New tank for Betta - From Biorb to Fluval Flex

[betta86]

Hi all,
I have learnt the hard way that the Biorb Halo tank isn’t too great. It’s a 15 litre and watching my Betta in it I’ve decided he deserves something bigger to explore. Also the filter system in it is a bit of a pain in term of location and I had to change the Biorb pump as it was so loud!

So I have the Fluval Flex 57 litre on its way in the post. Obviously it’ll be empty for a bit to cycle the tank, get it all set up and decorated but I was just wondering if anyone has any advice on any other additions to the tank that I could make.

I also have cherry shrimp, 8 of them and 3 ramshorn snails in my Biorb. My Betta has been flaring and very active since they went in the tank but I don’t know if that’s a) because he’s seeing them. B) because I’m currently trying to deal with a growth on his side and don’t know if that’s annoying him c) the Biorb is too small so he’s seeing the shrimp and things a lot more in close contact than he should. To be honest the flaring seems to be directed out of the bowl at us but he wasn’t doing that before. I’m not sure if it’s the roundness of the bowl annoying him.

Do you think he’d be ok with any other tank mates? Some corys maybe? Also I’ll be making sure he’s in good health before mixing him with any other tank mates. Any advice would be great.

 

[CassCats]

No tankmates, especially if he shows aggressive behaviors just to snails and shrimp. Not even cories will be safe from him, so he needs to be kept by himself.

 

[betta86]

The strange thing is the more I watch him he’s not going near the shrimp he’s flaring out of the tank. The lump on his side seems to be increasing in size rather than going away so I don’t know if this is causing his agitation. I’ll continue to medicate him in the meantime.

 

[AdoraBelle Dearheart]

The strange thing is the more I watch him he’s not going near the shrimp he’s flaring out of the tank. The lump on his side seems to be increasing in size rather than going away so I don’t know if this is causing his agitation. I’ll continue to medicate him in the meantime.

Do you know what the lump on his side is? Do you have any photos?

What are you using to medicate him?

I agree with NC about no other tank mates besides the shrimp and snails. The only cories small enough to work in a 57 litre are also small enough to be killed by a betta, and it's not uncommon for a betta to live with other fish for years, before the owner wakes up to a bloodbath. Cories also have sharp defensive spines, so you could lose the betta too.

They're a solitary, fiercely territorial fish. Adding other fish to their tank is for the keepers benefit, not the betta or the other fish, who may suffer stress from having to share territory, and the aggression hormones, pheromones and allomones released into the water.

 

[FishBearer9845]

Sorry to hijack this thread, I hope truly your fishy makes a swift recovery.
@AdoraBelle Dearheart @essjay is there any difference between say, API Aquarium salt or this from Amazon? Epsom Salts, 1Kg https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B006MXL1J8/?tag=
Just seems backwards value going for the aquarium salt when ‘any’ salt will do? I don’t have a use for it yet but want to keep some on hand.
Thank you

 

[betta86]

No idea what the lump is and posted photos on another thread. Was given advice on another thread to do 70% water changes for 10 days adding aquarium salt everyday. Unfortunately the lump isn’t improving and is instead getting larger. It’s a lump he has had since I got him and it’s pushing through his scales.

Yes I’m aware of all of this having kept Bettas before and with other tank mates who they’ve gotten on well with in the past. I’ve also done a lot of research and watched a lot of videos that recommend certain corys etc which was the reason I was asking. To be honest I was more trying to get to the bottom of whether the newly changed temperament is even anything to do with tank mates or if it’s because of the lump increase which it seems to have coincided with as well.

For photos here is the link to the thread where I talk of the lump. I actually need to update the photos as it’s grown in the last few days.

White lump and marks on Betta

Hi all I recently bought a Betta from a local pet store saving it from a tiny tiny tank and giving him a larger tank all to himself. In buying him I noticed he had a white mark on his side and I hoped to treat whatever it was that he had. I and a few others thought it was a fungal infection...

www.fishforums.net

 

[Essjay]

Sorry to hijack this thread, I hope truly your fishy makes a swift recovery.
@AdoraBelle Dearheart @essjay is there any difference between say, API Aquarium salt or this from Amazon? Epsom Salts, 1Kg https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B006MXL1J8/?tag=
Just seems backwards value going for the aquarium salt when ‘any’ salt will do? I don’t have a use for it yet but want to keep some on hand.
Thank you

Not just 'any' salt will do, it has to be one specific salt.
Salt is a chemical term for the substance produced when an acid and base are reacted together. There are hundreds of salts which is why we need to be specific about which one we mean. In common usage, the word 'salt' is common salt, sodium chloride, just one of the hundreds.



