Ah English Weather..

[Spader]

 

[carrera]

wow, this thread certainly went a different direction.

on this new topic though, no one with common sense really hates america as a country, but when the odd american comes out all big headed like in this thread, the average non-american cant help themselves but go all america-bashing.

the citizens of the proud American Empire work their asses off for the rest of the world though? ...really?

just remember where you came from

 

[Spader]

i came from ireland......

 

[smurfyy_2k3]

I really resent ignorant statements like that. If Britain would have done her job to start with, America wouldn't have had to take over your Empire. Face it....you failed, we took your place.

you did not take our empire we gave the countrys back, look at a couple of flags i can think of two right now that still have the union jack in, how many flags can you name off the top of your head with the usa flag none, you barely had an empire, britain ruled alot of countrys not too long ago.

thats the best map of our empire i can find but there a better one we use in school ill see if i can get my hands on it
the only map like this for america is one of iraq and iran and al of those countrysover there which isnt from the past its for the future!!
so after we gave our countrys back alot of people feel you are tring to take ove iraq.

 

[PaulEbs]

That diagram shows less than half of the British Empire in the 1900's..

..Iron Man, I have PM'd you as i don't understand how anyone your age can be so stupid, as to come out with remarks like that. Please, let's discuss how you can be further educated?

 

[smurfyy_2k3]

thats the best map of our empire i can find but there a better one we use in school ill see if i can get my hands on it

thats the one we use in school i was trying to find it

 

[Seidge]

What the?

American big headed fools.

They act like they are the bloody saviours of the world. Money and power are useless if you dont have the inteligence to use it economically. It can only last so long. And let me say America DOES contribute most to global warming (the 2nd is china and germany) and not because it is large and has a massive population, its because they do not care about a sustainable future. Its just a mind-set.

Let me remind all you americans when given the opportunity to sign the kyoto agreement to put binding targets on emissions said no as it would result in serious harm to the economy of the united states. When pressured into signing by europe they proceeded to buy other countries allowances.

Does this sound like saviours of the world? It sounds pretty selfish to me. And to all you Americans out there, don't get wound up about it and get on the defensive. You should get on the offensive and tell your government what you want instead of them telling you what you need.

 

[smurfyy_2k3]

What the?

American big headed fools.

They act like they are the bloody saviours of the world. Money and power are useless if you dont have the inteligence to use it economically. It can only last so long. And let me say America DOES contribute most to global warming (the 2nd is china and germany) and not because it is large and has a massive population, its because they do not care about a sustainable future. Its just a mind-set.

Let me remind all you americans when given the opportunity to sign the kyoto agreement to put binding targets on emissions said no as it would result in serious harm to the economy of the united states. When pressured into signing by europe they proceeded to buy other countries allowances.

Does this sound like saviours of the world? It sounds pretty selfish to me. And to all you Americans out there, don't get wound up about it and get on the defensive. You should get on the offensive and tell your government what you want instead of them telling you what you need.

 

[Miss Wiggle]

jesus why are you bickering over empires..... life shouldn't be about who can control most of the world..... how about letting the people who live in a country be in charge of it and make they're own descisions, that goes for the UK and the USA.

Yes the USA may have given more than anyone for the tsunami relief.... but if you break it down proportionally I don't think they gave more per person than other countries. It's not a competition anyway, we should all do what we can, I work for Leeds council and organised a commitee for fund raising for it, we've raised about 175,000 to date and were building a childrens centre in Sri Lanka to provide continued support to the communities that have been destroyed. Not just throwing money at the problem but actually doing something about it ourselves with the skills and expertise we have, were also going to provide long term support to those running it, it's not just about how much money you give, it's taking the time to help where you can.

I know I'll get flamed for this, but everyones intitled to an opinion and this is mine. As for New Orleans, it's not really comparable, yes it was a massive disaster and I'm truly sorry for everyone who lost they're family/livelihoods etc etc, but the USA is one of the richest countries in the world, unlike the countries affected by the tsunami they can actually afford to get themselves out of the situation. And correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't Bush's failure to react sooner one of the major contributing factors in how bad things got, you can hardly hold the rest of the world accountable for that, you elected him (or at least stood by and did nothing when the election was rigged).

And don't even start me on America's environmental policy, god I could rant for days.

I have nothing against American's as individuals, I take everyone as I find them, if they're nice and civil to me I'll be the same back. But we have to take your governments decisions as representative of America, Bush got re-elected so a fair amount of people must agree with what he does, and I think the decisions he makes and the way he represents his country is appaualing, America's world wide reputation has gone completely down the pan since he's been in power.

