Trying To Plan A Sw Tank...need A Lot Of Guidance.

[kj23502]

Ok a 50 gallon tall is 36 X 18 X 17. That will still leave me a couple feet of floor space in the stand incase I need/want to do anything else under there. Does that sound ok?

Is it possible to have a few refugiums off one tank? I'm thinking one in the sump underneath (that prob doesn't count as 1 b/c it's in the sump)...and maybe in the long future doing another one off the side of the tank in a 30 gallon (maybe bigger) for seahorses. I suppose it might be hard to go back and modify the tank though, unless I pull water from the top of the main tank? Is this feasible?

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Do I really need a glass tank for the sump? Would a big rubbermaid container work ok? I could just do a separate and smaller refugium, right? Smaller means cheaper as far as buying the tank?

 

[Colin_T]

a 36x18x17in tank would be fine as a sump/refugium for the 60x18x26in tank

if you want more than one refugium off the tank then get a big sump and divide it up into smaller compartments. Otherwise divide the outlet from the main tank into two pipes and use one pipe in each sump. You will need a second pump to return the water to the main tank from the 2nd sump.

you can have sumps/refugiums anywhere, even next to the main tank. It's just a matter of getting the water from the main tank into the refugium with the seahorses and then pumping it back into the main tank. You can have the seahorse tank at the same height as the main tank and just have a piece of pipe going from one tank to the other. Then as you pump water out of the seahorse tank into the main tank, the water level will drop a bit and new water from the main tank will flow into the seahorse tank. You will need some sponge over the ends of the pipe to prevent things getting into it and blocking it up but it can be done.

sumps/refugiums can be anything that holds water. Plastic, glass, fibreglass, whatever is available and safe for water storage.

 

[SkiFletch]

Sure can use a rubbermaid tank. If you do so, you'll need to use filter socks to capture bubbles and you'll need to brace the tub with rope/strapping around its midsection to prevent bowing longterm I've seen plenty of rubbermaid sumps in my day. If I may make a suggestion... Have a look through craigslist especially at the end of the month for people moving and getting rid of spare tanks for cheap

 

[kj23502]

Thanks Colin and Skifletch, you've both been a big help

I guess first thing is first, build the stand. We went to Home Depot last night to look at wood that was available. I think we're going to used 2 X 4's for the stand itself and then cover it in Oak. They have a board that is mosly mdf (i think) and there's a small layer of oak on top to make it look nice. That's a little cheaper than buying a whole slab or two of pure Oak for the covering. It also works out b/c the only cabinet doors they have readily available are unfinished Oak doors. Go figure I've been thinking, and I'm going to plan putting doors on the ends of my stand as well. I'll have acess to both ends as the sides not against the wall and no furniture is in the way. Then I can get in to work around the ends easier, just in case.

I called my LFS asking about tanks available for sumps, and he said the syphon method that pulls water over the top works really good too. Then I wouldn't have to drill. He said if I do decide to drill to be aware that I may need to fix it or possilby be prepared to buy a new tank A new tank wouldn't bother me Hindsight I'd rather have the 6 foot 125 gallon than the 5 foot tall 125 gallon. He said to come in some time and they can show me a few things. He wants to show me their sump in a box product line I told him I'm going to try and customize(thats why I called in the first place...to look for a tank for my sump), but I suppose taking a look won't hurt, right?!! I was surprised to hear that they actually tell people to throw away their bio-balls that come with it. I've heard of the controversy about them being nitrate producers. I guess one guy that works there is really, really good with saltwater. My bro in-law says so too and a couple of employees said if I needed detailed explanations of stuff then I should talk to him.

Well, I guess first thing is first, get my stand built

 

[SkiFletch]

Sounds good man. Make sure you check through the culled lumber section, you can often find some great deals there. My entire stand was built from culled lumber 2x4's and 1x6 pine boards. Oak stuff is nice for sure, but tbh I'd stay away from MDF. It's not a question of IF but WHEN it will rot away. It's also very dangerous if God forbid you do get a leak and it gets weit... MDF fails REALLY quick when it gets soaked, especially if it's supporting a few hundred pounds of weight. Plywood is actually a much better choice for side panels.

As for drilling, going over the top works, yes, but trust me when I say there's nothing like a drilled tank. Having used an over-the-top box setup once, I'll never do it again. And trust me, drilling is NOT hard AT ALL. The only thing that's required is patience and a couple simple tricks.

As for the sump, go ahead and look at them, but also note the price. most of those acrylic tanks will cost you $200-$400 for something made out of flimsy 1/4 or 3/16" acrylic.

 

[Musho3210]

do a tempered glass test first, theirs some sort of glass test you can do with it that does something with reflection so you can see if it is tempered or not (search polarized glass testing or something like that). Ive never heard of anyone being able to drill a tempered glass tank. If the bottom is no good, you can do the side and make a calfo overflow.