API Aquarium Salt is pure sodium chloride and is the same salt we use when cooking or on the table (though cooking/table salt has anti-caking agents and in some countries iodine added to it which is why we can't use it in fish tanks)
Epsom salt is magnesium sulphate.

Aquarium salt is used added to tanks as an antiseptic.
Epsom salts are used as a bath to draw fluid from a swollen fish. It should not be added to the tank.

edited for spelling

 

[AdoraBelle Dearheart]

Yes I’m aware of all of this having kept Bettas before and with other tank mates who they’ve gotten on well with in the past. I’ve also done a lot of research and watched a lot of videos that recommend certain corys etc which was the reason I was asking. To be honest I was more trying to get to the bottom of whether the newly changed temperament is even anything to do with tank mates or if it’s because of the lump increase which it seems to have coincided with as well.

I can't know from reading a random thread whether someone has kept betta for years, or this is their first ever fish, so I apologise if I'm repeating things you already know, I just can't psychically tell.

I don't think it's possible to tell whether his temperament has changed because of the addition of shrimp/snails, because of his current tank, the lump, or the treatment. It's even possible that his 'chill' temperament before was actually lethargy, and this more active and flaring behaviour is him feeling better. If he was in a cup for a long time, or in poor water conditions, he might have taken some time to recover from that.

Best way to tell would be to put him in the new tank alone and leave the shrimp etc in the biorb. That eliminates one variable at least, and assess his behaviour then.

I would check sources carefully when deciding whether it's okay to keep bettas with other fish. Not many cories can go in a tank as small as a 57 litre tank. It is a large tank to keep a betta alone, but since cories need schools of six or more, I wouldn't keep anything but a dwarf species in it, which I believe would be at risk from a betta. @NCaquatics keeps and breeds a huge variety of cories, so I'd trust her that they wouldn't be safe. Plenty of youtubers and people who keep bettas with other fish will say that it's fine, but notice that even people who are pro-keeping betta with other fish, also have a list of caveats? "it depends on the temperament" "have a back up tank, just in case" etc etc. Bettas don't need the company of other fish. Other fish don't need to be with a betta. So the only reason to force it is because we want to, and to do it and hope for the best. Not because it's good for the fish. The real scientific research is that bettas are solitary in the wild, and that's ingrained into their DNA. That fish release hormones into the water that have all sorts of messages and impacts on other fish, but that we cannot detect without lab tests. So personally, I wouldn't do it.

You've done your own research and can make up your own mind, but you did ask, so I'm not sure why you seem annoyed at getting answers.

The lump - this isn't a definitive diagnosis, I am not an expert in disease. But it looks a little like the beginning stages of lymphocystis to me. In person, does the lump look as though it's, well, lumpy? Like it's beginning to get shaped like a cauliflower?

If it is lymphocystis, then antibiotics and other meds won't work, since it's viral. Fortunately, it's not too awful for the fish, they can live with it, and if you take great care to keep water parameters good, lots of nice clean water and water changes, their immune system can fight and subdue it, and the growths sometimes disappear over time. It seems to affect appearance rather than function. I think @essjay and @Deanasue have had fish that had it and lived well with it. Perhaps they can look at the photos and see what they think.

 

[betta86]

I wasn’t getting annoyed at answers. I was getting annoyed at tone. It was instantly passive aggressive and condescending which I have no interest in, a tone which seems to have continued into this answer.

The simple fact is I bought a fish hoping I could help whatever ailment it had. I was coming on here to both ask for advice on the amount of new tank mates for the tank I’m getting but as a side note whether anyone had had a similar experience of this sort of ailment possibly coinciding with a behaviour change and whether they had any advice going forward. Yes everyone has different opinions on whether tank mates are fine for bettas, or not fine, I’m aware it changes from person to person. Yes I have done my research but on recently joining this forum and getting helpful answers elsewhere on it in other threads I thought I’d check for what people thought on here also.

