Upgrading Tank, Stocking Questions

[BrittxAndersen]

Hello,
So I am relatively new to fish keeping. I bought a 25g tank to start out with and have 6 Platies and 2 CoryCat Fish. I have had this tank going for about 6 months now and am upgrading to a 65g tank in a few days after we move. I have purchased the new tank/new filter and all the other fun stuff for the tank.

I guess my question is my platies are obviously very important to me but my husband wants more than just one type of fish in our tank. What would be the best tank mates for my Platies and CoryCatFish that would give a great visual look but also be a happy community?

 

[CryptFan]

first of all you need at least 4 more corries, but in a 65 gal the sky is the limit! You could get a nice school of 20 or so in there. I would go with some more types of livebearers Or maybe some danios.

 

[Byron]

I agree that you need to increase the group of Corydoras, and given the space in a 65g tank a larger group like CrtyptFan suggested would be best. I might say 15-20, depending if any other substrate fish are intended. Same species, or mixed, up to you, but it is always best to have a few of each species. Cories are very social fish and will always be less stressed and thus healthier the more there are.

Moving beyond that, it will help to know the tank dimensions and the water parameters of your source (tap) water. The GH (general hardness) is most important, then pH. You may be able to track these down on the website of your water authority if you do not already know. And I'll mention here that whenever numbers are involved it is best to know the numbers rather than vague general terms that can mean different things.

Welcome to TFF.

 

[BrittxAndersen]

I agree that you need to increase the group of Corydoras, and given the space in a 65g tank a larger group like CrtyptFan suggested would be best. I might say 15-20, depending if any other substrate fish are intended. Same species, or mixed, up to you, but it is always best to have a few of each species. Cories are very social fish and will always be less stressed and thus healthier the more there are.

Moving beyond that, it will help to know the tank dimensions and the water parameters of your source (tap) water. The GH (general hardness) is most important, then pH. You may be able to track these down on the website of your water authority if you do not already know. And I'll mention here that whenever numbers are involved it is best to know the numbers rather than vague general terms that can mean different things.

Welcome to TFF.

The new Tank is 36 inches wide, 18 inches deep and 24 inches tall.
Based on my current water parameters with a dip stick test kit the tap is 0 for nitrites and nitrates, 6.5 Ph, 0 Kh, 0 Gh. My Current water parameters in my 25g tank are 0 Nitrates, 0 Nitrites, 7.0 Ph, 80 Kh, 30 Gh. I normally like my Kh around 120 and Gh around 30 and Ph closer to 7.5 so my tank is on the lower side of happy for my liking.
In the past I have used Baking Soda dissolved into distilled water to bring up both Kh and Gh. I am not sure if this is a great procedure but my fish have been happy thus far. I read about people doing this before buying my fish and getting them set up.
I also know that using the dip sticks are not entirely reliable and plan to switch to a better water testing kit moving forward. Suggestions?

I am not sure if this makes a difference but I do have a planted tank currently and would like to continue to have a planted tank moving forward. I have not used any sort of vitamins or fertilizers with these plants in 6 months and they seem to be thriving. I currently have 3 types of sword like plants and 3 bamboo looking plants and a moss ball.

I guess I have more questions to go along with what types of fish I should stock in my new 65g. I don't like to use the chemicals to get my water adjusted but with such a large tank I will be using a bit more tap water than distilled water, I feel I will need to use the chemicals to get my water properly adjusted. Suggestions on the best products or ways to get my tap water to be the right balance for my fish?

I was researching crushed coral for raising Kh and keeping Ph stable and wanted to play around with that but don't want to do anything to my current fish that could be harmful. Do you suggest trying crushed coral out? If not, what would you recommend?

Sorry for the rapid fire questions, I love these fish and want to do what's best for them while also enjoying them. When I originally picked out these fish it was because my baby loved to see the fish at the local aquarium and I thought it would bring her some joy to see them at home. These fish have slowly morphed into my other children as well as brought back good memories of my dad who used to have a few beautiful tropical fish aquariums while I was growing up.

 

[Essjay]

Adding baking soda to water will not increase GH though it will increase KH. GH is the amount of calcium and magnesium. KH is the amount of carbonate and bicarbonate. Baking soda is sodium bicarbonate - it does not contain calcium or magnesium so it cannot increase GH.
If you want to increase GH you need something like Rift Lake salts, but altering water chemistry is not something to be undertaken lightly. And you current fish, cories and platies, need different water; cories are soft water fish while cories are hard water.

Why do you want to increase the GH, KH and pH? It is much better to keep fish which need the same parameters as your tap water. Many soft water fish would love your tap water - Byron also has virtually no GH or KH and a very low pH and he has kept fish for many years with no problems. But it will mean not keeping platies as they are hard water fish.

