Brine solution?

[AbbeysDad]

Prime will bind ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate for 24-48 hours. At which point, if they are still present, will be released.

Yes, the point is, in addition to conditioning for any chlorine/chloramine, it renders any ammonia/nitrite present in source water harmless for a period great enough for the BB to effectively process them.

 

[AbbeysDad]

Salt is like my last thing right now. I don't know what's wrong with them. They just keep dying.

Salt is not a Hail Mary and can do more harm than good. For example, at concentrations typically great enough to kill parasites it can stress some fish and kill plants. Proceed with caution.

 

[cowgirluntamed]

Yes, the point is, in addition to conditioning for any chlorine/chloramine, it renders any ammonia/nitrite present in source water harmless for a period great enough for the BB to effectively process them.

I think I will still at least prefilter for a day so the pH can stabilize. I don't know how bad it is for a water change for the pH to jump from 7.5ish to 8.2 the next day (where it stays).

Also, I think you may have missed my questions about prime. Since for the most part I will have planted tanks and use easy green and flourish root tabs....do you have to wait a certain length of time to put the easy green in if I did Prime?

One last question, you said to dose to the amount of the tank volume, and not just the amount you put in. What is your take on why to do it that way? Just curious as I've heard both ways.

Salt is not a Hail Mary and can do more harm than good. For example, at concentrations typically great enough to kill parasites it can stress some fish and kill plants. Proceed with caution.

I will be careful with the salt. I've only got a couple of anubias in this tank so they should be ok for a bit.

I just don't know what's wrong with them. I did lots of water changes at first and still kept losing them (hence the battle of prefiltering the tank). I tried Api triple sulfa as Colin suggested at he thought it could be a disease that wasn't curable, but salt might keep it from spreading. I'm honestly just ready to give up on them and trying not to beat myself up for ordering that many fish online. Started with 40 glowlights and now it's probably 10ish. I made sure I was home on vacation when I got them and checked the water a ton and was ready to so multiple water changes, which I did. This just sucks all the way around. I feel guilty about getting them online and having them die. But I also didn't ask to be shipped sick fish in the first place. (I also lost half of them and the rasboras in the first week....and still losing them. Cories are absolutely fine though.)

 

[AbbeysDad]

I don't know the history of your tank and/or how well it may be cycled. Prior to filtering, you were adding a fair amount of ammonia and nitrates with every water change. I don't know if your BB colony(ies) were up to the task of handling it before stock were negatively affected.
It is not clear if your problem is disease from the fish you received, or if the ammonia level went very high from adding so many fish at once. (Note that some species are much more sensitive to even low levels of ammonia than others.).
As for the Prime and ferts, you would add ferts a day or two following the water change. Prime 'detoxifies' metals through bonding that makes them less or unavailable to plants.
As to dosing Prime for the entire tank, it's a preference and safeguard and can yield benefits, especially if/when water with negatives is being added directly to the tank at a reasonably fast rate. If you add directly to the tank and only add an amount enough for the water being added, you have diluted the product below it's recommended dose. The only way to truly add conditioner for the exact amount of water being added, would be to do it outside the aquarium in buckets or bins.
Finally, I still think your pre-filtering method misses the opportunity to also remove nitrates. I highly recommend API Nitra-Zorb.
Having said (er written) all of this, the pre-filtering/water staging process does allow for more stable water since O2/CO2 and pH stabilize. You're on a well and likely don't have chlorine, but if you did, the process would allow it to dissipate also.

So how well established is this tank? Are you confident that the BB colony(ies) is/are sufficient to handle the stock level...Also, with the level of ammonia and nitrate in your well water, I wonder/worry that your tank nitrate levels may be very high.

 

[cowgirluntamed]

I don't know the history of your tank and/or how well it may be cycled. Prior to filtering, you were adding a fair amount of ammonia and nitrates with every water change. I don't know if your BB colony(ies) were up to the task of handling it before stock were negatively affected.
It is not clear if your problem is disease from the fish you received, or if the ammonia level went very high from adding so many fish at once. (Note that some species are much more sensitive to even low levels of ammonia than others.).
As for the Prime and ferts, you would add ferts a day or two following the water change. Prime 'detoxifies' metals through bonding that makes them less or unavailable to plants.
As to dosing Prime for the entire tank, it's a preference and safeguard and can yield benefits, especially if/when water with negatives is being added directly to the tank at a reasonably fast rate. If you add directly to the tank and only add an amount enough for the water being added, you have diluted the product below it's recommended dose. The only way to truly add conditioner for the exact amount of water being added, would be to do it outside the aquarium in buckets or bins.
Finally, I still think your pre-filtering method misses the opportunity to also remove nitrates. I highly recommend API Nitra-Zorb.
Having said (er written) all of this, the pre-filtering/water staging process does allow for more stable water since O2/CO2 and pH stabilize. You're on a well and likely don't have chlorine, but if you did, the process would allow it to dissipate also.

