Help/advice With An Eye Problem?

[Winterlily]

I posted in the betta section, too, but thought this might be a good place as well - so here it is!

This not even about one of my own (yet). I saw this beautiful male betta in a LFS 2 weeks ago. One eye just fine and perfect, one eye completely clouded over/covered/opaque/whatever. Very hard to describe, but looked like he sort of had a rounded thickened piece of something (same color as him - sort of a cream) over the entire eye. I told the people there about it - I figured, not knowing any better myself, that it was something like Cloudy Eye, bacterial, and needed meds.

We went back today for some miscellaneous supplies. I expected to find him either sold, or completely better. Nope. He was still there - eye still exactly the same. I went to the owner and asked what the story was - wasn't it something that was responding to meds? He sort of flippantly said "He might have been born like that, or even the eye got damaged in shipping." That was that. If I'd thought about it, I should have taken a pic with my cell phone camera so I could post it here, but I didn't think of it. I may go back today for that very purpose though if you think you need it.

Anyhow. I can be a bit of a bleeding heart and now I'm worried about this little guy. If it is something non-illness, no one is gonna buy him. If he IS ill, no one is gonna buy him and he needs to be medicated, the poor thing. I'm feeling some big need to rescue him, basically. But. I have NO interest in bringing in something super contagious and putting my other guys at risk. I mean, separate tanks and all that, yes, but one splash of water....... You know? (Overly paranoid, yes I know - but my guys are all healthy and happy.)

Can you tell, in any way, from my description, what it sounds like? What would it look like if indeed it WAS an old injury or something he was born with? If it IS an illness, wouldn't you expect the other eye to be involved too, after this much time?

Oh, I should add in case it matters, that the rest of him - body and fins - looks good I think. He does not flare, though. I watched him with his neighbor who was flaring at him and he did not flare even a tiny bit. Even when he definitely (I think) saw him. Tough to miss, they were directly next to each other.

What should I do here? What's it sound like to you guys? Illness (what?), injury, birth defect? Do I need to go back tomorrow and take his pic for you?

EDITED to add the photos which are below. Some are close ups, one is head-on, one is of the "good" eye, which I wonder if it actually IS a good eye?

3 close-ups first:

A head-on shot:

How he keeps his fins clamped every time I see him:

And the "good" eye - which also maybe looks like the skin around it is puffy, or is that normal? What about the black at the base of his messed up ventrals? Just coloration you think?

 

[WILDER]

Is the eye bulging out.

 

[Winterlily]

Hi Wilder ... nope I don't think so. I'm going to go back today to take his pic - hopefully that will help some. Will post it when I get home (hopefully I'll be able to get a decent one!).

 

[WILDER]

Does it sound like this.
Cataracts)
Symptoms:: White or gray material covering the eyes`only.

Treatment: In the process, special attention should be made to assure that ammonia and nitrite levels stay within accepted measures.

Information: Cataracts are fungal growths on the eyes. Treatment with any aquarium fungicide should work. Its probability increases with water rich in ammonia or nitrates.



Cloudy eye is a symtom of a desease not a desease in its own right.
Causes.
Irratation.
Stress.
Poor diet.
Injury.
Old age.
Parasites.
Bacterial.
Bad water quality.

A link to eye disorders.
http/www.fishyfarmacy.com/Q&A/eye_disorders.html
But it dosn't mention anything about what this fish has.
If its a creamy substance on the eye I don't know what it is.
I would maybe tell the lfs to try a bacterial med.

 

[Winterlily]

Hiya again - okay, I went back to the store and took pics of him. I edited my topmost post here to add them. Please let me know what you think. His ventrals are weird, he keeps all fins clamped most of the time, I'm unsure if is mouth looks right, and even unsure if even the eye I thought was fine is fine. So interested to hear what you think. Thanks!

 

[WILDER]

Whats the water stats at the lfs.
Black patches can be ammonia burns that are healing.
The eye looks swollen to me.
The mouth looks swollen to me aswell.
I would try a bacterial med if i'm honest.
Has he been caught in something.

 

[Winterlily]

Hi Wilder - thanks for the reply. Not a clue what the water stats are there - not very good I'm sure. Just trying to figure out if I should "rescue" this guy and treat, or not... (aside from putting my healthy guys at any risk, I don't want to bring home a fish likely to die --- I've got a 3-year-old here whose emotions I have to consider too....)