 

[kj23502]

Sounds good man. Make sure you check through the culled lumber section, you can often find some great deals there. My entire stand was built from culled lumber 2x4's and 1x6 pine boards. Oak stuff is nice for sure, but tbh I'd stay away from MDF. It's not a question of IF but WHEN it will rot away. It's also very dangerous if God forbid you do get a leak and it gets wet... MDF fails REALLY quick when it gets soaked, especially if it's supporting a few hundred pounds of weight. Plywood is actually a much better choice for side panels.

As for drilling, going over the top works, yes, but trust me when I say there's nothing like a drilled tank. Having used an over-the-top box setup once, I'll never do it again. And trust me, drilling is NOT hard AT ALL. The only thing that's required is patience and a couple simple tricks.

As for the sump, go ahead and look at them, but also note the price. most of those acrylic tanks will cost you $200-$400 for something made out of flimsy 1/4 or 3/16" acrylic.

Hmmm....thanks. Would the stand look funny with two different woods being used? They only have oak doors that aren't stained yet. If I used pine and oak, would the difference between the two be a little funny?

I didn't think the side panels would be holding any weight I figured the frame would hold the weight and the side panels are attatched to the frame to make it look better? I should double check to see for sure what the other wood was... I know that one side had a thin layer of oak and the rest was a cheaper wood. It'd give the appearance of Oak without being solid oak....Thanks for the building tips I'll go back to the store and check. We haven't purchased any wood yet so it'd be easy to switch the plans a little. *I'm not sure what culled lumber is... but my husband might. We'll check it out. I guess I can always ask at the lumberyard, although I may get a funny look

Musho, I need to add you to my Thank You list as well
I'll search for a test to check the glass.

Do you think this kind of wavemaker is alright?

 

[kj23502]

I've read that live sand in the store that sits on the shelves isn't really that good ,but what about this?

Our Sand is taken in close proximity to reefs to ensure that our sand is actually "Live". Collected in 50 feet of water in the Gulf of Mexico. The only Diver collecting in this pristine area. Animals found in sand are worms, pods, crabs, cerith snails to name a few.The live sand I collect comes in a variety of sizes, from small to larger shell with coralline balls.The color consists of a pale pink from the broken shells. If you buy other sand be sure its Really LIVE. We offer wholesale prices on larger volume orders. Please call for pricing.

From here

 

[kj23502]

Wow, there are actually a lot of You Tube videos on drilling tanks.
I'll link some for reference for others interested.

Video on drilling a tank

Really good one!

Pretty good video too!

An example of why it's important to find out if the tank's glass is tempered or not.

When we get ready to switch it over....I've been thinking about painting the back black. Should I? Or blue? What are people's thoughts?

 

[SkiFletch]

In short, that timer is an On/Off timer which is a piece of junk and will drastically shorten the pump's life span. That live sand is live, but be prepared to shell out LOTS of cash to get it. And cool vids

And to add, the second video much better than the first. Pay attention to when he talks about what he screwed up at the end of the vid

 

[kj23502]

Just about everything I've browsed online is an on/off wavemaker. Could you reccomend something different for me to look at?

I agree the 2nd video is better There's lots of good info to learn from it. By posting the link, other people on the forum interested in the same thing might come across it and hopefully it could help them. Now that I've seen it, I'm not as afraid as I was.

 

[SkiFletch]

Sea Swirls are great for either closed loops or sump returns.

1" SCWD is not a bad product either, again for sump returns or closed loops. A little pricey for as simple a device as it is, but it'll get the job done.

Seio controller works well with Seio pumps, OR AC motored Hydor Koralias. Its unadvertised, but it works.

Ocean Motions 4-way best used on a closed loop if you ask me. They get finnicky with too much backpressure on them in a sump application

Tunze pumps and controllers will also work, albeit much more expensive than the seio controller. Requires Tunze pumps only

Then there's the ultimate Tunze Wavebox which creates a true wave motion in the tank. Break out your wallet though... Tunze says they're coming out with a smaller version sometime within the next year...

 

[kj23502]

The Sea Swirl 1" wave maker's Max Flow Rate is 1150 gph. Would that be enough to do the whole tank? Or should I supplement it w/another one of those or another powerhead. That circulation would be about 9x the tank volume.

my tanks 60"L x 18"W x 26" H.

 

[SkiFletch]

Suppliment it. Remember, the sea swirl is NOT a pump. It must be coupled to a pump to move water. Its basically just a rotating nozzle. However with that rotation creating more random turbulent flow you'll be in much better shape for the health of hard corals especially. Softies don't seem to care about wavemaking but given my own mediocre success with hard corals WITHOUT wavemaking, it's my next priority...

 

[kj23502]

Great info SkiFletch!!!

Would this light be good or overkill? I'd get the version that has 729 total watts. That won't be for awhile, as I plan on only have fish and a few inverts like snails for a little bit. The light I currently have has 96 watts ....would that be alright for fish and snails? It's 2 blue actinic and 2 fluorescents.

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If I'd build a canopy would this be able to fit inside on the tank using the leg mounts or I would I have to hang it?