Cycle Update

[Gruffle]

Hi

Last weekend I upgraded my 60l to one of the spinky Osaka tanks, which is now sitting in my living room, making me live in fear of it falling through the floor into the garage (to the kids: "WILL YOU NOT JUMP ON THE BLOODY FLOOR, YOU'LL END UP DOWNSTAIRS!!").

I moved my 60L into the hallway downstairs with my cory's and danios in it and I've got a few options what to do next.

The tank downstairs has a fluval 2+ filter in it with 3 sponges, the new tank upstairs has a fluval 205 in it, so should I...

1. fishless cycle the usual way

2. take one of the mature sponges out of my internal filter downstairs, buy another internal filter, stick the old sponge in that, bang it in the new tank for extra filtration and stick a few small fish in to support the bacteria

3. Ask the guy at the LFS for some of his media when I get some fish, stick it in the new filter, then slowly up my stocking level.

4. None of the above...suggestions?

Presumably 2 or 3 would result in instant(ish ) cycling as far as the filter media is concerned, so shouldn't have a problem supporting fish straight away?

*giddy*

 

[mark.w.jones]

A Fluval 205 is an external canister filter so I presume you don't mean that its in the tank I would advise you go with option 2. Remove one sponge and a third of any ceramic media you have in your Fluval 2+ and put them into the baskets in your 205 alongside the new media in there. A big handful of gravel from your established 60l tank in a pair of tights and put into your new tank will also help provide some bacteria. I would advise you to fishless cycle the tank after moving the mature media across using ammonia solution. Follow the add & wait method from the link in my sig. With you mature media to kick start things, you should be able to complete the fishless cycle in not much more than a week and you'll then be ready to fully stock your tank.

 

[Gruffle]

A Fluval 205 is an external canister filter so I presume you don't mean that its in the tank

lol! yeah i meant it's under the tank, if it was in the tank it would probably make a very good raft / submarine for my hamster...

thanks for the advise, i'll go with option 2

 

[Miss Wiggle]

yup, agree with the advise above, move one third of the media to kick start things then doa fishless cycle which should only take a few days or a week or so.

 

[Gruffle]

So, a quick update, done the swapping about of filter media etc and put some ammonia in my new tank, i'd guess i have about 140l of actual water (aftr gravel, wood etc), so the ammonia calculater i used said to use about 7ml to maintain about 5ppm...trouble is...my ammonia test shows it to be closer to 8ppm (the test went VERY dark almost instantly) and i've done 2 tests in the 24 hours since...and nothing has changed.

Either my bacteria are asleep / having a lazy weekend or something has gone wrong (the secret third option is that i'm expecting results too quickly, i am after all using half of the filter sponges from my 60l, so the amount of bacteria are hardly gonna make an impression on 5ppm of ammonia on a 160l tank...right?), any ideas what to expect over the next couple of days?

 

[Miss Wiggle]

sometimes the calculators are a bit off, just dilute it with a water change. ammonia level of 8ppm is too high and will inhibit bacteria growth.

drop it down to 5ppm then give it a couple of days before you expect any real results.

 

[Gruffle]

Aye aye cap'n!

*gets buckets, hose and API science kit out*

watch this space

 

[Gruffle]

Right, I did a water test at the crack of dawn this morning (damn my daughter!), ammonia seems to be just about 4-5ish, the water turns slightly darker than the 4ppm but not dark enough for 8ppm.

One interesting development overnight, is that the lighter parts of my driftwood have a thick (about 2-3mm thick) cloudy layer of "slime" over them, not entirely sure what it is

Any ideas?

Also, my fishless cycle has turned into a fish in cycle overnight, was amazed to find about 5 fry swimming about in my tank this morning, seemingly oblivious to the very high ammonia levels. They must have been hitchhiking as eggs on the plants I bought on saturday.

Managed to fish one out and put him in the smaller tank downstairs...where my danios promptly ate him I had time to change 2 buckets of water before work this morning to try and reduce the ammonia slightly, will fish the rest of the fry out tonight..if they're still alive.

 

[Miss Wiggle]

best laid plans and all that!!!

well good luck with it, obviously without knowing what fish they are it's hard to say how hardy they will be, but assuming you've only got the ammonia down to 1/2ppm, there's not very many fry which will be happy in that for long. just liek with human's baby fish are fairly fragile and need a bit of TLC at the start.

Fingers crossed but I don't hold out a massive amount of hope for them.

 

[Gruffle]

Me either, I'll obviously be happy if they survive but don't really expect them to

Any ideas whether the slimy film attached to my wood is normal? I've heard of it before when fishless cycling (as part of the bacteria colonising) but never expected it to be quite so thick

 

[Miss Wiggle]

Yeah it happens quite a lot, i'm not actually sure what it is but lots of people get it, i've never heard of any problems related to it and it normally goes after the cycle is done.

scrape it off if it looks ugly or just leave it and it'll go by itself. It's most likley a type of algae or bio film.

thing we have to rememeber when cycling a new tank is that the nitrogen cycle is not the only chemical/biological process taking place. You've just put a lot of different substances into contact with each other, added a whole load of food (ammonia) and life is starting to develop. The nitrogen bacteria will not be the only things to grow during this period, there's a lot of other stuff happening as the tank settles and reactions between different substances take place. Means you do sometimes get odd little things happening with no tangible explanation or cause.

 

[Gruffle]

Quick update, done tests for ammonia, nitrate, nitrate etc every day this week, my ammonia is hanging at 4ppm, the only time it reduced was on Monday morning when I did a water change to reduce it from 8ppm, nitrate and nitrite both at 0.

I do have the layer of slimy film stuff over my wood, which shows there is _some_ life there, do I just wait till the ammonia drops or do something I bit more proactive? I even put some cycle into the tank in desperation lol!

I better go tell the LFS dude to keep my fish for a couple of weeks longer, I told him I would pick them up after this weekend hoping that it would be cycled pretty quick using some existing media!

 

[Miss Wiggle]

i would do a massive water change, sometimes it seems to kick start things, whats your pH like?

 

[Gruffle]

ph is 6.8 atm.

Did a 35% water change last night (didn't have time for much more...)

Will check the ammonia levels tonight, hopefully this will get things started, fingers crossed!

My fry are still alive too, survived for 5 days in a tank with ammonia 4ppm+, if they survive for another week or so they'll be big enough to go in my little tank without being eaten by the danios

 

[Gruffle]

First of all a quick thank you to MW and other experienced fish keeping dudes on this forum, for putting up with an endless barrage of fishless cycling questions, you must have the patience of a saint

Anyway, to business, quick update on my cycle...

I'm adding enough ammonia to raise the amount to 5ppm in my tank each day, and it is consistantly being reduced to 0 or thereabouts in about 12hours ish.

At this point, do I reduce the amount of ammonia that I am adding? For example drop down to say 3-4ppm added every 24 hours. Then wait for the nitrite to disappear, do the massive water change, then presumably, I'm done?

(if this is the case, in theory won't the amount of ammonia scoffing bacteria decrease in the filter, or can it sustain itself well enough on a lower level of ammonia?)

*fingers crossed*