Cardinals killing my guppies??

[Maz]

Hi.

I had 15 Cardinals in my 3ft tank, cycled tank.

On Thursday I added 4 male guppies. Each day since one has died - leaving just one left.

Prior to death they have been hanging around the surface, but today one died in the daytime, and I saw that the Cardinals were biting his fins. I sperated him but he died later.

I have now seperated my last guppy incase the others died due to being bullied by the Cardinals.

What do people think killed my guppies? Were they already ill and then the cardinals started - or is it poss the cardinals bullied them to death? I thought they were sposed to be a peaceful fish.

 

[Sasha]

If your male guppies were hanging at the surface, that could mean that the tank has lack of oxygen. Cardinal Tetars are supposed to be peaceful fish and aren't the kind of fish that attack. I have Neon Tetras (which are similar to Cardinal Tetras) and I keep them with guppies with no probelm. What other kinds of fish do you have in the tank?

 

[Dragonslair]

I have Cardinals and Guppies both sexes in my tank and they all seem fine. Guppies by their design are surface swimmers, but they shouldn't hang there. Any fish that hangs at the surface is poorly or dying.

 

[Maz]

I have no other fish in the tank yet.

Maybe the cardinals attacked him because he was dying??

What should I do with my last guppy - i have him separated at the moment.

Should I get some more guppies straight away so he is not the only guppy in the tank?? But I don't want the new ones to die when I dont know what killed the last lot.

 

[Dragonslair]

It is difficult to give you an answer, because I don't know how your other guppies died. From what you say they have all been in the same tank as the cardinals. The Cardinals seem to be thriving. Nothing happens without a reason, so you are going to need to backtrack. did you put all the fish in at the same time or did you put them in at different intervals. Did you put any medications in? Did you do anything to the water? Did you use a different lfs? Were the guppy's tails raggy at all before you put them into the tank? does your tank have enough hiding places and/or greenary?

 

[Dragonslair]

Sorry, sounds like an inquisition- not meant to be. Just trying to help.

 

[Maz]

Hi Dragon

Thanks for taking the time to ask!

Fishless cycled tank - took 3 weeks.

Added 15 Cardinals - no problems.

2 weeks later added the guppies.

Tank readings yesterday ammonia 0 nitrite 0 nitrate 30 - did 20% water change this am.

Tank has rocks and lots of plastic plants.

Fish all from same LFS

No medications - etc tap water treatment.

Bought guppies Thurs - one dead Fri am, One Sat am, then one died this afternoon.

 

[tstenback]

I agree with all the replies to this point. It would be very odd for any fish to be bullied by even the largest group of cardinals. I have kept these fish for the last 20+ years and believe me they are very peaceful. I would think that there was either something not right with the fish from purchase or there was a great difference in the water chemistry between your tank and the lfs tank. While it is not unusual to lose a fish after the transfer from lfs to home to lose 3/4 in just 3 days indicates a bigger problem.
I would check with the lfs to see what the tank reaadings are and to see if they may guarantee the fish (a long shot but i have had the good fortune to get new fish in a situation like this).
From the ansers to dragons questions it looks like you are doing everything right at this point. so i would suspect where the fish came from.
Good luck and i would separate the guppy from the rest just in case there is an illness involved and watch both the guppy and the other fish carefully.

Terry

 

[rollntider]

CArdinals are my favorite along with neons (looking for some cardinals in the Birmingham Alabama area, anyone point me to some ) I have a community tank with Neons platies, guppies and corys. All of them get along fine. I do notice when a fish is dieing others will pick at him/her. that may e the reason you noticed this. You may have goten a bad batch of fish (happened to me recently) Anywho, the cardinals I do not believe is your culprit, and you are lucky to find cardinals....

