Re-Setup Of Garra Rufa Fish Tank In A Salon

[AMD64LEGEND]

Good Afternoon Guys,

I have recently set up a Dual tank system which soon will supply Garra Rufa fish. I wanted to check that you all agree with the following:

* The setup i have in place
* The way I have continued the cycle from an earlier cock up. your comments will be greatly appreciated on this:
* I am planning to add 4-5cm fish and start with 35 per tank, progressing up to 60 per tank.

When i started off I Did the wrong thing and purchased used external filters but with new sponges,bio balls, ceramic rings and carbon. The filter half way through the cycle stopped working and the motor heads on both burnt out.I left the tank stagnant for up to three weeks but researched and brought the following new filters: All Pond Solutions - 1400EF Plus Aquarium External Filter - All Pond Solutions Since using these i am very happy with how they are performing, they produce a good flow rate.

I used the existing sponges, bio balls, carbon and ceramic rings from the new set up the ones from my origional filters that stopped working. After day 1 my nitrite and nitrate were at about 2.0, my amonia was at 0. I did a 30% water change and on day two my nitrate and nitrate were at around the 1.0 mark. I am currently on day 4 and my nitrite is at around 0.1 with 0.0 amonia present and a little nitrate.Nitrate is 1.0, My ph of the water is 7.5(This is what is produced from our taps in the area). Soon i believe that i can introuduce the fish as soon as my nitrite and nitrate hit zero. I just need to know if you agree with the way i have continued from my previous sponges. They were cycled from new originally.Of course i only wish to add the fish at the healthiest stage possible

Just to let you know my set up is as follows:

* One dual spa tank
* 2* external filters 1400l/ph with uv light and three tier filtration system.
* 2* standard aquarium heater which is set to 28 degrees c
* 2*Inlet and 2* outlet pipe submerged in the water.
* In the process of setting up 2* air stone units for each tank for extra oxygen for the fish.

My last question is do you believe in adding any chemicals to the tank e.g chlorine remover and or alovera type stress coats?

I had planned to use none as my water would have stood for over 24 hours before i add this to the tank

Look forward to your replies.

AMD64LEGEND

 

[soybean]

But how are you actually cycling the filters? Are you adding ammonia?

 

[AMD64LEGEND]

But how are you actually cycling the filters? Are you adding ammonia?

Before the first filters broke i cycled these with amonia, i think i used 25ml daily which matched the sizing of the tank. the cycle went all the way through to the last stage which was the nitrate. then the filters broke........ Three weeks on i have new filters, have added fresh de-chlorinated water but used the existing sponges, ceramic rings, bio balls from the previous filters that were cycled. I have not started the cycle again.
day 1 of this showed amonia at 0, nitrite at 3.0 and nitrate at around 5.0. they have now crept all the way down to about 0.1 on day 5. I guess i am asking is this method good enough as i have basically continued from the original cycle but just with a three week interval and new water.
kind regards AMD

 

[N0body Of The Goat]

Sticking strictly to the welfare of the fish, you need to react whenever ammonia or nitrites show up using a liquid test kit obove its colourmetric "0" colour (so for my API kit, if the colour has a hint of green [0.25mg/l] rather than being a definite bright yellow). Keeping things simple[sup]*[/sup], a reading of 0.5mg/l needs your immediate attention, this is not borderline dangerous but is critical, at which point you need to remove almost all the water (leaving just enough to cover the fish) before replacing it with similar temperature dechlorinated water (I highly recommend Seachem Prime, very little is needed per water change and for ~24 hours it can help buffer small levels of toxins).

It sounds as if the tanks were not "cycled" before adding the Garras i.e. you did not daily dose ammonia to 4ppm, monitoring ammonia/nitrite/nitrate levels on a daily basis until you got a reading of 0 ammonia for 7 consecutive days 12 hours after redosing.

If the above is true, you have a monumental task on your hands, having 35 Garras per tank, when there are not enough ammonia or nitrite processing bacteria in the filters... This method is hard enough starting with <6 fish per <100l tank! You will need to test the water at least once per day, but ideally before opening to the public and again before leaving for home, with a liquid test kit. Whenever your kit shows a 0.25mg/l colour, it is in your's but especially your Garra's intrest to replace at least 50% of their water while adding some excess dechlorinator (Seachem Prime). Given the number of fish in the tank, it is very feasible that you may have to replace water at least once per day for many months.


[sup]*[/sup]The toxicity of ammonia levels is dependent upon factors including the temperature and pH of the water, 28C pH 8.2 water is more toxic than 28C pH 6.6, ionic ammonia is far more lethal than ammonium.

 

[AMD64LEGEND]

Sticking strictly to the welfare of the fish, you need to react whenever ammonia or nitrites show up using a liquid test kit obove its colourmetric "0" colour (so for my API kit, if the colour has a hint of green [0.25mg/l] rather than being a definite bright yellow). Keeping things simple[sup]*[/sup], a reading of 0.5mg/l needs your immediate attention, this is not borderline dangerous but is critical, at which point you need to remove almost all the water (leaving just enough to cover the fish) before replacing it with similar temperature dechlorinated water (I highly recommend Seachem Prime, very little is needed per water change and for ~24 hours it can help buffer small levels of toxins).

It sounds as if the tanks were not "cycled" before adding the Garras i.e. you did not daily dose ammonia to 4ppm, monitoring ammonia/nitrite/nitrate levels on a daily basis until you got a reading of 0 ammonia for 7 consecutive days 12 hours after redosing.

