Cycling With Food

[sheffieldlad]

Hi all,

I have a few questions about a tank I have just bought and filled with water, namely about the cycling the tank.

The tank holds just shy of 90 ltrs, subdtrate is sand and it is sparsley planted (2 plants. one rooting into the soil and one wired to a 6" piece of bogwood.
I do plan on putting more plants in when I can get to the LFS.

I plan to cycle it with food rather than amonia simply because I have some food avaiable but I don't have a source of amonia available.

The filter in the tank at the moment is I suspect not big enough to keep 90ltrs of water clean but it has been put in the tank because it came straight from an existing setup and therefore has some bacteria in it.
I plan to introduce a larger filter then remove the smaller filter after the bacteria has built up in the larger filter.

How much food should I introduce into the tank for it to cycle successfully?

Also, what numbers of fish can I stock into the tank safely?

I plan to keep at least 8 neon tettras as well as 4 or 5 platies.
Would this be a safe stocking level?
Could I put more fish in there?
Which fish species live happily in a comunity tank with tets and platies?

I appreciate that I can't stock them all in one go and I will introduce them over a period of a few weeks.

Many thanks for any advice you can give me.

-Paul

 

[Wills]

Hi there welcome to the forum The cycling with food method does not really do enough to consider the tank cycling you are better off using liquid ammonia. Since your in the UK you can get it from Boots or Homebase

Have a read through the articles in here it contains a lot of information that you wont get told in the shops. I would reccomend reading the nitrogen cycle and the fishless cycle section in there.

http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?/topic/277264-beginners-resource-center/

It does take a few weeks to get the tank ready for fish but its worth it - especially when you want to keep things like Neons which are not the best fish these days as they have been mass bred for the hobby so much in the big farms the quality levels are not great any more so you often get illness from them - you could consider Green Neons though which are a newer species and have not been bred so much.

Its kind of a shame coming to the hobby now being from Sheffield as there used to be a shop called Fish Inc that was amazing!! But I know there are still a few other decent indipendant shops around

Wills

 

[sheffieldlad]

Hi there welcome to the forum The cycling with food method does not really do enough to consider the tank cycling you are better off using liquid ammonia. Since your in the UK you can get it from Boots or Homebase

Have a read through the articles in here it contains a lot of information that you wont get told in the shops. I would reccomend reading the nitrogen cycle and the fishless cycle section in there.

http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?/topic/277264-beginners-resource-center/

It does take a few weeks to get the tank ready for fish but its worth it - especially when you want to keep things like Neons which are not the best fish these days as they have been mass bred for the hobby so much in the big farms the quality levels are not great any more so you often get illness from them - you could consider Green Neons though which are a newer species and have not been bred so much.

Its kind of a shame coming to the hobby now being from Sheffield as there used to be a shop called Fish Inc that was amazing!! But I know there are still a few other decent indipendant shops around

Wills

Thanks for the quick reply Wills.

The amonia sold at homebase and boots, I'm guessing it's not puropse made for cycling aquariams so it won't sayt how much I should add. Do you have any idea how much I should add to the water?

Thanks for the link, I'll have a read now.

-Paul

 

[Akasha72]

You mention you have a filter that has come from an existing tank? Was it out of the existing tank very long? and how long had it been in the existing tank before you took it out?

I ask because you may well have enough bacteria to seed the tank/new filter without adding the ammonia. I'm about to set up a new tank and all my media from my cycled tank will be going into the new filter so I will be able to move the fish over straight away.
The bacteria grows to the amount of fish not to the size of the tank (or so I have been told here) so if the existing filter came from a cycled tank with say 6 fish you should be able to move the media to your new filter and add say 5 or 6 fish right away and not get any ammonia.

Does that make sense?

 

[Wills]

Excellent news No the Ammonia is not purpose made for the aquariums but they are the only shops that sell it in the pure form - other places sell it fragranced (believe me you will see why) and others sell it as more of a foam both of which do not work and add in chemicals that are going to damage the fish later on.

As for measuring it have a look at the bottom of the page in this link http/www.fishforums.net/aquarium-calculator.htm it has a calculator for just this

It usually works out at a really really small volume so you will need some kind of dropper, I got mine from boots but you may already have something from some of the accessories you have got from the tank.

Wills

 

[sheffieldlad]

You mention you have a filter that has come from an existing tank? Was it out of the existing tank very long? and how long had it been in the existing tank before you took it out?

