New 240l Tank. Nitrite, Nitrate Etc Levels?

[rabbut]

Shure 80% waterchanges aren't too bad in a mature tank where the water going in is more or less identical to that being replaced minus nitrates, and they probibly aren't too bad in a new one either. However, I remember reading somewhere that toxic shock works two ways, so I would be reluctant to bring the levels of ammonia and nitrite down too fast, just in case the sudden change were to caurse problems. That is untill suffering is evedent. A this point, I would be happier to take the risk, especialy if the fish were at a point where slightly worse=death. I recomend 50% max unless something is very wrong, just in case there is a large ammount of weight behind the point of toxic shock works two ways, and a larger one make more stress on the fish than nesisary. This extra stress though probibly woulden't kill the fish instantly, but more likely make it more suseptible to disease....not that they aren't alredy suseptibledue to the ammonia and nitrite poisoning.

All the best
Rabbut

 

[st24rsap]

The max change i have done is about 60% when the Ammonia level went above 0.5, since then i have only have to do about 30% changes and the ammonia has stayed around 0.25. Current levels are

PH - 7.6
Ammonia - 0.25
Nitrite - 0
Nitrate - 10 - 15

for the last 5 days the Nitrite has stayed at 0 not rising at all , Ammonia has stayed between 0.25 & 0.5 and the nitrate between 5 & 15. does this seem normal

 

[rabbut]

seems quite slow getting started, but it will get there eventualy. This is the trouble with fish-in cycles, they are often slow compaired to fishless ones. I am supprised that your mature media from your other tank isn't doing anything obvious to help. What type of media is it you are moving accross? (Zeolite, sponge, carbon e.t.c) It might be worth looking at getting some off a member on here.

HTH
Rabbut

 

[st24rsap]

seems quite slow getting started, but it will get there eventualy. This is the trouble with fish-in cycles, they are often slow compaired to fishless ones. I am supprised that your mature media from your other tank isn't doing anything obvious to help. What type of media is it you are moving accross? (Zeolite, sponge, carbon e.t.c) It might be worth looking at getting some off a member on here.

HTH
Rabbut

The only thing i can think of is that the mature media from my other tank wasnt mature and somehow died off before i transfered it, i havnt tested the levels in my other tank since before i transfered the media i just prosumed it would be ok so i will test the leves in the old tank tonight.

So far when i transfered the media i put it directly in with the new media in the new pump/filter, if i can get hold of some more to transfer would it be ok putting it straight into the tank water or does it have to be put into the filter/pump

 

[rabbut]

Its best in the filter or pump, as this is where it gets the most flow. You need flow over the media to keep significant numbers of the bactiria alive for any length of time. How long did it take for you to complete the whole transfur?The media needs to be kept wet at all times, and should be placed into the new tank as quickly as possible. It would appear as though the mature media from your existing tank, for one reason or another, is not carrying bactiria Are you shure that the mature tank dose not run "ammonia remover" in the filter system, as this may be the problem.

All the best
Rabbut

 

[st24rsap]

Its best in the filter or pump, as this is where it gets the most flow. You need flow over the media to keep significant numbers of the bactiria alive for any length of time. How long did it take for you to complete the whole transfur?The media needs to be kept wet at all times, and should be placed into the new tank as quickly as possible. It would appear as though the mature media from your existing tank, for one reason or another, is not carrying bactiria Are you shure that the mature tank dose not run "ammonia remover" in the filter system, as this may be the problem.

All the best
Rabbut

The transfer was done within a few minutes. litterly shut down the new filter/pump removed the lid, took filter from the old tank and transfered straight away. The filter transfered didnt dry out and was only out of the water for a few seconds

To be homest im not sure if it runs "ammonia remover" in the old tank, the filter pump system is internal to the tank and has 1 green sponge, 1 blue sponge, 1 black one and a fine white one on top. I transfered the blue one across.

 

[rabbut]

The transfer was done within a few minutes. litterly shut down the new filter/pump removed the lid, took filter from the old tank and transfered straight away. The filter transfered didnt dry out and was only out of the water for a few seconds

To be homest im not sure if it runs "ammonia remover" in the old tank, the filter pump system is internal to the tank and has 1 green sponge, 1 blue sponge, 1 black one and a fine white one on top. I transfered the blue one across.

Sounds like the Jewel filter system...Yes the blue sponge is the one you want, leaving the rest for the fish in that tank. ery strange that nothing is happening. The only thing I can surgest i media from a different tank.