Yeah, his mouth didn't look right to me either. And no idea if he was caught in something either.

What's your opinion overall? Sounds like a whole bunch of things going on at once? What would you do - leave him there and not risk it or bring him home and treat for whatever we think this is? I've got 2 happy healthy bettas in their own tanks, as well as 4 little bitsy fancy goldfish babies (like a month old) in their own grow-out tank.

 

[WILDER]

If you can get him a tank of his own I would get him. Keep all the water change equipment steralised to be on the safe side.
Poor thing.
I would try a bacterial med on him.
I agree he dosn't look well.
Clamped fins are a sign of stress and desease.

 

[Winterlily]

Okay, so if I want to be really paranoid, I'd just get a separate siphon and bucket and stuff for his tank - but what about me? Is washing my hands after dealing with his tank/water/etc enough or do I need to do something else?

Bacterial ... any suggestions on med? A tank med or one in the food? His tank won't be cycled, so I'll have to do a ton of water changes as levels start to rise to keep him safe.... what do I do about meds in the tank in that case?

And you're thinking bacterial - do you think it's pop eye or cloudy eye or something else, or just unknown? How contagious is this stuff generally - do I have to be absolutely nuts and worry about water splashes into the tank next to him, that kind of thing?

 

[WILDER]

Okay, so if I want to be really paranoid, I'd just get a separate siphon and bucket and stuff for his tank - but what about me? Is washing my hands after dealing with his tank/water/etc enough or do I need to do something else?

Bacterial ... any suggestions on med? A tank med or one in the food? His tank won't be cycled, so I'll have to do a ton of water changes as levels start to rise to keep him safe.... what do I do about meds in the tank in that case?

And you're thinking bacterial - do you think it's pop eye or cloudy eye or something else, or just unknown? How contagious is this stuff generally - do I have to be absolutely nuts and worry about water splashes into the tank next to him, that kind of thing?

Just wash your hand with a bacterial soap.

Not need to buy new water change equipment, just steralise in boiling water.

The tank will need to be away from the other tanks.

I would treat with tetracycline.

Once the med course has finished and done water changes and run some black carbon.
Just take some matured filter sponge from other tanks. Make sure there no desease in the tanks.

Antibiotics wipe the beneifcal bacteria out in the filter.

Here some info on tetracycline.

Tetracycline
Manufacturer: Aquatronics
A broad-spectrum antibiotic used in the treatment of gram-positive and some gram-negative bacterial infections. For infections of fin and tail rot, frayed fins, popeye, inflamed gills, mouth and body open sores/ulcers, livebearer disease, dropsy, Columnaris, and secondary infections such as fungal. Specific for livebearers and goldfish. Aerate the aquarium well when using. Useful for the control of some common bacterial diseases, including Aeromonias and Pseudomonas Genera and the Mysobacterial group.

 

[Winterlily]

Okay. Tetracycline is it. Added to the water, yes? Not a medicated food? (Dunno if they even do that with tetracycline.) Aerate well... so shall I add an airstone or something? I never do anything in the betta tanks beyond the filter on low.

Wilder, one more thing. Please have a look at those first 3 pics, the close ups. Those little dots (don't THINK they're holes.....) all around his eye and on his head ... those okay? Normal? Or yet something else?

 

[WILDER]

If he's still eating medicated food fine.

The spots does it look like pitting.
Any white specs on his eyes.
Any signs of flicking and rubbing.

 

[Winterlily]

White spots on eye: Well he's got those...growths? or whatever on his bad eye (you can see in those closeups).

I did not see him flick or rub - but he's in one of those TEENY containers there. But, no, I sure didn't see him moving much at all.

What's pitting from?? I don't know if pitting or spots ... I can really only see it from the pics here, too.

 

[Winterlily]

*Bump* ... and a further question too. My LFS (not the one this guy is in) does not have straight tetracycline. Only thing that looked like it was for Pop Eye (is that what we're thinking this is after all? Or..?) was Maracyn (erythromycin). Is that what I should be getting or something else? It's expensive - I don't want to get the wrong stuff.

 

[ellena]

Do you have him yet? What if you buy the meds and then he's gone when you go back?