Purely Out Of Curiosity

[BelldandyShanny]

I have a questiong about water test kits.  I know I have seen pretty much everyone say that the quick dip strips are wildly innacurate.  My question is how are they innacurate? Like, false positive, false negative? No reading whatsoever? My main reason for asking aside from just plain curiosity is that everytime I get my water tested, no matter where, be it petsmart or the lfs they always use strips.  As of last test (yesterday) the lady at petco told me everything was a little high, and my ph was at about 7.8 which she said is way high, but well I have a very deep well and I don't feel like messing with that, as fish adapt.  She didn't actually give me any of the other numbers, but told me I couldn't purchase anymore fish because my levels "weren't good" not that I had planned on getting any more anyway. Regardless I went home and did a 50% water change and vac.
 
Anyway, any thoughts or opinions welcome.

 

[MBOU]

They aren't inaccurate per se, its more... they don't give you a very good range of results... its pretty much "everything is ok, hmmm..., that's not good... and oh my god your water is horrendous!" type readings rather than being exact. Personally, I think the strip tests are reliable enough to let you know if you have a serious problem on your hand, like they will tell you if you have ammonia, nitrite or nitrate, but to get an exact reading, its best to back up test with a liquid one.
 
The trouble is with shops using liquid test kits is that to do so, by law they have to do it behind a Perspex screen or in a different room, wear goggles, gloves and an apron. Its ridiculous and hence a lot of LFS in the UK have to use strips to test now... All to do with COSHH (Control of Substances Hazardous to Health).... apparently of ALL the chemicals that staff come into contact with in an aquatic shop, including stuff like Formaldehyde, Malachite, Acetone, and acids of types... the most dangerous chemical of all is actually the gas produced from the chemical reaction in some of the tests. I know Phosphate was one of the bad ones and I think Ammonia the other. Calcium is also meant to be bad... but to a degree they all are.
 
If you buy liquid test kits, it has the chemical hazard warnings on the packaging, if you choose to use it, you do so at your own risk... employers can't force their employees to take the same risks...
 
Bit daft but now you know lol

 

[Clearwaters]

When I started I had them and they were good to tell you if you needed a water change really, but after you start getting more into your tank and spending more money on stock you start to see you need the more accurate readings to keep a tank running correctly and healthy.

 

[BelldandyShanny]

Hmmmm ok that's good to know, I would like to invest in some kind of test kit at some point, I'm possibly thinking of a seachem amonia alert device, to just leave in the tank, combined with like an api master kit, the first being a red flag sort of indicator to "hey I should probably test the lot"  and either increase or decrease my tank cleaning schedule and whatnot.

 

[MBOU]

Tbh as time goes by, you'll need the testing kit less as you get a read on the tank. You'll start to notice signs that you likely have high nitrates such as algae bloom and scum on the surface of the tank...
 
Ammonia you should never have once your  tank is mature, when you do have it, the remedy is the same whatever level it is... as with nitrite...
 
I would get yourself a set of testing strips (you can pick up JBL ones for £9.99 or thereabouts for 50 strips!) and put a little money aside as and when you can to buy yourself a liquid test kit.
 
That said... next time, ask the shop assistant to write down all of your results for you... ask them in a joking way saying you'll forget them otherwise (if you feel uncomfortable asking!). They should have NO qualms about this at all... unless they lied to you of course!
 
Sometimes it just means  they read you wrong lol, when doing tests etc, i dont always give test results... i just say 'its ok... or its not ok...' depending on the customer, if i thought the customer doesnt have a clue what a nitrogen cycle is... its only going to be incredibly patronising of me to start listing off the results and not so nice for the customer. If they look confused, i offer to explain to them and make it seem like hardly anyone knows (and seriously... 99% of customers dont!) so its not just them as no customer likes to be made to feel stupid... and i try to write down what i can because  i know they wont remember lol.
 
Might just be that staff read you wrong and assumed you didnt need all results, i would be concerned though as your ph at 7.8 is close enough to 'great' for a community tank... makes me wonder what your other results are!! Would get it tested and get results again asap if i were you!
 
If staff tell you that community tanks HAVE to have a ph about 6-7 then shop elsewhere. A lot of staff in certain big chains are trained to ask this question and which basic answers to expect, what they dont consider is different hardness in different areas, they dont consider that a lot of fish are either tank bred or pond bred in places like Singapore (when the fish are native to south america) and have been raised in much harder water.
 
