I'm Venturing Into New Terrritory...and Need Help

[Arashi]

I was thinking long and hard last night while looking at my tanks, and while I like my plastic plants, I thought I would give live plants a try one more time. I used to have live plants a loooong time ago (when I was like 10) and I never knew how to take care of them, and they kept dying on me. But I figure now that I'm older (and hopefully smarter ) and have the best forum in the world (thats you guys you know ) to help me out if I need it, that I would try again.

So I checked the pinned links above, but I still have a few questions about plants. Here we go!

1. I am not planning on changing my substrate. I have gravel. Some of my tanks have very small gravel, some have larger sized. My question is which plants will grow the best in just gravel?

2. In my 29 gallon tank, I have an external filter and an undergravel filter. There is plenty of gravel on top of it (at least 3-4 inches, some places more like 5) for planting ornaments and for my digging fish (my loaches). Will plants be ok growing in a tank with an underfilgravel filter with that much gravel?

3. I have a lot of fish that will eat or nibble on plants...Livebearers, Plecos, and such. Are there any plants that would be more hardy to be able to withstand the snack-attacks of my fish?

4. What is the best 'floating plant'? Right now I use those plastic suction cup plants for terrariums and such for cover for my Gouramis, but I want to go with something more natural and that will not take over my tank (so don't go suggesting duckwort here...it's pretty but I don't want to deal with it. )

5. I have a lot of Livebearers, and so I constantly have babies. So what is the best ground cover plant? I've heard Micro Swords are nice, but will they grow in just gravel, and how fast would they grow? Would I have to cut them down a lot?

6. And finally, what are the best plants for beginners? I'm thinking Java Fern and Amazon Swords, but I need other suggestions...I don't want all 11 of my tanks to have the same plants in them.

I don't plan on doing all of my tanks with live plants at once...probably just one ot two to start off with, and then I will go from there. Now these are all just general questions. If anyone wants to give this plant-newbie a bit more advice, please by all means do!

Thanks so much guys!

 

[konrad05]

I'll be the first to answer some of the questions:

1. You'll want to get plants that develop roots mainly above the gravel, common ones to me are ludwigia, hygrophilia, cardamine and elodea. Though you can get other plants, just buy root tab fertilizers.
2. Yes, plants will be okay, UG filter helps out because the water passing through the roots, also keeping them warm.
3. not really, but if you have loaches, they'll always nibble on your plants. You'll see holes and pieces of plants missing, but only some, like amazon, grass...
4. not sure about the floating plant, but I don't see why you'd want, it'll block a good chunk of light from reaching your plants.
5. the person you'll want to talk to about micro swords is gf225, but I think people have suggested java moss or something for fry
6. I would say the java group, anubias, elodea, hygrophilia, sword (if you use root tab).

Basically, if you invest into lighting and fertilization properly, you should be able to grow any plants. HTH

 

[enchanted]

Arashi it's great that you are getting into plants. What I would recommend though is picking one tank and starting with it. Post all the info here and we can give you all the advice we can.

Once you have done this one, whatever it is, then do another. This way you don't take on too much at once and are not totally dissapointed by 3 tanks w/ dead/dieing plants.

 

[Arashi]

Thanks for all the advice guys! I really appreciate it.

Thats great that the plants will be ok with the UGF...I was really worried about that one.

Now, root tab fertilizers...how do those work? Do you just bury them in the gravel with the roots? And how about those liquid fertilizers...do those work at all? Are there any consequences to the fish?

The main reason I was looking at floating plants for my 29, is because I have two Gourami's and I've read in a lot of places that they like floating plants to use for cover and to excape the light...maybe they were just messing with my head, I dunno.

I do know that I am going to have to get better lighting. What kinds do you guys sugggest? Expecially you konrad...I would love to have a tank looking like yours one day.


I actually took a trip to my lfs today, and lo and behold, they had a sale on plants...like they had read my mind or something. So I probably bought way more than I should have, and I'm definitely going to have to put them in more than one tank. I got a whole different mixture so I can see what works and what dosen't. But anyways these are what I got (to the best of my knowledge and memory ):

- 3 Amazon Swords (these things are pretty big and for $2 a plant I couldn't resist )
- 1 Cabomba
- 2 Red Ludwigia
- 2 of these wispy feathery things...I forgot the name...
- 2 of these kinda spikey dark green thingys...I forgot the name of these too...

 

[enchanted]

First and foremost here is where you need to go:

http/plantgeek.net/plantguide.php

That plantguide will give you the information on all the plants.

Second, you are better with water line fertilizers then root tabs. All plants will use waterline ferts and actually prefer them.

Third, do you have any idea how big an amazon sword gets? Expect it to outgrow a 29 Gallon. The have outgrown 55 Gallons.

2 Red Ludwigia - Ludwiga Repens? If so that is a good plant and very nice looking. But it does require higher light.

1 Cabomba - A High light plant also

2 of these wispy feathery things...I forgot the name... - Watersprite? should do good in most lights.

2 of these kinda spikey dark green thingys - Dwarf Sag or a Val?

