Ich And Medication

[twiki]

OK

With the new fish tank arriving today I had to move the old 60L BiOrb. I did a 50% water change and moved the tank. I also noticed that one of my Angels had little white spots on his sides round his head - bit of research looks like Ich.

So, My first action was to put in a BiOrb First Aid kit - and filter. So after I cleaned the tank, and changed the water I put the First Aid filter in and put in the 1st dosage of medication. (2 sachets of white powder, 1 to be put in the tank each week).

Also yesterday my API Master Test Kit arrived in the post. Figured I'd get one with the new tank - so had a quick test on the water in my BiOrb. Turns out that the water has a little bit of ammonia in and a little bit of nitrite. (somewhere between 0.25 judging by the colour) This is a well established tank, never had any problems in well over 18 months and no new fish for the same period.

The only thing I can think of is that the medication/first aid filter has had some affect?

If this isn't the case then clearly I'm going to have to do daily water changes - but then how will this affect the medication in the tank? Because I am using this BiOrb kit, I only have 2 sachets of power to be administered weekly. If I do water changes will this not remove all the medication?

Should I forget the BiOrb kit, do a 50% water change, and use some other remedy - and keep water changing while the ammonia levels are non-zero while adding more medication daily?

I want to get my fish well before the go into the new tank obviously and I would be literally gutted if they didn't pull through, as they are the main reason the new 200L tank turned up!

 

[WILDER]

How many fish do you have in the biorb.
Angel fish shouldn't be in that tank size they need 20 gallon tanks.
If you have bad water quality is probably overstocked and the filter not coping.

What does the biorb first kit aid treat.

Whitespot looks like the fish has been sprinkled in salt.
Raise temp to 30 and increase aeration.
Read med instructions that you can use the full dose with the fish you keep.

If you have to preform a water change during a med course, just add the correct amount of med back to water removed.

 

[twiki]

How many fish do you have in the biorb.

2 Angels and 2 Bolivan Ram

Angel fish shouldn't be in that tank size they need 20 gallon tanks.

Yes, hence why they are moving into the 200L tank (55 gallon) I just bought.

If you have bad water quality is probably overstocked and the filter not coping.

Well they've been fine for a year as they have been growing, and water quality has been fine. Admitidly I've not tested all the time, just once a month or so, when the local fish centre has been checking my water.

What does the biorb first kit aid treat.

I quote:
The First Aid Cartridge treats most common problems arising from bacterial, fungal or external parasitic infections.
Obvious Fish Stress
Woulds and Ulcers
White spot, gill/skin parasitic attacks

It also says to reduce the temp otherwise oxygen levels may be too low.

Whitespot looks like the fish has been sprinkled in salt.
Raise temp to 30 and increase aeration.
Read med instructions that you can use the full dose with the fish you keep.

No sure it's white spot anymore - his dorsal fin has now developed a tear and looks a bit tatty round his tail fin. The white spots are a little bigger than salt grain and look a little swallon and more like a human white head. His eye looks a litte red too but the gf thinks he's always had reddish eyes.

If you have to preform a water change during a med course, just add the correct amount of med back to water removed.

That's the trouble, the kit comes with a first aid filter to be left in for 2 weeks, and 2 sachets of medicine powder to be administered weekly. If I remove water and replace I don't have any medicine to replace. I'm not sure (as it doesn't say) if the medicine is from the filter, or indeed this powder.

Also I don't know and can't find out what the difference is between the normal filter and this first aid filter.

The ammonia levels have decreased slightly and but nitrite remained the same. The fish are not gasping for air and all eating well, although I have reduced the food. The only odd sign is fin shaking occasionally, which I believe is a sympton of both white spot and nitrite poisoning. So basically I have no idea. I know my angel is poorly but the BiOrb insturctions seem to contradict every other method.

If water is no better tomorrow I'm going to do a water change regardless I think and add "normal" white spot treatment.

The quicker this new tank is up and running the better and I can forget all this BiOrb rubbish!

 

[WILDER]

Its dosn't sound like whitespot to me either if the spots are not the size of a grain of salt.
Its sounds like a bacterial infections.
Any redness to the spots.
Do the eyes look like there bulging out or swollen.
Any pools of blood inside the eye.

Just a tonic med and there crap. remove the cartridge as you are going to need a bacterial med.
Anti internal bacteria med by interpet.
Is it possible to buy an airstone.

 

[twiki]

Its dosn't sound like whitespot to me either if the spots are not the size of a grain of salt.
Its sounds like a bacterial infections.
Any redness to the spots.
Do the eyes look like there bulging out or swollen.
Any pools of blood inside the eye.

Yes redness under the spot, eyes not bulging or swallen, but eye to me looks a little bloodshot.

Just a tonic med and there crap. remove the cartridge as you are going to need a bacterial med.
Anti internal bacteria med by interpet.
Is it possible to buy an airstone.

OK found out the difference between normal BiOrb filers and First Aid Filters is just that the normal ones contain carbon - so I'm guessing keep to the First Aid one with any meds, as I don't want carbon in the filter when using meds.

I will go to the LFS tomorrow and get some anti bacterial stuff and keep chaning water every day/every other day.

The BiOrb has an air stone anyway in the centre already.

I'm trying to get a photo but he's not very photogenic and keeps swimming away from the lens!

 

[WILDER]

It's a bacterial infection.
Good Luck.

Sounds like columnaris spots.
http/www.aquatic-hobbyist.com/profiles/d...columnaris.html

 

[twiki]

It's a bacterial infection.
Good Luck.

Sounds like columnaris spots.
[URL="http/www.aquatic-hobbyist.com/profiles/d...columnaris.html"]http/www.aquatic-hobbyist.com/profiles/d...columnaris.html[/URL]

That sound spot on exactly it, all the symptoms are there.

I've just done a quick partial water change to try and improve the water quality, and also lower the temp - as well as turning down the heater too - I originally increased it when I thought it was Ick.

Hopefully the LFS will have something to treat it.

Thanks for all your help - I'll keep this updated with progress - but now I'm more confident I know what it is, it's always a good first stage to solving it!

 

[WILDER]

Columnaris spots are quite hard to get rid of.
I would try anti internal bacteria med by interpet.
There a jbl med called furanol but it wipes the benefical bacteria out in the filter. You could use an isolation tank and treat there.
Do you live in the uk. As those meds are uk meds.

 

[twiki]

Columnaris spots are quite hard to get rid of.
I would try anti internal bacteria med by interpet.
There a jbl med called furanol but it wipes the benefical bacteria out in the filter. You could use an isolation tank and treat there.
Do you live in the uk. As those meds are uk meds.

Yup UK based - I only have 1 tank up and running so that's going to be an issue!

 

[WILDER]

I would use the anti internal bacteria med by interpet.
Is best to issolate sick fish but if you can't you will have to treat the whole tank.
Good Luck.

 

[twiki]

I would use the anti internal bacteria med by interpet.
Is best to issolate sick fish but if you can't you will have to treat the whole tank.
Good Luck.

Well the only thing either of my LFSs could offer was the Interpet 9 - as you say. One chap had heard of Furanol and big stockist of JBL stuff but it's against the UK laws to sell it.

Did a 50% water change earlier and then applied first dose - 2nd Angel now looking like he's been affected and also 1 ram has signs of similar lesions on his nose. Fingers crossed this will work it's magic while I have a friend in the US who might be able to send me some anti-biotics.

 

[WILDER]

Not really allowed to get meds from abroad.
Maracyn one and two.