Now please no-one take this as a personal affront, basically it all boils down to my opinion of Bush!

 

[PaulEbs]

Spader...

Did u read up on Air con? And how it DOES MAJORLY affect our position with global warming?

If air con in America alone wasn't used from now on, as a country, you would be saving 42% more energy. The thing is, it's not the way the conditioner conditions the air, it's the amount of power they require.

Is anyone from China? I would like to hear your opinions on the fact your government loves building power stations, and doesn't seem to care too much for the environment. It's a shame too, because China is a beautiful, beautiful country.

 

[jarmado]

sure is getting hot in here.

Spader...

Did u read up on Air con? And how it DOES MAJORLY affect our position with global warming?

If air con in America alone wasn't used from now on, as a country, you would be saving 42% more energy. The thing is, it's not the way the conditioner conditions the air, it's the amount of power they require.

Is anyone from China? I would like to hear your opinions on the fact your government loves building power stations, and doesn't seem to care too much for the environment. It's a shame too, because China is a beautiful, beautiful country.

are you trying to pick a fight with everybody?

 

[Xebadir]

Time for me to weigh in here.

Hi, my names John, and while being a aquatic nut , I also happen to have my head in the clouds on a permanent basis: Yes thats right i am by training a Meteorologist. (BSci, University of Melbourne, Australia Majoring in Meteorology, and Paleoclimatology).


Now intially ill make the comment, that i sympathise with your heatwave woes: I encounter the same thing here: except on a far nastiers scale: Try 43 degree centigrade in the room where you keep you tank. (I do actually run the aircon on these super hot days to prevent deaths).

As for "Global Warming" I really have to argue its existant due to HUMAN causes. I agree the planet is by trending data, generally heating up, however we have to remember that humans are a small blip on the earths surface. There have been times, particularly during the Mesozoic(esp Cretaceous) where the AVERAGE temperature worldwide is estimated to have been 14 DEGREES CENTIGRADE higher than current levels. Recent evidence in soil samples suggest that the north sea, and in fact the artic were actually subtropical at this time, with creatures that are normally found in the subtropics, found far far north. Overall evidence suggests that this heat was far more significant that our trivial influence. Carbon Dioxide is an interesting point.... the current concerntration is in the range of 367ppm...(0.367% of atmospheric composition). There have been times when this has been 20%!! Did you also know that CO2 is not the main greenhouse gas.....in fact the most potent current greenhouse gas is Water, vapourised high up in the atmosphere.(Stratosphere)

The world itself has emerged from a recent period of ice ages: This warming trend has been constant since the little ice age(a time at which the Thames froze over). It is not unusual for the ice caps to melt, as populist ecologists and media seem to believe: For less than 1% of time ice has existed on the surface of the planet. (the assumed age of earth is around 4 billion years +-) There have been times such as the Siberian Eruptive mass exitinction(try 10000km^3 of silic lava ejected about 270mill years) where 80% of all species have been wiped off the planet: if you go back to 560mill years....try 98% of all species eradicated. In erupting volcanoes belch out large quantities of CO2 and SO4(2-): The siberian eruption increased the global composition of CO2 in the order of 5%. There is constant outgassing from volcanoes: just wait until Yellowstone Volcano erupts, that will change the worlds climate considerably. Tambora(18th century) erupted and dropped the climate of the planet by 1.5 degrees centigrade. This was a minute eruption, a mere ten thousandeth of an eruption in NZ(one of the larger). A massive Volcanic event is in the wings, and will have far more a profound effect than the little we produce.

The earth is a rapidly changing dynamic system, we are merely a speck on the timeframe of its existance, as sophisticated as we are our time will come. Diasters are not more common, they are just more noticable due to the populations in regions of disturbance. The Climate may continue to get warmer as we move out of our ice age, or it may lapse again. Either way we must adapt to our ruler the earth, or suffer the consequences. Just makes you realise how fragile we really are.

John

 

[Miss Wiggle]

well said John, BUT as it seems to be human nature to adapt this planet to best suit us, it's only natural we should be doing something to keep the planet as it is to support human life. I totally understand were a speck on the lifespan of earth, one day we will die off and something will replace us. but IF we want to keep the species going it's only natural to try and slow down global warming to keep the conditions right for us, much as with our fishes we try to keep the condition right for them despite what nature is doing by itself. If people want to sit back and let nature take it's course so we are wipedf out by changing climatic conditions it's fine, but they should be aware that's what they are doing not just being lazy and not thinking it through.