Since test strips can be inaccurate, does your water provider's website give the hardness of your tap water?

 

[BrittxAndersen]

Adding baking soda to water will not increase GH though it will increase KH. GH is the amount of calcium and magnesium. KH is the amount of carbonate and bicarbonate. Baking soda is sodium bicarbonate - it does not contain calcium or magnesium so it cannot increase GH.
If you want to increase GH you need something like Rift Lake salts, but altering water chemistry is not something to be undertaken lightly. And you current fish, cories and platies, need different water; cories are soft water fish while cories are hard water.

Why do you want to increase the GH, KH and pH? It is much better to keep fish which need the same parameters as your tap water. Many soft water fish would love your tap water - Byron also has virtually no GH or KH and a very low pH and he has kept fish for many years with no problems. But it will mean not keeping platies as they are hard water fish.

Since test strips can be inaccurate, does your water provider's website give the hardness of your tap water?

Thank you for responding.
I looked up the water report for my area. Sodium comes in at 11.1(mg/l), Sulfate not determined, pH 7.31, Alkalinity 19.0, Hardness 18.5, Iron not determined, Nitrate as Nitrogen ppm was not determined and Nitrite as Nitrogen 0.10.

The Platies in my current tank have been with me for 6 months, I started with 1 Male and 2 females, I lost one of my original fish during birth-she seemed to of hemorrhaged during the process. They of course started mating and now I have 6 platies (ranging in size from 1/2in to 3in) and many fry(counted 12) from all different sorts of sizes under 1/2in. When I realized they were having babies I knew I needed to upgrade my tank. I do not take the fry out or move any of the existing fish after the babies are born. I do have a couple of small caves and plants/rooted areas for the fry to hide. I guess what I am trying to explain is that most of the platies in my tank have been born there. Wouldn't they be acclimated to my water parameters or am I torturing them?


As for wanting a higher KH, GH and PH, I am not sure why I strive for those numbers. My fish all seem happy and active. They all swim around happily as long as my PH doesn't go below 6.5 and my temperature stays at 80degrees Fahrenheit.

 

[Essjay]

It is hardness at 18.5 that you need. But what is the unit of measurement? 18.5 mg/l calcium carbonate (ppm) is very soft but 18.5 dH (German degrees) is very hard.

 

[BrittxAndersen]

It is hardness at 18.5 that you need. But what is the unit of measurement? 18.5 mg/l calcium carbonate (ppm) is very soft but 18.5 dH (German degrees) is very hard.

From my understanding on the report all of these readings are in mg/l so it would be very soft. However, the test strips indicate its 30mg/l, which is still very soft in comparison to 18dH.

 

[Byron]

Several issues have come in in the recent posts, and some of my response will repeat what others have said, but it keeps my thoughts together.

Assuming the GH is in either ppm or mg/l (these are the same), you have very soft water. You want soft water fish species. If you do this, you will have no water issues and be able to use the tap water "as is" for water changes (using a conditioner obviously, but no other issues). That makes life much simpler. If you insist on keeping livebearers, you must increase the GH significantly so they will have the essential minerals to be healthy long-term. This means preparing water in containers outside the aquarium for every water change. That is a lot of work. And then the softy water fish will begin to suffer.

Re the baking soda and crushed coral...as essjay noted, these are KH not GH aspects. Baking soda is dangerous because it is not permanent so as organics build it ceases to do much and things only get worse. Crushed coral will raise pH but not GH.

The GH is crucial to fish health because each species of freshwater fish on this planet has evolved over thousands of yearts to function within a fairly narrow range of environmental factors, of which water parameters is the most important. It would take a novel to explain all this, how fish are affected; suffice it to say you will have much greater success if you select fish suited to your water. The fish will be healthier, less stressed, and better able to fight off pathogens. Prevention is better than a cure after the fact, and the appropriate environment is key to prevention.

 

[BrittxAndersen]

Several issues have come in in the recent posts, and some of my response will repeat what others have said, but it keeps my thoughts together.

Assuming the GH is in either ppm or mg/l (these are the same), you have very soft water. You want soft water fish species. If you do this, you will have no water issues and be able to use the tap water "as is" for water changes (using a conditioner obviously, but no other issues). That makes life much simpler. If you insist on keeping livebearers, you must increase the GH significantly so they will have the essential minerals to be healthy long-term. This means preparing water in containers outside the aquarium for every water change. That is a lot of work. And then the softy water fish will begin to suffer.