Also, remember that you are better off to ask here and get plants from people here who have grown them. You can usually get a bunch of trimmings for the just the cost of shipping.

As for lighting with the size of tanks you should be looking into compact flourescent. If you have a 55 Gallon or other 4' tank you can use what both Konrad and myself use on our 55's but the smaller and larger ones you are just better off to go CF because the pricing difference is actually not that much.

 

[Arashi]

Thanks for the site enchanted! That helped tons! I found out that the wispy stuff, is a Milfoil...still not quite sure what kind, but I believe it's just Common Milfoil. And the dark spikey ones are Anacharis. And the Ludwigia is glandulosa...the Primrose-Willow. I'm going to read more of the articles and stuff later when I have time.

Yeah, I do know how big Amazon Swords get. But I will be doing lots of cuttings, and a few of my friends already want some, plus my lfs said they will take them too. I am also going to be getting a 55 gallon set up soon, and then we are going for the big tanks, like a 125 (I hope!!!) and I want nice big plants to in in it.

I will look into the compact florescent lighting and the water line fertilizers. Right now I got a roast in the oven thats calling my name!

Thanks again so much!!!!

 

[konrad05]

thanks arashi,

I would definately recommend putting 1 root tab under each amazon sword, they're primarily root feeding plants. Also, I would place 1 or so around your other plants. Just simply bury them in the gravel just below the plant. You should also liquid fertilize but be cautious since a lot of fertilizers will give you a big algae bloom, so just cut the recommend dosage in half. About the plants, generally thin leafed and red plants need a higher level of light. So as long as you stick to broad leafed and green you'll be fine until you upgrade your lighting. Depending on the size of the tank, economically I would recommend regular fluorescent bulbs, tri-chromatic (since that's what worked for me). But if you have extra money, and quite a bit of it, then go with compact fluorescent. Strive for 3 watts per gallon but 2-2.5 will do. Oh last thing, the cabomba will give you nothign but headaches, since it'll start sheding, fast. HTH

 

[Arashi]

Thanks for the new info and advice konrad!

I 'm going shopping for fertilizers tomorrow, so I'll check out those tabs, and I'll look into the water line as well.

I'm not sure how much extra money I'll have but I will definitely look into the compact flourescent, at least for my 29 gallon. I need to upgrade the lighting for it anyways.

Oh yeah, I know about the Cabomba and how badly it sheds... It just looks so good. And I sorta have a redish-pink light in the tank I stuck it in, so it makes the Cabomba look like it has a shimmer of purple. Really pretty.

And my fish are loving the Milfoil...especially my Opaline Gourami. They are eating it like mad. Hope I have some left tomorrow...

If you guys want to see my newly planted tanks, I have pictures up now in the Photo Gallery here: http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?showtopic=66063 I think the 10 gallon looks pretty good. The 29 needs to fill out a bit more and it should look good.

 

[Slyspy]

I have Salvinia Natanas as a floating plant in my tank. It does cut the light out a bit (one reason why I got it in the first place) but not enough to make a difference to plant growth IMO, and experience. It looks good from above and strangely other-worldly from below, with its roots trailing out like little hairly legs! I like it. It does grow quickly, but is the easiest thing to cut back - just grab a handful!

PS
11 tanks? Cripes! I wish I had room for more than one!

 

[Mavvy]

"11 tanks? Cripes! I wish I had room for more than one!"

Dang...I only have seven (working)...eight, if you count Fred the Terror Betta's one-gallon...

 

[Arashi]

Hmmm, I think I will look into the Salvinia natanas. It's quite pretty...and has a very neat look to it. Thanks for the suggestion, Slyspy!

And yeah...11 tanks. Plus I still have the Tarantula and Anole tanks as well, so it's actually 13.

 

[BV77]

with what ever lighting you choose, get 5000k full spectrum bulbs. If you use regular flourescents, GE Sunshine bulbs are 5000k full spectrum and available in various sizes at Wal-Mart, Lowe's, Home Depot etc......if you choose cf's, go to AH Supply,,,,,they sell 5000k bulbs there.......the 5000k is the key.....much above that and the light is too "blue" for plants and much below that and it is too "red"

 

[enchanted]

Actually, the recommended bulbs for planted tanks are 6700K.

As for root tabs, my amazon sword does wonderful without them.

You will find it can be less expensive to setup the 55 Gallon than it is to do the 29 Gallon or a 125 Gallon due to the length.

4' is a much standard lenght in a lot of items. Take lighting for instance, you can buy 4' Flourescent lighting fixtures really inexpensively and just ad bulbs for 160W. This can save a lot of money.

 

[Da_Oz]

Ok first if useing a UGF don't add root tabs they will just melt into tank and cause algae. I grew plants with a UGF and they did ok for about 4 months. Then I switched to sand bottom so no UGF and they did alot better. UGF's put to much O2 into the tank and take out all the CO2.

If you don't really up the light amount stay away from anything with color to it. About the only thing that will grow in low light is green plants.

There is about 1,000 good websites on plants so read some of them. If you just learn the basic's you can keep live plants alive.

 

[konrad05]

Well, technically, colored plants aren't "colored" they just don't absorb the color wavelength that they appear