Adding Salt

GoinNuts

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I have 2 tanks: 55 gal with 6 cichlids and a 20 gal with 2 veiltail goldfish. I've had the goldfish for a little over 3 years with no problems (cichlids are another story - still a newbie at that one!), and while at the lfs yesterday for supplies, the employee asked me if I ever add salt to the tanks.

I said no and she was shocked. Told me I HAVE to add salt, that it will energize them and that they love, love, love it.

So, she gave me a bag of sea salt in rock form and told me to throw a handful in the tanks. I haven't done it yet, wanted to check in here first. The fish at the lfs DID look very healthy and were quite energetic, though I don't know if that's because of the salt or not.

Anyway, is salt the be all and end all that she claimed? If it IS good for the tanks, how often do you put it in? When you do water changes? (I do a 25% w/c every Friday.)

TIA

Lisa
 
Well, no its not neccesary. I dont use it.

Fish like cories (or fish which have no scales) will hate the salt, so i would be cautious about adding without reaserching your fish.

Im not sure about goldfish and cichilds, but salt is good for fish, especially fish which are ill.
 
Well, no its not neccesary. I dont use it.

Fish like cories (or fish which have no scales) will hate the salt, so i would be cautious about adding without reaserching your fish.

Im not sure about goldfish and cichilds, but salt is good for fish, especially fish which are ill.
The fact of whether a fish has scales or not is immaterial, it is down to the osmoregualtion and whether that fish is designed to be able to cope with salt in the water (morays don't have scales, and nor do the catfish that live on reefs - Plotosus lineatus).

I do concur with Qays though, dosing with salt as a tonic is massively outdated and just not necessary. If you keep fish from south america it is likely to cause damage to the kidneys over time. Tonic salt used to be used when UGFs were the height of filtration technology but as people have learned more it has generally fallen from fashion.
 
Thanks, everyone. I thought it was a little odd, but I've heard stranger, lol.

What type of cichlids do you have?

Currently, I have:

2 Electric Yellows
1 Johanni
1 Female Kenyi

I had 2 Red Zebras, but lost one last week and the other wasn't looking well so he's in my hospital tank at the moment. I'm feeling a bit frustrated with the cichlids because, to be honest, they are proving to be a bit more complicated than I expected. Also, stock choices around here aren't all that great. Yellows, Reds and Kenyis are about all I can find (compatibility-wise, and the Kenyi isn't exactly a safe choice, even.) Females? Forget it. The lfs around here seem to prefer stocking males for the most part. They are expensive, too. $8 - $12+ for juvies.

My tank is definitely understocked and that's proving to be a problem.

Lisa
 
This is from a very knowledgable member on another fish forum:

Primary freshwater fishes are those that have remained, as far as we can tell from the fossil record, in fresh waters throughout their evolutionary heritage. Fishes that fall into this category include Characins, Carps and Catfishes.

Secondary freshwater fishes are those that had marine ancestors at some point in past time, but which moved into freshwater in order to occupy various niches. Cichlids are an example of secondary freshwater fishes - their nearest relatives are the marine Damselfishes of the Family Pomacentridae, and it's highly likely that both Families shared a common (and marine) ancestor.

Consequently, the secondary freshwater fishes still have at least some degree of osmoregulatory capacity for dealing with salt in the water, while the primary freshwater fishes never evolved it in the first place. So, placing primary freshwater fishes into water containing salt is a bad idea, and even modest amounts will kill them. Secondary freshwater fishes, on the other hand, can tolerate small amounts of salt, and indeed some members of secondarily freshwater Families are brackish in nature - the Cichlid fish Etroplus suratensis springs to mind as one example. Cyprinodontiformes also fall into this category - both the egg-laying Cyprinodontidae and the live-bearing Poeciliidae are also secondarily freshwater, some of the latter Family being fully brackish in the wild (indeed, the Giant Sailfin Molly, Poecilia vivipara, is fully euryhaline, and can live in fully marine water, as specimens captured in seawater off the Yucatan Peninsula in Mexico testify eloqwuently).

Quite simply put, if your aquarium contains any primary freshwater fishes, do NOT add salt, as those fishes will suffer considerable stress if exposed to salt, and may even die. Even in the case of secondarily freshwater fishes, salt is only a good idea if the fishes concerned are KNOWN to inhabit brackish waters in the wild.

Most fishes fall into the category of being stenohaline, namely, they are either freshwater or fully marine. These fishes should only be exposed to the kind of water in which they occur in the wild with respect to salt content. Euryhaline fishes, that can migrate with some degree of freedom between freshwater, brackish and fully marine environments, are much fewer in number, and tend to be conspicuous in this regard when encountered in the textbooks - fishes such as Scats, Monos, Therapon jarbua, velifera Mollies and one or two of the Puffer Fishes are notable for this. Within the euryhaline division, there are those that can migrate more or less at will, and those that do so developmentally - the Puffer Fish Tetraodon nigroviridis is developmentally euryhaline, spending its juvenile stages in freshwater before migrating at a steady pace to increasingly saline waters until, as adults, they are strongly brackish or fully marine fishes. Once again, and I cannot stress this enough, it pays to do the research and find out what your fish is!
 
Thank you, bignose, for that very educational reply.

I do very much agree with the last line in the quote:
Once again, and I cannot stress this enough, it pays to do the research and find out what your fish is

However, there is a problem. Finding reliable, accurate information is pretty blasted hard. I can show a pic of a fish to 10 different people and get 10 different 'guesses' on what it is! I can get 3 people telling me salt is good, 5 telling me it isn't and then another 4 saying, "It depends."

The average person has never heard of the words euryhaline or stenohaline (for example). Truth be told, they are brand new to me and I've been researching my brains out the past 2 months and haven't run across them.

Ugh.

We beginners/laypersons really have no idea where to start, what to look for, what to dismiss and what to keep. It's quite maddenining, to tell you truly. Then when we get addressed like lazy, brainless whats-it's (not saying you did this, but it HAS happened) when we ASK about things we have no clue on but WANT to learn.

I need a drink. 8)

Lisa
 
The nice thing is that with the knowledge of those 'official' scientific words, you can do to a database search of scientific papers and do some serious research. scholar.google.com (probably the best freely available scientific paper database) has 7390 entries for the word 'euryhaline'. Web of science (which you probably have to do to a university to use) has 1267 entries. I know there are other paper databases out there, too.

Using the scientific name of a species, (once you get it identified), will also usually bring up a lot of papers on it in the scientific literature.

Point is, those papers have been peer-reviewed and accredited by professional researchers. So, while certainly they will not always be correct, i.e. even professionals have disagreements over results, they will not be word of a friend, or anecdote, or just something that some unknown posted on a webpage.

It is very true that it can be hard to find information. I cannot find the source (I think it was Benjamin Franklin) but it was once said something like "It doesn't matter how good or how much information there is in a library if you don't know how to find it." (Maybe it was Dewey.) However, sweet-talk one of the librarians into helping you, it is their job.
 

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