Gettting Discouraged, Just Discovered Tap Water Is High Ammonia

[pressly]

So, I've been working on getting my 10 gallon fish-in tank cycled and am going on 5 weeks. Using an API test kit I'm consistently getting readings like this:

Ammonia .25-.50
Nitrites 0
Nitrates 0- (one day this week I had about a 3.0)
PH 8.4

I have 1 koi angel, 1 swordfish, 1 platty, 2 neon tetras and 1 pleco. On one occasion they were looking sick and bumping into things so I did a 60% water change and they recovered.

After I realized I should have cycled before getting fish, I borrowed a friends filter and put that in my tank (that was 4 weeks ago)...... still no changes. About 6 days ago, I decided I needed to borrow filter media from a proven cycled tank, so I did API test on friend's 10 gallon and they were perfect (ammonia 0, nitrites 0, nitrates 10) so I borrowed her filter media and took a slimy ornament from her tank. Incidentally, she is on the same city tap water as me.

Today, I had the idea of testing my tap water and am discouraged to discover it's the exact same ammonia results as my aquarium water (appears to be .50ppm). My PH from the tap is the same too (8.4). How ever am I going to get this tank cycled when my water changes are replacing the exact same amount of ammonia and my PH is sky high?

Once I DO get the tank cycled, do I need to adjust how often I'm doing water changes so I'm not ADDING in ammonia from my "contaminated" tap water?

To adjust, I'm adding in prime (4 drops per 4 gallons) and stopped adding PH down after reading folks here say not to. I am afraid of doing the driftwood too so I've pretty much just been ignoring the ph tests.

I've got an 8 year old who checks that tank about every 30 minutes to account for everyone, so my risk tolerance is extremely low. She's got me so paranoid about killing the fish I'm testing twice a day...I'm a busy mom and feel like all I'm doing is water changes and worrying.... None of my friends even know what the heck I'm talking about with tank cycling and most of them report having normal aquariums and they say they never tested anything and now hardly change water... (the friend with the perfect readings told me she does 100% water change monthly and her fish never die!!!)

Feeling discouraged and somewhat crazed.... L

 

[Rickzayne]

Calm down.

Your ruining fish keeping for your self!

Chances are your fish will be perfectly fine!

Just do a 20-30% water change once a week.

 

[Tolak]

Many water supplies will contain some ammonia. One of the disinfectants used in treating tap water, chloramine, is a combination of chlorine & ammonia. It's much more stable than chlorine, but will leave traces of ammonia as it breaks down.

If you are treating the water with Prime there is a component of that product that converts ammonia to ammonium. Ammonium is harmless to fish at levels found in an aquarium, and used the same as ammonia by the nitrifying bacteria in your filter. The problem is that many tests do not discriminate between the two, showing ammonium as ammonia. This may be what you are seeing.

You can bring the amount of Prime you are using up to 3 drops per gallon no problem. I dose 5 gallon buckets with 20 drops for fry tanks, one of the few situations where I still use buckets. Any traces of ammonia are rough on fry, can devastate a spawn in a matter of hours.

Some time back I was seeing questionable results from the API ammonia tests here on the forum. Tanks that should have been well cycled were not per the test results. You may want to try testing water with a kit from a different manufacturer. For the API nitrite & nitrate tests shake the bottle for twice as long as suggested, the compounds for some reason are really prone to precipitating out & settling on the bottom, giving incorrect results.

You are going to have some issues in a 10 gallon tank with that stocking. Angels are tall fish, require greater water depth than a 10 gallon tank. A 20 high with little to no substrate is the minimum for an angel. With livebearers such as platys & swords, a trio, one male two females works out best, or a single individual in a smaller tank. Swords & platys will cross, if you have a male of one & a female of another. Neons need to be in larger groups, 6 or more, which isn't a real problem in that size tank. The plec is a problem in that size tank, especially if it's a common plec, which will grow to a foot long in no time if it is. A smaller species of plec, such as a bristlenose would need a 20 gallon tank.

Bottom line, the water is not a real big problem, the stocking needs to be sorted out. The 8 year old daughter makes me laugh, my daughter was 11, 10 gallon tank, no internet resources, pretty much same situation. She's 30 now, you'll look back & laugh as well.

Whether it's a stocking switch or a larger tank, we're here to help, many here have started the same way!