Also my other bug bear about global warming.... when people in the UK say it's great cos we need more hot weather..... actually from what I'm aware of the most likely outcome is the path of the gulf stream will change and it'll get colder in the UK

 

[Xebadir]

actually from what I'm aware of the most likely outcome is the path of the gulf stream will change and it'll get colder in the UK

From the simulations i have seen on this I can tell you: that the models suggest this as 1 possible outcome, 1 of quite a few. The truth is that we simply dont know if this will be the case.

IF we want to keep the species going it's only natural to try and slow down global warming to keep the conditions right for us,

This again is a valid point, however will be near impossible in practice: We are looking at something that is nearly impossible to stop. I agree Humans are the first species to be able to alter their enviroment, however do we really have that much control over the Global enviroment: when its all said and done we can minise our outputs: but the natural cause will still exist. If something major happens, then there is nothing we can do(besides an impact event which there may be possibilities with solar sails etc). Our grasp on the dynamics of the planet is tenous to say the least, and this is reflected in the deaths by natural diasters: On average 80 People die each year from Tornadoes from severe thunderstorms, 1000+ die from lightning, Just last year 1316 people died in the US alone from Hurricanes. This is not to mention the Tens of thousands dead from mudslides, and typhoons in the western pacific. A minor earthquake like the Tsunami might kill 175000, what about The chinese earthquake that killed in excess of 1 million people? These are just some of those that exist: what about biological pathogens? The black death killed off HALF the population of Medievil Europe the first time round. This is not to mention the people who starve to death by drought, that we can do nothing to prevent.

Really can we stop the inevitable: Climate will Change, Can we change with it?

 

[Miss Wiggle]

actually from what I'm aware of the most likely outcome is the path of the gulf stream will change and it'll get colder in the UK

From the simulations i have seen on this I can tell you: that the models suggest this as 1 possible outcome, 1 of quite a few. The truth is that we simply dont know if this will be the case.

fair enough, it's not particularly my field of expertise but my sister is an environmental activist and a friend has a degree in something environmental and that's what they've told me, I know no-one knows for definate, that's just what I was told is likely.

IF we want to keep the species going it's only natural to try and slow down global warming to keep the conditions right for us,

This again is a valid point, however will be near impossible in practice: We are looking at something that is nearly impossible to stop. I agree Humans are the first species to be able to alter their enviroment, however do we really have that much control over the Global enviroment: when its all said and done we can minise our outputs: but the natural cause will still exist. If something major happens, then there is nothing we can do(besides an impact event which there may be possibilities with solar sails etc). Our grasp on the dynamics of the planet is tenous to say the least, and this is reflected in the deaths by natural diasters: On average 80 People die each year from Tornadoes from severe thunderstorms, 1000+ die from lightning, Just last year 1316 people died in the US alone from Hurricanes. This is not to mention the Tens of thousands dead from mudslides, and typhoons in the western pacific. A minor earthquake like the Tsunami might kill 175000, what about The chinese earthquake that killed in excess of 1 million people? These are just some of those that exist: what about biological pathogens? The black death killed off HALF the population of Medievil Europe the first time round. This is not to mention the people who starve to death by drought, that we can do nothing to prevent.

Really can we stop the inevitable: Climate will Change, Can we change with it?

absolutely, but if we spent even half the money globally that we do say fighting each other, on shed loads of research into the environment and every single person committed to making changes then maybe we could buy some extra time...... but we'll probably blow each other up with a nuclear war before that happens anyway

also just to make doubly clear, I did say IF we want to..... personally I don't think we should meddle with nature to that extent. I try and do my bit not to mess up the planet too much for it's next inhabitants.... but it is hard to judge how far you should go.

Take my sister as an example, she lives on an self-sustaining farm community thing (I swear she has a tardis and livces in the 60's! ) all they're leccy comes from they're own solar and wind generators, they get they're own food from farming the land, she's vegan (as is pretty much everyone who works/lives there) and everything she does she thinks through the environmental consequences.... personally I don't know how she could live like that, I like my creature comforts too much, she say's she couldn't not live like that. Each to they're own though. I think if we all (individually) picked 1 cause that really mattered to us, be it the environment, curing AIDS, rescuing animals etc etc etc and dedicated a significant part of our life to helping it the world would be a much better place for everyone while were here and for future generations and inhabitants of the planet, unfortunately too many people are selfish and only think of number 1.