 

[Dragonslair]

From the reply that you have given Maz, it does sound as though that the stock of guppies have been diseased. When you next buy fish, any fish, look for a fish that is bright and swimming freely. The most important make sure you chose the ones where the dorsal fin is erect and no white or raggidy bits to the finnage. Make sure too that it is not "fat" bellied or emaciated looking. Remember you are the customer and its your money that you are partiing with, therefore you have the right to chose which fish you want. Some lfs will just catch some fish of the species you want regardless of what they look like, a good lfs will ask what you want and catch it for you.
Remember too if an lfs sweeps the net across the tank and catch several at once and then proceed to dump them out back into the tank or the bag-keep away. There will be injured fish amongst them, and if the lfs has done it once it must be common practice.
If I'm preaching to the converted, I apologise but I feel that other fishkeepers may read this and benefit from it.

 

[StanTheBetta]

I'd say the guppies were stressed/diseased. I'm not exactly a veteran fish keeper but from I can imagine some of those stores that keep male and female guppies together get pretty stressed from the fact theres 8 zillion of them in a 10 gal tank in no time.

 

[Maz]

Re- introduced my last guppy to the tank yesterday as he had been fine on his own, Within 30 mins I found the Cardinals attacking him - I seperated him again, but he had several nicks out of his tail - and was dead by this morning.

i am soooo confused. do fish attack other fish if they are ill? As my cardinals definately are attacking - and if they are a peaceful fish I dont understand why.

Have to be honest that I am thinking of finding out if I can change the cardinals.

 

[Shizat]

Maz you are right and it is the fish killing the guppies. I have an 80 gallon tank and the only 4 fish that have died were 4 male guppies. The fish that I saw kill them were Neons and zebra danios. I dont know if they mistake their tail for fish flakes but they sure did kill them and I'll never get them for my tank again.

 

[GetTanked]

Some info about guppies. If your going to purchase guppies and you actually want them to live for awhile, don't buy them from a store that sells them as "Assorted Guppies". The definition of "Assorted" means weak, inbred and they were born in a large trough with a billion other guppies. If they knew what the specific breed really was they wouldn't be called "Assorted", the fact that they are guppies is about the only sure thing. They might as well be called minnows.

The problem with guppies now a days is the fact that they are soooo inbred it's has made them very weak, very prone to disease, stressed and to be honest if you have them in your tank for a month you should pat yourself on the back because you did well with them. If you have a few stragglers that make it past that your very lucky. Heck, if you have an hour drive from the LFS you got them from some may not even make it home.

If you want quality guppies, purchase thm from a LFS that sells them per their breed. For instance they have a tank of half blacks with blue or solid green snakeskins, sunrise guppies or something to that affect, those are the ones to buy. Reason being, those come from private breeders. Chances are they are from someone local. The advantage to that is their water is probably similar to yours. Not only that but there are actual breeders out there that take years and make their own strains of guppies. What you are buying more than likely isn't first generation but not far from it. Good breeder guppies WILL last in your tank with proper care.

The only disadvantage is they are not $2.95 a pair like the other kind more than likely they will be 5-8 bucks a pair. Figuring how many pairs of the assorted kind you have to go through to get a good hardy pair you would have spent much more in the long run. Also, you should buy them in a trio. One male to every two females, this will help them get along a bit better and plus you will have a ton of guppies in a fairly short time. I hope this helps you out

 

[canarsie11]

From the reply that you have given Maz, it does sound as though that the stock of guppies have been diseased. When you next buy fish, any fish, look for a fish that is bright and swimming freely. The most important make sure you chose the ones where the dorsal fin is erect and no white or raggidy bits to the finnage. Make sure too that it is not "fat" bellied or emaciated looking. Remember you are the customer and its your money that you are partiing with, therefore you have the right to chose which fish you want. Some lfs will just catch some fish of the species you want regardless of what they look like, a good lfs will ask what you want and catch it for you.
Remember too if an lfs sweeps the net across the tank and catch several at once and then proceed to dump them out back into the tank or the bag-keep away. There will be injured fish amongst them, and if the lfs has done it once it must be common practice.
If I'm preaching to the converted, I apologise but I feel that other fishkeepers may read this and benefit from it.

What technique should the person in the LFS use for catching fish? Not a joke, I really want to know!