All the best
Rabbut

 

[st24rsap]

The transfer was done within a few minutes. litterly shut down the new filter/pump removed the lid, took filter from the old tank and transfered straight away. The filter transfered didnt dry out and was only out of the water for a few seconds

To be homest im not sure if it runs "ammonia remover" in the old tank, the filter pump system is internal to the tank and has 1 green sponge, 1 blue sponge, 1 black one and a fine white one on top. I transfered the blue one across.

Sounds like the Jewel filter system...Yes the blue sponge is the one you want, leaving the rest for the fish in that tank. ery strange that nothing is happening. The only thing I can surgest i media from a different tank.

All the best
Rabbut

Yeah im pretty sure the other tank is a Jewel 90

Looks like im on the hunt for someone local with some mature media then, cant find anyone on here thats offering media though local to me but sure ill find someone

 

[st24rsap]

Right i have tested my old tank and got the following readings

PH - 7.6
Ammonia - 0
Nitrite - 0
Nitrate - 40

The new tank has the following readings still, it hasnt had any water change for the last 3 days now

PH - 7.6
Ammonia - 0.25
Nitrite - 0
Nitrate - 10

I have removed another one of the blue Jewel filters and put it straight into the new tank filter/pump system so i guess its now a case of wait and see again

All the fish still seem ok, the tiger barbs have there colour back but my large 3 spotted Gourami does seem a little on the slow side and is up on the surface quite a bit

 

[andywg]

Shure 80% waterchanges aren't too bad in a mature tank where the water going in is more or less identical to that being replaced minus nitrates, and they probibly aren't too bad in a new one either. However, I remember reading somewhere that toxic shock works two ways, so I would be reluctant to bring the levels of ammonia and nitrite down too fast, just in case the sudden change were to caurse problems. That is untill suffering is evedent. A this point, I would be happier to take the risk, especialy if the fish were at a point where slightly worse=death. I recomend 50% max unless something is very wrong, just in case there is a large ammount of weight behind the point of toxic shock works two ways, and a larger one make more stress on the fish than nesisary. This extra stress though probibly woulden't kill the fish instantly, but more likely make it more suseptible to disease....not that they aren't alredy suseptibledue to the ammonia and nitrite poisoning.

All the best
Rabbut

from a recent post of Bignose:

For example, see "Low levels of environmental ammonia increase susceptibility to disease in Chinook salmon smolts " by Ackerman PA, Wicks BJ, Iwama GK, Randall DJ in PHYSIOLOGICAL AND BIOCHEMICAL ZOOLOGY volume 79 JUL-AUG 2006) which showed that fish exposed to low levels of ammonia were more susceptible to disease later on in life. Basically, exposure to any levels of ammonia leads to greater health problems for the rest of the fish's lives. But, the lower that exposure, the less susceptible the fish will be later in its life.

The above shows that ammonia is seen in experiments to cause issues later on in life, even for smaller amounts. Until I see some evidence which indicates that rapidly reducing the amount of a poison in a tank is bad then I would advocate larger water changes as being fine, providing the aforementioned conditions are kept the same.

 

[rabbut]

Sorry andy, can't find that old thread.....I'll drop you a pm if I find it.

What fish do you have in your old tank st24rsap?

All the best
Rabbut

 

[st24rsap]

What fish do you have in your old tank st24rsap?

All the best
Rabbut

My fish are listed below as my sig Rabbut!

since adding the mature filter media yesterday the levels have changed slightly and are now reading

Ammonia - 0.5
Nitrite - 0.25
Nitrate - 10 to 20

 

[rabbut]

since adding the mature filter media yesterday the levels have changed slightly and are now reading

Ammonia - 0.5
Nitrite - 0.25
Nitrate - 10 to 20

Looking better, but another waterchange is in order me thinks The main thing is that your seeing nitrite again.

All the best
Rabbut

 

[st24rsap]

yeah im doing another change now to reduce the ammonia a bit.

Now the cycle seems to have started as im seeing Nitrite readings is there likely to be a spike that i need to watch out for, im checking the water twice a day at the mo and doing changes as required but i have read that spikes can happen very quickly

As for the fish i have, would you say the 240L tank is over stocked?

 

[rabbut]

Yes you would expect to see a spike. You don't have many fish in there though, so it may not be that higher spike.

HTH
Rabbut