If the above is true, you have a monumental task on your hands, having 35 Garras per tank, when there are not enough ammonia or nitrite processing bacteria in the filters... This method is hard enough starting with <6 fish per <100l tank! You will need to test the water at least once per day, but ideally before opening to the public and again before leaving for home, with a liquid test kit. Whenever your kit shows a 0.25mg/l colour, it is in your's but especially your Garra's intrest to replace at least 50% of their water while adding some excess dechlorinator (Seachem Prime). Given the number of fish in the tank, it is very feasible that you may have to replace water at least once per day for many months.


[sup]*[/sup]The toxicity of ammonia levels is dependent upon factors including the temperature and pH of the water, 28C pH 8.2 water is more toxic than 28C pH 6.6, ionic ammonia is far more lethal than ammonium.

Just to be clear the Garras are not yet in the tank as i am finishing the cycle, i am asking if the new water i have added and the three week interval will affect the cycle, i have posted all five day results using an API test kit for nitrite,nitrate,ph and amonia.

I plan to do another two changes expected all levels to be at 0 and then next week add the fish

 

[N0body Of The Goat]

Once the original filters broke, unless the media was removed and placed direcly in the tank with a flow of oxygenated water going towards it, the developing bacteria colonies will die off at a rate close to ~10% a day. So if nothing was was done for three weeks, you are almost certainly starting again from stratch or at best a very depleted bacterial colony.

 

[soybean]

Once the original filters broke, unless the media was removed and placed direcly in the tank with a flow of oxygenated water going towards it, the developing bacteria colonies will die off at a rate close to ~10% a day. So if nothing was was done for three weeks, you are almost certainly starting again from stratch or at best a very depleted bacterial colony.

Yes, AMD, this is why I asked how you were cycling. If you don't ha any fish in there, you don't have a source of ammonia for the bacteria to feed off. The bacteria will die and you will not be cycling your tank. You need to add ammonia again like last time until you're getting repeated readings of 0 ammonia and nitrite (after they've had their spikes) and a steady reading of nitrate.

Until this happens your tanks aren't ready for fish.

 

[AMD64LEGEND]

Ok Thank you , your not the first to have said this, i guess that i could risk it but as i have my own tropical aquarium and im a fish lover i will not take this chance and will start the cycle again, hopefully just a week to wait this time

Thanks Soy bean,

I will start the cycle again. thanks for the advice, although i wish to make money from this scheme, my love for fish and their welfare come first and i do not wish to add any without the tank in a perfect state.

Do you agree with adding the api zyme to remove chlorine or just leave the water for over 24 hours to let the chlorine remove naturally?

Also would you recommend adding a stress coat to keep the fish more happy - or as i am thinking stay away from chemicals and keep the fish levels at a perfect measure!

AMD

 

[soybean]

You should definitely add the dechlorinator, it will remove more than chlorine. There a things in water that cannot be removed by standing it for 24 hours. Stress coat will do no harm either, this is personal preference.

 

[AMD64LEGEND]

Ok -Thank you for your advice

 

[AMD64LEGEND]

Good morning all,

Just to let you know that the tank has cycled and the garra fish were added yesterday , 35 were added to each tank (I have started smaller to control the nitrites in the tank.

I do have one question for all the experienced garra fish owners. I am on day 2 now and the fish seem rather scared. I know that they need settling in time which is why I have avoided water change and feeding on day 1 and 2 however on day 2 after placing my hand in they have all run away is this normal ??

We have not attempting to put feet in yet as I feel they need a few more days. Nitrite and ammonia on day 2 are looking clear which is good.

I am just worried my garra fish will not take to any feet can you confirm they need some more moving in time ???

They swim happily around when no one approaches the tank owever hide when ever they are approached -

Any ideas or is patience still required ? I plan to feed them at the end of day 2 with a 10% water change.

 

[fluttermoth]

Are the tanks bare?

Fish will be nervous (and probably stay that way) if they have no hiding places; ironically, they'll be braver and come out more, the more hidey holes they have, as they'll know they always have somewhere to retreat to.

You and I know there aren't any predators in your tank, but the fish don't!

I'm not really familiar with these spa set-ups, but I assume you wouldn't be able to have plants, which is what I'd normally suggest.

Some rocky caves/tree roots would probably serve the same purpose and you'll probably be able to find man made, ceramic ones that would be easy to sterilise.

 

[N0body Of The Goat]

I can only talk about my experiences with Panda Garras, in groups of 3+ these were very confident fish (second only to my Hoplos), that ate readily on arrival home and were very intrested in what I was doing during water changes or general tank maintenance. This was the case in being the only fish in the tank or when added to an existing community.

 

[AMD64LEGEND]

I would defo think that there needs to be some more settling in time, i worry as all the online videos show the garra rufa's are instantly attracted to any part of the body that enters the tank. I know that they are probably well established visitors.

fish spas usually consist of a three tier or 5 tier uv filter system, standard heater (ours kept at 28 degrees , garras live between 26 and 33), oxygen sandstone, inlet and outlet with a complete bare tank. Unfortunately we must protect the humans as well. if rocks are placed in the tank then we will be liable for any Injury sustained. plant are not going to be used as this puts off the customers.

So many of these fish have bare tanks and they are very confident from all the ones i have seen, i am pretty sure that they original Garra ruffa fish as they are identified by their black marks/circles on their rear fins.

I will wait another 24 hours and on day 3 attempt to place my feet in the tnk and see if they take to them