I ask because you may well have enough bacteria to seed the tank/new filter without adding the ammonia. I'm about to set up a new tank and all my media from my cycled tank will be going into the new filter so I will be able to move the fish over straight away.
The bacteria grows to the amount of fish not to the size of the tank (or so I have been told here) so if the existing filter came from a cycled tank with say 6 fish you should be able to move the media to your new filter and add say 5 or 6 fish right away and not get any ammonia.

Does that make sense?

Hi,

The filter was literally lifted out of the existing tank just after the fish were re housed to a bigger home and was placed into my newly filled 90ltr tank.
It had been in the tank for around 6-8 months I would guess.
The tank had 2 fish in it.

-Paul.

 

[Wills]

Ah really sorry I missed that bit.... you would be best off using the ammonia but the food will work for now just need to restock with fish slowly.

Just to double check its safe to add fish I would think about getting an API test kit and a bottle of ammonia and doing the last week steps of the fishless cycle just to make sure the filter can handle the waste levels of the fish going into the tank.

Your stocking plans look good - though you could consider Green Neon Tetras as they are a bit smaller and would allow for a bigger school they are also less widely bred so are a stronger species in the shop than regular Neons.

As for tank mates, something like a pair of Bolivian Rams or Red Breasted Acaras would work great in that tank Some Pygmy or Panda Cories are always fun and that should give you quite a bit of activity in the tank

Wills

 

[sheffieldlad]

Thanks guys, I'll follow your advice and pick up an API kit and amonia tomorrow.
I only filled the tank today and although I did put some tap safe type stuff in to remove chlorine,chloramine and trace metals I'll leave it to stand for a few days before I add fish regardless of the test kit results.

Thanks again,

-Paul

 

[Wills]

Yeah when I say the last week of the fishless cycle, you dose the tank in the morning with the amount of ammonia and then 12 hours later you test the water for ammonia and nitrite and if its gone to 0 your good to go with adding fish.

I would keep putting some food in the tank and good job on the tap safe The bacteria still in the filter will need a source of ammonia to stay alive and if you have it now its worth while keeping it alive

Wills

 

[sheffieldlad]

Yeah when I say the last week of the fishless cycle, you dose the tank in the morning with the amount of ammonia and then 12 hours later you test the water for ammonia and nitrite and if its gone to 0 your good to go with adding fish.

I would keep putting some food in the tank and good job on the tap safe The bacteria still in the filter will need a source of ammonia to stay alive and if you have it now its worth while keeping it alive

Wills

Nice one, thanks Wills, I'll do that.

-Paul

 

[Prime Ordeal]

Sheffieldlad, you should stock with fish straight away before the bacteria in that filter starve. No need for fish food or ammonia, the filter is already cycled. The amount of fish to put in depends on the size of those two fish you had in before. I'm assuming you dechlorinated the water you put the filter into though.

 

[sheffieldlad]

Sheffieldlad, you should stock with fish straight away before the bacteria in that filter starve. No need for fish food or ammonia, the filter is already cycled. The amount of fish to put in depends on the size of those two fish you had in before. I'm assuming you dechlorinated the water you put the filter into though.

Hi Prime, thanks for the advice.

I don't feel confident stocking right away, the tank still has a lot of bubbles on the side which tells me gasses are coming out of the previously pressurised tap water and the tank is no where near up to temp yet.
I did treat with a dechlorinater when I filled the new tank and the old tank was also treated when that was filled and with each water change.
The fish in the tank the filter came from were quite small - around 4-5 inches in length each.
I'll take a look at the temp ect tomorrow and see how it goes from there.

Thanks again,

-Paul.

EDIT- How long would you estimate before the bacteria in the filter start to die off?

 

[Prime Ordeal]

If the filter has been running the whole time, in other words you haven't turned it off for long between tank moves then you'll probably be ok for 24hrs. But you really need to feed it as soon as possible, so get a few fish in there. You had 2 x 4 inchers before so stock with up to four inches of fish now. The filter should cope with that.

 

[sheffieldlad]

If the filter has been running the whole time, in other words you haven't turned it off for long between tank moves then you'll probably be ok for 24hrs. But you really need to feed it as soon as possible, so get a few fish in there. You had 2 x 4 inchers before so stock with up to four inches of fish now. The filter should cope with that.

Great Prime, thanks for that.

I'll check the temp tomorrow and go fetch a few fish from the LFS.

Edited for poor spelling

 

[sheffieldlad]

Just a quick update,

I went to the LFS and bought some neon tetras today.
I equalised them and put them into the tank.
I know it's very early days yet but all seem fine.

Thanks again for the advice guys and gals.

-Paul