Need Help With My Ph

[justin85]

Just did a test of my water in my empty cycled tank and the ph has gone right down which is a bad thing for me as I am planning on keeping cichlids. All through my fishless cycle my ph was stable at 7.5, it has been cycled for over a week now and I have my fish coming next Tuesday so I have time to sort this issue out. Here's the results of my water tests:

Ph: 6
Ammonia: -
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate: -
KH: 200
GH: 0

As you can see my ph has dropped also I didn't get a reading on my GH, I did 2 tests same results.

So the only thing I have added to the water in the last week (apart from ammonia) is Tropic Marin pro cichlid mineral which is ment to keep the PH high and I was guessing the GH.

Any help any advice would be much appreceated as I have 10 cichlids coming in 1 week.

 

[Moby-Krib]

I haven't posted much here but have been keeping Mbuna for a bit over 9 months now,

A ph crash while using a commercial buffer shouldn't happen. It may be a bad batch?
I would change the water, test ph, re dose the buffer, test again.
Or maybe dose up a bucketful and see if you can duplicate the crash.

I personally have never used commercial buffers but rather use a mixture of baking soda, Epsom salt, and aquarium salt to treat my tank with good results.
It took some experimentation to find the exact amount to add to bring my local water to the desired lvls but I now can just add to buckets at maintenance time and keep a steady 8.2.

 

[justin85]

I haven't posted much here but have been keeping Mbuna for a bit over 9 months now,

A ph crash while using a commercial buffer shouldn't happen. It may be a bad batch?
I would change the water, test ph, re dose the buffer, test again.
Or maybe dose up a bucketful and see if you can duplicate the crash.

I personally have never used commercial buffers but rather use a mixture of baking soda, Epsom salt, and aquarium salt to treat my tank with good results.
It took some experimentation to find the exact amount to add to bring my local water to the desired lvls but I now can just add to buckets at maintenance time and keep a steady 8.2.

I was not expecting the PH to crash also, When I purchased this buffer I did a test of a bucket of water first and the results were great, I was planning on doing a 90% water change next monday before my fish come the next day, but I think I might do one tomorrow and try and get this PH sorted. My other options are as you said, use baking soda + Epson salt + aquarium salt which I have got but this buffer has lots of beneficial minerals. Also I forgot to add over the last week I have been lowering the temprature down to its required temprature of 26c ( I had it at 30c to speed up the cycle ) I dont think this had anything to do with the PH dropping though.

 

[Moby-Krib]

26c is just about ideal and shouldn't affect your ph in my opinion.
This is a bit of a mystery really, no bog wood or any acidic leaching materials I'm assuming?

I do agree about the trace minerals from the prepared buffers, I have toyed with the idea of using one, but if it aint broke

 

[justin85]

26c is just about ideal and shouldn't affect your ph in my opinion.
This is a bit of a mystery really, no bog wood or any acidic leaching materials I'm assuming?

I do agree about the trace minerals from the prepared buffers, I have toyed with the idea of using one, but if it aint broke

Nope, there's nothing in there that would be lowering the ph, there is crushed coral in a media back in both te filters and an extra bag at the back of the 3D background. Verry weird. But at least it happened now while there is not fiah in there.

 

[Moby-Krib]

Sounds like you are doing everything right.
I would do as you said and change water add the buffers and see if it doesn't fix itself.

Wish I could be of more help but I have never had to deal with a crash, thank goodness.

 

[justin85]

Sounds like you are doing everything right.
I would do as you said and change water add the buffers and see if it doesn't fix itself.

Wish I could be of more help but I have never had to deal with a crash, thank goodness.

Would the GH dropping out be a cause do you think ?
Also which is more importent GH or KH ?

 

[Moby-Krib]

Sounds like you are doing everything right.
I would do as you said and change water add the buffers and see if it doesn't fix itself.

Wish I could be of more help but I have never had to deal with a crash, thank goodness.