 

[Mowbz]

Some time back I was seeing questionable results from the API ammonia tests here on the forum. Tanks that should have been well cycled were not per the test results. You may want to try testing water with a kit from a different manufacturer. For the API nitrite & nitrate tests shake the bottle for twice as long as suggested, the compounds for some reason are really prone to precipitating out & settling on the bottom, giving incorrect results.

+1, while the API kit is normally very accurate, thats only if you use it "to the word" in the instructions.

When API say "agitate the bottle for 30 seconds" what it actually means is, "Bash the c rap out of it for five minutes".

The Nitrate test, Bottle 2, has a powdered reagent as well as a liquid reagent, and this separates in the bottle and sinks to the bottom. If you leave it more than a few days, it'll take a good beating up to get it all mxed again. 60 seconds shaking with a few bashes on a table EVERYTIME you use it, seems to work for me. (Not the unit your fish are on....)

API are notoriously hard to read sometimes. I find the Nitrate the worst, as you'll often get all sorts of shades of orange and red that arent on the sheet. Its a case of guessing roughly where in between the shown readings it is...

Hope this helps!

Ben

Calm down.

Your ruining fish keeping for your self!

True.

Chances are your fish will be perfectly fine!

Just do a 20-30% water change once a week.

False. Should they be accurate tests, the levels of Ammonia in that tank are potentially lethal. I would recommend a minimum of the above mentioned water changes amost every day, to keep the Ammonia down while the filter catches up.


Keep posting, and we'll help as much as we can!

 

[TwoTankAmin]

From SeaChem site

A Nessler based kit will not read ammonia properly if you are using Prime®... it will look "off scale", sort of a muddy brown (incidentally a Nessler kit will not work with any other products similar to Prime®). A salicylate based kit can be used, but with caution. Under the conditions of a salicylate kit the ammonia-Prime complex will be broken down eventually giving a false reading of ammonia (same as with other products like Prime®), so the key with a salicylate kit is to take the reading right away. However, the best solution ;-) is to use our MultiTest: Ammonia™ kit... it uses a gas exchange sensor system which is not affected by the presence of Prime® or other similar products. It also has the added advantage that it can detect the more dangerous free ammonia and distinguish it from total ammonia (which is both the free and ionized forms of ammonia (the ionized form is not toxic)).

From http/www.seachem.com/support/FAQs/Prime.html

 

[pressly]

Thanks for the input. Did my regular water changes last night and woke to find a dead glofish... so I guess that's helping with my stocking issue? This morning's test is exactly the same as always. Added prime to tank in greater dose as suggested. I am sure that we'll upgrade the tank as soon as one comes up on craig's list. In college I had a 55 gallon with one ciclid and it was pure joy--she lived to be 6 so my love affair with aquariums is firmly established.... Just frustrated that I can't say the same about the current tank.

Of course now that danio is dead, DD is lobbying for a trip to fish store for a betta! Trying to convince her we can't get anymore fish while they're dying and the tank is not cycled.

Since I'm already 6 weeks into this, how much longer should I expect my stalled cycle to continue? Most people seem to get it done in just a month.

 

[KISSfn]

Some time back I was seeing questionable results from the API ammonia tests here on the forum. Tanks that should have been well cycled were not per the test results. You may want to try testing water with a kit from a different manufacturer. For the API nitrite & nitrate tests shake the bottle for twice as long as suggested, the compounds for some reason are really prone to precipitating out & settling on the bottom, giving incorrect results.

I can vouch for that! I will never buy an API ammonia test again. Salifert brand only for me. Thanks again for your help Tolak!

 

[pressly]

Update:
Still having the exact same readings another week later... I'm at .50-1.0 ammonia, relatively little nitrates (.3 maybe?) and nitrates 0. Out of curiosity, I tested my refrigerator filtered water and it was near 0 on the ammonia readings.. so I do have a bit more confidence in the API tests. Also, when I tested my friend's tank, I used API and hers was 0 also...

Any other advice on how to get my tank cycled would be great...
If I used the fridge to begin water changes, I'd let it sit overnight... is there any other reason not to do this?
L

 

[Aqua Tom]

Update:
Still having the exact same readings another week later... I'm at .50-1.0 ammonia, relatively little nitrates (.3 maybe?) and nitrates 0.
<>

Was that Tapwater or Tankwater?

 

[KISSfn]

If you're in the US an active sponge filter from http/www.angelsplu...ltersSponge.htm will have you cycled in a few days max. I would use the fridge water as long as it's the same temp as your tank water.

 

[Tizer]

If you are in the UK also call your water supplier, we dont add ammonia over here, its usually caused by cracked pipes if its in the supply.