank - you have to keep a close eye on how far it is to being filled then run 50 feet and turn off the water (keep in mind there is water in the hose)

Another precaution - the hole opening is pretty large and fish aren't the sharpest Crayola's in the box so instead of thinking "OMG that thing is going to suck me 50 feet to my death" - they love to stick their heads in once in a while to see what this thing is (It always makes me scream). It's really only a risk with your smallest fish (can you see somebody chasing the fish down 50 feet of hose and trying to catch it at the end!!) I would lose that race.

Also - the basic set is only 25 feet - MUCH more manageable unless you need it to be longer. I'd probably love this thing if it was only 25 feet. You can buy it in sections and attach the sections or buy a 50 ft python if that's the closest size.

As far as connectors - mine fit both bathroom sinks without a connector, but to have it fit my kitchen sink I had to remove the aerator off the faucet and use a standard brass fitting to connect to it probably female to male?? Anyway - something to convert the sex at the end - then connect it to the green plastic fitting that allows you to change the direction the water is going.

BUT WAIT - THERE IS MORE! you have 25 to 50 feet of hose full of water. Your tank is full so you don't want to go that way so you unhook it and take it to the kitchen with you (if you're like me and are on oxygen all the time, you are also dragging a 50 ft oxygen hose or wearing a 5lb oxygen tank that is cutting into your back by now and can hardly breathe) I imagine drainging 25 feet of hose might not be a big deal even if it gets tangled up with your O2 hose. But 50 ft of draining is one major pain in the butt. Even if I take off my hose and put on a portable tank - it's still so long it's a pain in the neck. Then coil it like you would an audio cable or something and wrap the cover you paid a ridiculous price for and use the velcro closure to tighten it and throw it under the sink (if you have the room).

I went through this exercise because I'm doing big water changes this week (a friend is coming over because I'm tearing down one tank completely to get rid of anything I can't see that may be causing readings of 8 PPM ammonia.) and after writing this I will let her read it and decide if we want buckets or Python. Actually the only issue is that I was planning on filling a LOT of buckets with water ahead of time and letting them sit a couple days to see how much difference that makes on my readings of my tap water (I don't expect it to make any difference on ammonia but we'll see) She's also strong as an ox and can do all the heavy lifting while I clean ornaments and other messy stuff.

So read this and decide if the python is a good or bad fit for you - I still use it once in a while but not like I used to.