Fish-In Cycling. Fish Acting Funny Or Just My Imagination?

[jvdb]

I have decided to go with the fish-in cycling route for my 5 gallon and have been testing twice daily and doing a 50% water change whenever ammonia or nitrites are above 0.25 . I feel as though I have been very dilligent with my monitering and yet I think it is still having an effect on my fish - or perhaps it is the frequent water changes?  I know that ammonia and nitrites are toxic at any level but I've kept at 0.25 or lower (I had one spike to 0.5 ammonia once but changed water twice that day).  My dwarf gourami looks great but my 5 long finned skirt tetras seem to be a lot less active.  Mind you I have only had them about a week, the first 2 days they were swimming around the tank quite a bit and schooling together a lot more.  Over the past few days (around the same time I started getting nitrites in my water) they seem to have segregated a lot more and 1-2 are often hiding in the corners.  They are not gasping, still look very healthy and active when eating (they go crazy).  Is this them reacting to the nitrites in the water?  Should I be concerned about them or will they pull through as long as I keep up the testing and very frequent water changes?
 
Or there is the other option... could frequent water changes be disturbing them?  Water is chlorine treated and has has always been sitting out between 12-24 hours.

 

[Ch4rlie]

Hello,
 
Can I ask why are you doing a fish in cycle?
 
There is no real good reason for doing this, and the Dwarf Gouramis and tetras will suffer of this. Possibly getting internal organs damage and lives being shortened simply by going through the fish in cycle.
 
DO have a read of this to gather more information and an idea of why a Fishless cycles are so much better, as well as being quicker to do.
 
http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?/topic/421488-cycling-your-new-fresh-water-tank-read-this-first/

 

[GuppyGirl20]

I am thinking the tank might be a tad over stocked. I am not so good with stocking so I only go by the inch-per-gallon rule but maybe someone with more experience can correct me if I'm wrong .
The water changes shouldn't be bothering them that much if at all unless the water change is like really violent and creates like a titlewave of sloshing or something like that.

 

[Ch4rlie]

I am thinking the tank might be a tad over stocked. 

 
That was going to be my next point, I do agree tank is overstocked. Its only a 5 gal / 19 litres, and tetras will need a much larger tank.
 
I would suggest that a 20 gal minimum would be better for DG as well as the tetras.
 
Sorry to be bearer of bad news, an i do think it would be best to re-home your fish, and start a Fishless cycle and get suitable fish for a 5 gal, a single Betta Splenden perhaps.
 
Or a simple planted tank with shrimps and snails is good too.

 

[TwoTankAmin]

You know that ammonia is toxic at any level, but this is actually not the case. In fact fish can tolerate various levels of ammonia for various amounts of time.
 
Your test kit measures total ammonia which includes NH3 and NH4. But it is the NH3 component which is the nasty one. NH4 can also be bad for fish but it takes much more. How much of each is in any total ammonia reading depends on the pH and less so the temp[erature of the water. Higher and warmer are worse.
 
So in a tank with say 1 ppm of ammonia at a temperature of 25 C and a pH of 7.6, the amount of toxic NH3 is .0226 ppm. For most fish this is safe. research shows below .O2 ppm everything is safe and by .05 ppm alarms should go off. So in this case the fish can be exposed to .5 ppm of total ammonia for a number of days without suffering any real permanent harm. The stress of repeated water changes for this level may actually be more harmful.
 
This is one of the reasons why it is so hard for new fish keepers to do fish in cycling without farming fish. Long term residents in a tank will get used to the weekly water change and many come to enjoy it. But in brand new tank, new fish likely stressed already and then put through a cycle will react much worse to water changes in terms of stress.
 
So what a fish in cycle really becomes is an attempt to balance the need to finish the process as rapidly as possible while at the same time not letting it reach the pint of doing harm. In an established tank we want no measurable level ammonia or nitrite, but you do not have an established tank. getting a tanck cycled requires both ammonia and nitrite be measurable. What the fish keeper must do is balance these two opposing goals. The more water changes one does, the faster the tank can cycle.
 
We need to let ammonia rise as much and for long as it appears safe. Despite the testing and calculating, we must also trust our observations. We can spot the signs of ammonia or nitrite problems and no matter what the tests say, these should always over ride them.
 
All this said, your fish load is going to present a real issue re cycling because there are way to many fish in it. The general rule in fish in cycling is to add one or two small ammonia hardy fish per every 10 gallons. You are way over this. I see no way you can avoid tons of water changes. And even so, things may easily get out of hand. If there is anyway you can return the fish and complete your tank using ammonia, please do so. Othewise, return at least 3/4 of them and go forward from there.

 

[the_lock_man]

Yes, the tank is rather overstocked, and with incompatible tankmates. Black skirt tetras are notorious fin-nippers, and they will love the gourami's long thread pectoral fins.
 
Seriously recommend that you take the fish back. As stated by others, a single betta is about the best you can do with a 5gal tank. Sorry if that's not what you want to hear.

 

[jvdb]

To answer a few questions:
-I chose to fish-in cycle for the same reason many people choose to, not wanting to wait to stock the tank and a willingness to moniter water levels very very closely.
-Overstocking.  Yes this tank is "overstocked" but not to the point that it is unmaintainable. I am aware that it will require more frequent water changes than if I were to stock as recommended (a single betta) but with 5 gallons this is very maintainable.  Also I am of the mindset that there are no set rules when it comes to stocking just recommendations.  If you can keep your tank clean, your levels stable, your fish healthy, and avoid aggression between tankmates then by all means keep what you like in there.  Many of you may or may not agree with me and I am ok with that.
-Dwarf Gourami with skirt tetras.  After researching compatability and knowing for a fact that I wanted a gourami I decided on this mix.  I have heard that gourami can be bullies, and also that tetras can be fin nippers but have also heard of people having much success keeping them together.  My hope was that a single male gourami would have no reason to get too territorial on his own, and that if I got a group tetras they would keep each other occupied enough.  So far this has proved to be true.  It has only been two weeks but neither species has so much as touched each other and so far no compatability issues.
 
*update on cycling.  I THINK my cycle may have finished this morning.  I got up to very happy looking fish who looked quite content this morning and proceeded to test their water as I have done every morning.  0 ammonia and 0 nitrites!   The past 3 days I had been doing 50% water changes twice a day to keep levels below 0.25 of each so this is significant change.  I will test again this afternoon/evening and see if we are still doing well.  I have heard that small tanks cycle quickly but this was only 1.5-2 weeks with fish in, would be a pleasant surprise.