Re the baking soda and crushed coral...as essjay noted, these are KH not GH aspects. Baking soda is dangerous because it is not permanent so as organics build it ceases to do much and things only get worse. Crushed coral will raise pH but not GH.

The GH is crucial to fish health because each species of freshwater fish on this planet has evolved over thousands of yearts to function within a fairly narrow range of environmental factors, of which water parameters is the most important. It would take a novel to explain all this, how fish are affected; suffice it to say you will have much greater success if you select fish suited to your water. The fish will be healthier, less stressed, and better able to fight off pathogens. Prevention is better than a cure after the fact, and the appropriate environment is key to prevention.

Thank you for you response.
So I guess moving forward I will move my Corys to the new tank and then populate that tank with soft water tropical fish(?)

As for my platies they are obviously out of the window to return them so I guess I will continue to raise them in my 25g tank and start storing ready water for tank changes. Is there anything I can do for them to raise the GH once the Corydoras are out of their tank?
Do people adopt fish?

I am kind of bummed out because I had hoped to move my platies over to the new tank but if I am stressing them out I don't want to take the risk of killing them by moving them to a tank with a larger mass of water that I could potentially screw up.

 

[Byron]

So I guess moving forward I will move my Corys to the new tank and then populate that tank with soft water tropical fish(?)

Yes, excellent.

As for my platies they are obviously out of the window to return them so I guess I will continue to raise them in my 25g tank and start storing ready water for tank changes. Is there anything I can do for them to raise the GH once the Corydoras are out of their tank?
Do people adopt fish?

Local aquarists might take the platies. Maybe the store or another store will just take them free (with common fish like livebearers, not usual I admit)?

In the 25g, they will be OK on their own with harder water, and this is fairly easy here. You can use the mineral salts like those for rift lake cichlids, but that gets expensive and means preparing water outside the tank as I mentioned previously. A simpler way would be to replace the substrate with an aragonite sand or fine gravel. This is what is termed a calcareous substyrate, one that continually slowly dissolves calcium and magnesium into the water, raise GH, KH and pH. With only the livebearers, it will not really matter how high these go. I did this many years ago for a tank of mollies, and a tank of rift lake cichlids. If you had fish that cold be affected by a higher GH/pH, the water preparation with mineral salts would be needed, but with just the platies the substrate will work.

Mineral salts does not mean common salt (sodium chloride) like sea salt or table salt, just to be clear. Sodium chloride would not do anything beneficial here, quite the opposite.

 

[BrittxAndersen]

Yes, excellent.



Local aquarists might take the platies. Maybe the store or another store will just take them free (with common fish like livebearers, not usual I admit)?

In the 25g, they will be OK on their own with harder water, and this is fairly easy here. You can use the mineral salts like those for rift lake cichlids, but that gets expensive and means preparing water outside the tank as I mentioned previously. A simpler way would be to replace the substrate with an aragonite sand or fine gravel. This is what is termed a calcareous substyrate, one that continually slowly dissolves calcium and magnesium into the water, raise GH, KH and pH. With only the livebearers, it will not really matter how high these go. I did this many years ago for a tank of mollies, and a tank of rift lake cichlids. If you had fish that cold be affected by a higher GH/pH, the water preparation with mineral salts would be needed, but with just the platies the substrate will work.

Mineral salts does not mean common salt (sodium chloride) like sea salt or table salt, just to be clear. Sodium chloride would not do anything beneficial here, quite the opposite.

Thank you so much for answering my many questions.

Possibly just one more, what type of fish and amounts would you suggest for the 65g soft water tank?
Obviously, my platies have been my main concern and now I am at a loss for the type of fish I'd want to have in this large tank.

 

[Byron]

Thank you so much for answering my many questions.

Possibly just one more, what type of fish and amounts would you suggest for the 65g soft water tank?
Obviously, my platies have been my main concern and now I am at a loss for the type of fish I'd want to have in this large tank.

Answering questions is never a problem and we all learn by asking.

You have so many options in soft water fish for a 65g tank, I think it would best serve you if I suggest you check into certain groups of fish and see what you like.

Almost all fish species originating in South America are suitable from the water parameter aspect, so this includes the characins (tetras, pencilfish, hatchetfish, Characidium), catfish (Corydoras, plecos, etc), dwarf cichlids.

Most species from SE Asia which includes the cyprinids (rasbora, danio, barb, loaches) and anabantids (gourami). Some of the Atherinids (Rainbowfishes) from Australia and New Guinea (some need moderately hard water but many are soft water).

Central Africa has some characins (Congo Tetra is widely available), a few catfish. Not east Africa as that means the rift lakes with their beautiful cichlids and they are fairly hard water fish.