Fishless Cycling Question

[kporteo]

Me again!!!
Ive set up my tank and have added my ammonia (10ml to get 4ppm), did this on the 19th, ive just tested again and its still on 4ppm, is this alright, how long, in general does it take to start seeing the ammonia being metabolised?
Kxx

 

[waterdrop]

You are 5 days in to the fishless cycle. We often see some movement of the ammonia by about 10 days but it can sometimes take 2 weeks or even 3 in a few cases. Your temp should be at 29C/84F and let us know your pH readings. Aquarium light should be off unless you are working in the tank.

~~waterdrop~~

 

[kporteo]

Reet, im confused!!!
Had my tank full of water since 19th Aug. Added ammonia on 20th to a reading of 4ppm. Got the temp at 29deg C and filter running. Ive been testing every other day for ammonia and I am still getting a reading of 4ppm?? Only thing is, ive had the lid of my tank closed and the light has been on for around 4.5hrs every night. Should I empty my tank and start again??


Kxx

Tank : 190ltr Juwel Trigon with standard filter
pH tested today = 8

 

[fluttermoth]

No, you don't need to empty your tank and start again; your cycle just hasn't started yet.

It doesn't matter about the lid or the lights; you just need to be patient and keep testing until that ammonia reading starts to drop.

Then you can add some more ammonia (back up to 4ppm) and keep on testing...

 

[curlyriff]

Reet, im confused!!!
Had my tank full of water since 19th Aug. Added ammonia on 20th to a reading of 4ppm. Got the temp at 29deg C and filter running. Ive been testing every other day for ammonia and I am still getting a reading of 4ppm?? Only thing is, ive had the lid of my tank closed and the light has been on for around 4.5hrs every night. Should I empty my tank and start again??


Kxx

Tank : 190ltr Juwel Trigon with standard filter

The lid won't make a difference, the ammonia will still work the same way. If it didn't then anyone with an Fluval Edge tank or similar wouldn't be able to cycle there tanks. Also in regards to the lights. I believe that is to stop algy growing from the high chemical load in your tank. I don't believe this should reduce your cycle period to stationary as yours seems to be.

You could turn them off all the time which will help to make sure no algy is produced though as WD you don't need them on unless it is dark when you are working in the tank.

I would check your PH levels, the level needs to above 6.0PH and no higher than 8.0PH. If it varies from this then cycling may not take place. Optimum PH level would be somewhere around 7.5PH

Edit: Just noticed you have edited your post to give the PH level. With that PH level you should be OK to cycle it is just taking some time. I wouldn't worry about it. Just keep testing and watching, the result for it to go from 4.0ppm to 0.0ppm is normally pretty sudden.

Kind Regards,

Adam

 

[kporteo]

ahhh thanks for the replies! So i can close the lid?? I have to admit since ive had the lid open for about 48hrs and the light not on last night the water has gone super clear - is that a good thing??
On the fishless cycling 'manual' on here, it states that you need extra airation with an air stone, will my filter be giving enough air?
Kxx

 

[curlyriff]

ahhh thanks for the replies! So i can close the lid?? I have to admit since ive had the lid open for about 48hrs and the light not on last night the water has gone super clear - is that a good thing??
On the fishless cycling 'manual' on here, it states that you need extra airation with an air stone, will my filter be giving enough air?
Kxx

The extra airation speeds the process up. Since yours has been slow this may be benifical but as stated is not necessary for the process to take place. If your water has been cloudy it is likely that the light was causing a reaction with the ammonia. I would keep these off at all times. My tank has been processing the ammonia with the lights off and just my filter without any clouding problems apart from the first few hours after putting ammonia in.

I am not familar with your filter so can not comment on that but am sure someone will give you an answer on that shortly.

Kind Regards,

Adam

 

[waterdrop]

OK, so let's just put a little bookmarker here:

This tank has been fishless cycling at a good temperature and pH for 21Days/3Weeks and the ammonia concentration has yet to drop any from the very first dosing.

I guess a couple more standard questions apply. Are we sure the ammonia didn't have any soaps, surfactants, fragrances or dyes in it? (Hopefully its the usual plain aqueous ammonia from Boots or Homebase, right?)