So how well established is this tank? Are you confident that the BB colony(ies) is/are sufficient to handle the stock level...Also, with the level of ammonia and nitrate in your well water, I wonder/worry that your tank nitrate levels may be very high.

The tank with the glowlights dying had 6 peppered cories in it just before them and they were fine and I had been doing weekly water changes. Now, I know that's not a lot of fish, but I also added a full bottle(said it could treat 20 gallons) of tetra safe start as well. I checked that evening and the next morning and ammonia was at 0.25 and I did a water change that evening I think after I got home but I don't remember. I did use some tetra test strips for a quick check but double checked with the liquid kit if something was noticably off. Everything seemed ok except the lone cherry barb they stuck in messing with the glowlights. I took it to the lfs that I don't like but it had to go somewhere. Lol.

Anyway, I still kept having deaths. In the first week I lost half of them but the ammonia never went past 0.25 and the nitrates never went past 20. Until one day after I medicated I did an 80% water change on it. Before I started adding water and after I drained it I noticed a tetra swimming bad. Then a second one did after I filled the tank and a harlequin died in the other tank with it's water change. That time the ammonia was at 0.5 AFTER the water change.....then I started panicking about my water and here we stand now. I don't know what's happening as the rest of the fish(that I've had the longest) are all acting just fine.

I've had glowlights before and I changed a tank over from gravel to sand and had a little mini cycle happen and the glowlights faded a lot and that was at 0.5 too if I remember right. Multiple water changes got that back to normal and they were fine. These fish never did that until right before they started to swim funny. Then they die a few days later. The harlequins are fine one day, dead the next with absolutely no sign that I can see. They are in with the cories and the cories are fine.

Thanks for the info about the prime. As for the nitra-zorb, I will more than likely try that when I run out of the zeolite. I don't want to waste this stuff right now though.

I did my water change and my ammonia in the prefiltered water was still showing just under 0.25 but everybody seemed ok. I didn't see that other tetra that had started swimming funny so I need to check in the morning.

 

[AbbeysDad]

In a well cycled or established tank you should not be able to measure ANY ammonia at all! .25 - .50 can be lethal to many fish. So the larger water change was a problem.
Again, some fish seem to tolerate higher levels of ammonia, although some gill damage may occur.
Your filtering should resolve the ammonia problem, but also best to have some Prime on hand.

Along with the ammonia (which we presume will be converted to nitrates), you are also adding 5+ppm of nitrates from your well water during water changes. With tank generated nitrates, and limited plants, I question your <20ppm tank nitrates test results.

In any case, once you resolve the ammonia and nitrates in your source water, I think your fish will fair much better.

 

[cowgirluntamed]

I'm thinking along the lines that it's a combo of things. I do have another pale looking tetra. Not swimming funny yet....I do believe they came in with something though.

I'm not saying the well water might not have been part of the issue....I'm thinking it may have gotten temporarily contaminated some how. I've never had 0.5ppm of ammonia in the tap. So if I did an 80% water change and that ammonia was in the tank even more than the 0.5ppm....I think the fish would be dead quite fast.

I do think the unstable ph played a roll. It's never seemed to bother anybody before (if indeed it's always been like that) but if these guys were already stressed I can see it hurting more.

The tank the glowlights are in has been set up for a long time (over two years probably). It housed my gourami for 6 weeks before the cories at probably 6 months or so. It's got nice pieces of drift wood and sand and a bunch of plastic plants. As well as a double sponge filter rated for 30 gallons. I think before the gourami it may just have been a couple of nerite snails for a bit. I can't really remember to be honest but these two anubias plants have been in there since setup 3 or 4 years ago.

Anyway, the nitrate really doesn't go up that high in that tank. I wasn't feeding a ton either. But I will test things again before the next water change and let you know. Of course....there aren't nearly as many fish left as when I started.

Also, on a side note, I was home from work on vacation when I received the fish. That way I was able to monitor and do water changes as needed. Which, obviously, eventually didn't work out so well. But it seemed fine the first few changes and then things got crazy.

But yeah, I've done glowlight tetras before and they did fine in my water. Though I was really only topping off more than doing water changes. I don't know if I will ever know what's going on...but prefiltering seems to be the way to go at the moment and I will go to an lfs that I found online thats 50 mins away and check with them. I don't like the local lady as she was trying to make me feel stupid for buying these fish online. (Took a lone cherry barb in to her that got put in the bag with the tetras and was going after them way too much). I'd go to Petsmart over her even.

Anyway I feel I'm rambling. Time for bed...lol.

Oh, and I normally do 50 to 60% water changes if that helps at all.

Just remembered....the 80% water change was to get rid of the api triple sulfa. Could that have caused a weird ammonia reading?