Would the GH dropping out be a cause do you think ?
Also which is more importent GH or KH ?

I'm not an expert by any means and couldn't really comment as to which would be more important.
I use this as my guide line water_chemistry.
I try to keep all the parameters close to the stated ideals.
While I use API for most tests I use Salifert Tests for gh,kh and ph as I personally think they are more precise, but rather expensive to use for everything.

 

[justin85]

Thanks for that, verry helpful.

 

[Moby-Krib]

Just a quick thought. Have you changed the water since you finished cycling? gh drops over time as the minerals don't stay suspended forever. This is compensated for by partial water changes. And a low gh as you were asking, now that I think about it could very likely lend itself to the ph crash. It is kind of normal to see a lower ph at end of cycle before a large water change.

 

[justin85]

Just a quick thought. Have you changed the water since you finished cycling? gh drops over time as the minerals don't stay suspended forever. This is compensated for by partial water changes. And a low gh as you were asking, now that I think about it could very likely lend itself to the ph crash. It is kind of normal to see a lower ph at end of cycle before a large water change.

No water changes as of yet because I thought it was pointless and a waste of water, but tonight I will change 95% and test it before i go bed, then test it again the next day, if the results are the same, which they should be I will add the buffer and test and again test the next day to see if everything is where it should be, then the day before my fish come I will do another large water change and add the buffer.

Quick question, how long will bicarbonate soda and Epson Salts last in the water? If I have any issues I will add these to bring the PH and GH up hopefully stableizing both.

 

[Malawi MaD]

Bicarb will take the PH upto a max of 8.2 but 7.8 is a more normal pH for the mbuna. Then, when the buffer us added that will hold and stablise your water hardness as well as the PH. Only need to add to what you take out when it comes to weekly water changes. A few people do use the epsom salts which will buffer it, but I much prefer to use malawi salts personally as that has an assortment of about 8 minerals. The minerals affect the fishes osmoregulation so the nearer you can get to the make up of the water in the lake the better.

 

[Yanks15]

Bicarb will take the PH upto a max of 8.2 but 7.8 is a more normal pH for the mbuna. Then, when the buffer us added that will hold and stablise your water hardness as well as the PH. Only need to add to what you take out when it comes to weekly water changes. A few people do use the epsom salts which will buffer it, but I much prefer to use malawi salts personally as that has an assortment of about 8 minerals. The minerals affect the fishes osmoregulation so the nearer you can get to the make up of the water in the lake the better.

Are malawi salts needed for Mbuna or advised? Is it based on the individual water make-up of each tank? Substrate type? Rock?

Thanks
Steve

 

[Malawi MaD]

The main thing Steve is to have a stable PH/GH/KH etc.. The salts id highely recommend and they are advised if you are keeping Wild caught fish. With Most tank bred's and F1's just having a stable PH that's at least 7.6 to 7.8 will be perfectly fine. Yes and no really, if you have natural buffers in the substrate/rock/decor etc.. then that's perfectly fine as it will be stable and more than adequate for your tank bred's. With the wilds it will help a lot having the natural buffer but the salts just help out that little bit extra by adding the necessary minerals to your water.

Basically epson salts/bicarb is more than enough for most malawi's but the wilds id say the seachem malawi salts are really needed.

 

[Yanks15]

The main thing Steve is to have a stable PH/GH/KH etc.. The salts id highely recommend and they are advised if you are keeping Wild caught fish. With Most tank bred's and F1's just having a stable PH that's at least 7.6 to 7.8 will be perfectly fine. Yes and no really, if you have natural buffers in the substrate/rock/decor etc.. then that's perfectly fine as it will be stable and more than adequate for your tank bred's. With the wilds it will help a lot having the natural buffer but the salts just help out that little bit extra by adding the necessary minerals to your water.

Basically epson salts/bicarb is more than enough for most malawi's but the wilds id say the seachem malawi salts are really needed.

Always useful info from you. Thanks as always