And secondly, we are sure there's no Zeolite media in the filter, just straightforward sponges, ceramic gravels, ceramic rings, carbon, floss pads, that sort of thing, right? (There are a few chemical media types out there that can "adsorb" (different from "absorb") so much ammonia that the bacteria are left with no food (but of course we assume that's not the case here since we've not seen ammonia go down at all, so we really shouldn't need this question.))

And you're leaving the filter running all the time, right?

And your ammonia test kit shows zero when you measure your tap water, right? (helps to see it show different things)

And you used a dechlorinator on the tap water that filled the tank originally, right?

~~waterdrop~~

 

[kporteo]

OK, so let's just put a little bookmarker here:

This tank has been fishless cycling at a good temperature and pH for 21Days/3Weeks and the ammonia concentration has yet to drop any from the very first dosing.

I guess a couple more standard questions apply. Are we sure the ammonia didn't have any soaps, surfactants, fragrances or dyes in it? (Hopefully its the usual plain aqueous ammonia from Boots or Homebase, right?)

And secondly, we are sure there's no Zeolite media in the filter, just straightforward sponges, ceramic gravels, ceramic rings, carbon, floss pads, that sort of thing, right? (There are a few chemical media types out there that can "adsorb" (different from "absorb") so much ammonia that the bacteria are left with no food (but of course we assume that's not the case here since we've not seen ammonia go down at all, so we really shouldn't need this question.))

And you're leaving the filter running all the time, right?

And your ammonia test kit shows zero when you measure your tap water, right? (helps to see it show different things)

And you used a dechlorinator on the tap water that filled the tank originally, right?

~~waterdrop~~

Reet, ive rang the company that make my ammonia solution, its 9.1% ammonia and water.
The filter consists of, Cirax (porous material) poly pad, carbon sponge, nitrax (nitrate removal), sponge.
Filter is running 24hrs a day, temp was around 30 but since ive opened lid its dropped to 29, so ive upped the temp back to 30.
Tap water results were, Ammonia 0, Nitrate 0, Nitrite 0 and pH of 8.
Conditioner was used when water was added, i think i needed about 10ml, but to be honest i cant remember the exact amount.
Anymore info, il try me hardest!
Kxx

 

[waterdrop]

Hey, it sounds to me like you are doing everything just right! Either that or I'm missing something to ask if anyone else wants to chime in. Very unusual to get out to 3 weeks doing everything right and not have any ammonia dropping yet, we've only had about 2 cases that long that I can remember, out of hundreds it seems like.

But unless someone can think of something else I've overlooked, I'd just assume your particular water system is particularly low on our two species of bacteria (not such a bad thing to have a very clean water system, eh?) and there's little more that you can do than just keep on keeping the parameters monitored and correct and it -will- come about, its never failed to start happening eventually. You can of course keep trying to locate someone who might donate some mature media to you from their aquarium or their store or some place. Don't give in to the bottled products though, we've just not found that they help.

~~waterdrop~~

 

[kporteo]

typical for me to get a super sterile water supply!!!! Well il just keep testing every other day and i suppose its just....watch this space!!!
Thanks so much Waterdrop for your help!
Kxx

 

[OldMan47]

You may want to try something that is often not needed. Try a large water change with dechlorinated water. The water will come from the tap with some small traces of bacteria present, unless your water supply is unusually clear of bacteria. Those small traces can be built into the colonies of beneficial bacteria that we need. An alternative seldom addressed here is using simple garden soil to spike your filter. The rich garden soil that exists in most parts of the world does contain those very same bacteria that we often look for in our tap water. A small sample of soil from a local garden will contain enough bacteria that you will be able to multiply it to become your own tank's bacterial colony. If you have correctly identified your original water sample as being free of bacteria, either the water change or a soil sample should get things moving for you.

 

[kporteo]

Thanks for your reply Oldman, but if my water i filled my tank with 3 weeks ago was pretty much sterile, how will putting new water in from the same water supply make a difference? Surely im just going to chuck out the tiny amount of bacteria that may be starting to form and the ammonia i added?

For the soil suggestion, how much do i add?

Kxx

 

[toshapetriji]

Have you tried to find someone to donate some filter media?

This would likely get you going straight away.

 

[waterdrop]

The reason OM's suggestion makes sense is that any autotrophic cells that were going to seed your media from 3 weeks ago will have already attached themselves to said media and when you do a large water change you may bring in some more, to -add- to those already there. The bacteria we are trying to grow do not spend much time floating free in the water.

WD