About To Start Fishless Cylcle.....

[Mowbz]

4ppm is where I dose to - I know that the suggested level is 4-5ppm however my kit only reads up to 5ppm. Thus if I've actually dosed to 6 or 7ppm it will still read 5ppm. Above 5ppm is bad for the cycle (the wrong sort of bacteria becomes dominant) so we dose to 4ppm as we can test for that.

I would suggest that the add and wait method is the easiest - i,e, wait till your Ammonia drops to 0ppm before dosing back up again.

Miles

Thanks Miles!

I have the API Master kit, so can test higher than 4ppm, but thats what it came out at before the drop. Ill wait until i get a zero reading before topping up!

Thanks again..

 

[Miles_hot]

I too have the api master kit and the "5ppm" reading is actually 5+ ie 5 and above hence my cautious approach of staying at 4

 

[Mowbz]

Ah, im sure mine shows 4ppm, then 8ppm as the next up. (Im at work, so cant check!) Im assuming this is what is meant by "5+"? ie, anything over 4ppm is unreadable by the test kit.

Ill be checking the water parameters again when i get in this evening at around 6.30pm. I thought it may now be a good time to mention that i added 2 live plants yesterday. Ill post the name when i post the water parameters this evening. I have a feeling this could have contributed to the sudden drop in ammonia within 24hrs of first dosing the tank to 4ppm as iirc, the plants will absorb the ammonia. If this is trus, is it worth removing plants for the cycle?

Thanks in advance....

 

[Miles_hot]

I too am.running from memory so very fallible however I'm sure that we decided on 45ppm for a reason the plants will not cause you too many issues however they will prevent you from cycling the tank in the dark which will invite algae - on balance I'd go without but its your call

 

[Mowbz]

I too am.running from memory so very fallible however I'm sure that we decided on 45ppm for a reason the plants will not cause you too many issues however they will prevent you from cycling the tank in the dark which will invite algae - on balance I'd go without but its your call

No, i have no experience, im not going on "my call", ill only #62### it up! lol

Ill whip them out when i get home, and drop them in a bucket in the unit under the tank. Thanks also for your helps on the lamps Miles, ill be checking out the threads you mentioned this evening. The actual butchering of the lid and fitting new electronics is going to be very simple with me being a mechanic, as i spend all day working on electrics, its the "what lights do what" that i struggle with!

Thanks again, todays tank results to follow!

 

[waterdrop]

In my experience it seems to give the A-Bacs a bit of a kick to start the fishless cycle off at the slightly higher concentration of 4ppm or so (as opposed to 2-3ppm) for just the first phase until nitrite(NO2) begins to spike. I know it doesn't make much sense as either concentration should provide more than enough ammonia for the small initial state of the beginning A-Bac colony but the observation seems to hold over time in my opinion. Once the nitrite spikes it makes sense to dial the dosing down to 2-3ppm for the middle part of the fishless cycle. The other important parameters have already been mentioned - it seems to optimize things to have the pH up in the 8.0 to 8.4 range (although it's not much different in the high 7's) and to try and center the temperature around 29C/84F.

For the plants you'll want a touch of fertilizer (since a brand new tank has no food for them!) And you'll want to minimize the light as much as possible, probably crunching down in the 4 to 5 hour range since the ammonia will be there to make the algae go wild if it possibly can.

~~waterdrop~~

 

[eaglesaquarium]

The reason for staying at 4-5ppm is that at concentrations of about 8ppm or higher promotes the growth of the wrong kind of bacteria.

I advise against adding plants during a cycle. Light + Ammonia = algae. However, depending on how many plants you have, you could conceivably use the procedure for a "silent cycle". This is generally NOT recommended for beginners though. The best option might be to try to return the plants until the tank is cycled. That way the plants don't suffer from lack of nutrients or anything else while you wait. Remember that without fish in the container with the plants, the plants will run out of the essential nutrients for the plants to draw from the water column.

 

[Mowbz]

Cheers guys. Ill still bucket the plants with some fertilizer in the hope they make it, however at £8 for the pair, i can knock them as part of the learning curve (In other words, dont get carried away!)

I've got the tank covered, in the hope that i don't grow an algae museum, and with the hood unit packing up last night, the sure isn't going to be any artificial light until i get the lid stripped and rebuilt with new lamp units!

Ive done today's tests, and the results are;

PH - Poss 7.3? See below
Nitrite - 0ppm Again see below
Nitrate - 0ppm
Ammonia - 0ppm


Ok, the PH Level. (Using API Master Test Kit ) I figured i would test high range as it was 8.2 yesterday, but it was slightly lighter than the 7.4 mark on the High Range, so i decided to test Low Range. This came out a rich blue, not quite navy, but certainly a bit darker than the last mark on the Low Range test chart at 7.2. Should i, based on this, assume a level of approximately 7.3, and can this drop in PH but caused by the absorption of the ammonia over the last two days, as the tank started at a very clear 7.2?

I have written above 0ppm for both Nitrite and Nitrate. This is because whilst the levels were not quite on the second measure of the API chart, but they were certainly not a dead zero. Both were about halfway between the marks.

Could i possibly attribute both of these to the addition of two small plants yesterday? Surely they could not be attributed to just 3 days of the cycle? (These were removed this evening on the general advise of the forum.)

One last, should i now go ahead with dosing te tank with ammonia again as it is now a absolute Zero?

Thanks in advance..

 

[Mowbz]

Another thought.

How will changing the substrate from gravel to sand affect the cycle, or should i have done this from the start? Would i be better off leaving it till the end when i do a 100% water change?

I was going to do it this evening, but thought that if all the floating sand gets stuck into my filter before it settles, surely thats not going to help?

Thanks again,

Ben

 

[Mowbz]

Anyone?...

 

[fluttermoth]

changing substrate will not affect your cycle in any way. The good bacterai you're growing are 99.9999% in the filter, not on the gravel or anywhere else.

If you wash the sand properly, you'll have poured away any particles that don't sink immediatley, so you don't have to worry about any 'bit's' floating around. Turn the filters off while you do it anyway, just to be on the safe side.

 

[Mowbz]

Wicked, thanks very much! Might get the sand in this evening if i have time.

Ive not re-dosed the ammonia back up to 4ppm since it dropped yesterday. Should i do that this evening? The first dose to start the cycle was only put in on Saturday, but im already at Zero!

 

[fluttermoth]

You need to re-dose as soon as the level drops to zero, or your new bacteria will begin to starve!

 

[Mowbz]

You need to re-dose as soon as the level drops to zero, or your new bacteria will begin to starve!

This is what i thought, but didnt want to go ahead in case it went the other way! Im about to start testing the tank and will re-dose after, and test again.

Thanks for the support fluttermoth!

 

[Mowbz]

Today's levels;

PH - 7.6
Ammonia - 4ppm
Nitrite - 0ppm
Nitrate - 0ppm

Temp still set to 30'C. Water has taken on a brown/rich orange hue. Vary hard to see in the test tube, but a quick check of the originally white ceramic media shows same colour very clearly.

EDIT: Ammonia was 0ppm, tank was re-dosed with 3ml to 4ppm.