I know where I am, the tap water systems are all 7.8 - 8.4 and that covers livebearers, most tetras, barbs, angels, gouramis, loaches and so on... unless you are going for tempermental fish like Discus and rarer species that are likely wild caught... your ph is fine! Dont ever mess with your ph if you can help it...

 

[TallTree01]

I find that liquid test strips are accurate but not as accurate as liquid test kits.
Liquid test strip: your water is disgusting
Liquid test kit: your ammonia levels are 0.4 you're nitrites are at 0.2 and you're nitrates are at 80.

Quite a difference if you want to know WHY your water is disgusting.

 

[daizeUK]

You'll start to notice signs that you likely have high nitrates such as algae bloom and scum on the surface of the tank...

 
Sorry to hijack but why do high nitrates cause scum on the surface?  I know that algae feeds off nitrates but I've not heard it can cause a scummy surface, I get specks of white scum on mine and the fish seem to enjoy eating it, I wondered what it was?  My nitrates are about 50ppm (it's in the tapwater)

 

[BelldandyShanny]

Thanks everyone! Like I said I have a very deep and super hard water well, and I do have a community tank with common fish, but both places have told me to "Lower my ph" and I "should buy blah blah blah" even when they go oh it's so high, and I do explain my water source they still don't really take it into consideration, I mean if it were something I were doing that I could change I would, but since it's just the water I have I leave it be.  That being said I do have a bit of a problem with a bacteria bloom for the past couple weeks, as well as a white fuzzy looking algae thing.  I'm doing water changes 1-2 water changes a week to try to battle it.  I recently changed to sand in my tank and so that may have messed with my levels.  I need some seeded filter media I think to push it back the right way.

You'll start to notice signs that you likely have high nitrates such as algae bloom and scum on the surface of the tank...

 
Sorry to hijack but why do high nitrates cause scum on the surface?  I know that algae feeds off nitrates but I've not heard it can cause a scummy surface, I get specks of white scum on mine and the fish seem to enjoy eating it, I wondered what it was?  My nitrates are about 50ppm (it's in the tapwater)

I have this too and sometimes I get little crunchy looking things floating at the top of the water, is that just from the hard water build up?

 

[cpwebsite]

First they are made very cheaply so the results aren't accurate and can easily be too high or too low. Also, they don't give you exact numbers, so if your ammonia is 0 but you get a not so good batch which is common for test strips it can say not good or your ammonia is 1-2


7.8 isn't that bad, great for livebearers, and fish will adapt. Most of the products they tell will hurt things. Algae is fine, just clean it with a scrubber and when you change the sand don't change do much. Do you have any biological filtration? Plants may help you

Thanks everyone! Like I said I have a very deep and super hard water well, and I do have a community tank with common fish, but both places have told me to "Lower my ph" and I "should buy blah blah blah" even when they go oh it's so high, and I do explain my water source they still don't really take it into consideration, I mean if it were something I were doing that I could change I would, but since it's just the water I have I leave it be.  That being said I do have a bit of a problem with a bacteria bloom for the past couple weeks, as well as a white fuzzy looking algae thing.  I'm doing water changes 1-2 water changes a week to try to battle it.  I recently changed to sand in my tank and so that may have messed with my levels.  I need some seeded filter media I think to push it back the right way.

 

[MBOU]

Daize, i'm not expert but the oily film *can be* attributed to excess proteins in the water which is generally from fish waste and foods, equally... or both of which cause nitrates. So either the oily slick is caused by high nitrates or they have a similar cause and if you have one, its likely you have other?
 
Doesnt tell you how high nitrates are though.. it was more an example, when i had discus (in RO water), i got an oily slick as soon as nitrates hit about 40ppm

 

[BelldandyShanny]

I do have plants, and two penguin 150 power filters, I went and got the second filter just to help with plant debris.

 

[BelldandyShanny]

http/www.amazon.com/API-Freshwater-Master-Test-Kit/dp/B000255NCI/ref=wl_it_dp_o_nC?ie=UTF8&colid=1VUKM1WWAIPS4&coliid=ICSEKU5MLIDDT  on it's way thanks to my mom and amazon prime

 

[Lunar Jetman]

http/www.amazon.com/API-Freshwater-Master-Test-Kit/dp/B000255NCI/ref=wl_it_dp_o_nC?ie=UTF8&colid=1VUKM1WWAIPS4&coliid=ICSEKU5MLIDDT  on it's way thanks to my mom and amazon prime

And about half the price of the product in the UK too!

 

[BelldandyShanny]

at least now when you guys ask me what my levels are I will be able to answer!

 

[MBOU]

Go you!