But I’ve been on forums for years and have no interest in passive aggressive answers. It may be a written platform but maybe check your tone when replying to other people looking for help. I have no interest in continuing this conversation with you. Thank you for the pieces of info you provided but I’m not interested in continuing speaking on this forum. I’ll look for help elsewhere.

 

[AdoraBelle Dearheart]

I wasn’t getting annoyed at answers. I was getting annoyed at tone. It was instantly passive aggressive and condescending which I have no interest in, a tone which seems to have continued into this answer.

Do you know what the lump on his side is? Do you have any photos?

What are you using to medicate him?

I agree with NC about no other tank mates besides the shrimp and snails. The only cories small enough to work in a 57 litre are also small enough to be killed by a betta, and it's not uncommon for a betta to live with other fish for years, before the owner wakes up to a bloodbath. Cories also have sharp defensive spines, so you could lose the betta too.

They're a solitary, fiercely territorial fish. Adding other fish to their tank is for the keepers benefit, not the betta or the other fish, who may suffer stress from having to share territory, and the aggression hormones, pheromones and allomones released into the water.

How on earth was that answer "passive aggressive and condescending"? That certainly wasn't intended at the time, it was just a brief to the point opinion related to your question and some questions about the lump with the aim of trying to help you. "passive aggressive and condescending" seems like the way you interpreted it, maybe from defensiveness, not how it read.

Granted, I had a tone in my second response since you said;

Yes I’m aware of all of this having kept Bettas before and with other tank mates who they’ve gotten on well with in the past. I’ve also done a lot of research and watched a lot of videos that recommend certain corys etc which was the reason I was asking. To be honest I was more trying to get to the bottom of whether the newly changed temperament is even anything to do with tank mates or if it’s because of the lump increase which it seems to have coincided with as well.

Yet I still took a fair bit of time to try to help you with a possible answer for the disease.

You had a tone because apparently I was just supposed to know what experience you have without you saying? I didn't mollycoddle you enough when giving my views on betta, or just say to stick whatever you want in there? And now it's my 'tone' in the first response that was the problem, and not your expectations or your own attitude.

Perhaps check your own issues and responses rather than expecting strangers to pet you on the head while trying to help you, and reading too much into their supposed tone when it's down to your own defensive interpretation.

 

[Essjay]

I have just look at the lump on the betta in the other thread. It is very hard to tell from photos what the lump is. It could be lymphocystis which is caused by a virus so there is no cure and the fish should be kept alone to prevent any other fish catching it. It could be a tumour, which is incurable. Or it could be a bacterial infection, and as we can't get antibiotics in the UK salt and water changes are the first thing to try.

However, the fact that the lump is increasing in size does suggest lymphocystis or tumour rather than infection. I would not put any other fish in the same tank just in case it is lymphocystis. You have not said whether you have any other fish tanks, but if you do I would use separate cleaning equipment just in case it is lymphocystis.

 

[LostBear]

I wasn’t getting annoyed at answers. I was getting annoyed at tone. It was instantly passive aggressive and condescending which I have no interest in, a tone which seems to have continued into this answer.

The simple fact is I bought a fish hoping I could help whatever ailment it had. I was coming on here to both ask for advice on the amount of new tank mates for the tank I’m getting but as a side note whether anyone had had a similar experience of this sort of ailment possibly coinciding with a behaviour change and whether they had any advice going forward. Yes everyone has different opinions on whether tank mates are fine for bettas, or not fine, I’m aware it changes from person to person. Yes I have done my research but on recently joining this forum and getting helpful answers elsewhere on it in other threads I thought I’d check for what people thought on here also.

But I’ve been on forums for years and have no interest in passive aggressive answers. It may be a written platform but maybe check your tone when replying to other people looking for help. I have no interest in continuing this conversation with you. Thank you for the pieces of info you provided but I’m not interested in continuing speaking on this forum. I’ll look for help elsewhere.

I think you're being a little sensitive, Betta. I can't see anything passive-aggressive in the tone of any of the posts on your thread, and people are trying to be helpful. None of us know what experience a new member has, and I think we are all aware that we never know everything - or even that the most experienced fish keeper can sometimes miss something obvious, if they are worried or distracted.

If you choose to go elsewhere, that's up to you of course, but I really don't think you'll find a more helpful forum than this one.

Good luck with your fish - I hope that he recovers.