55 Gallon Journal

[508]

So since I'm waiting on a new filter which should be purchased in the coming week I decided to post a journal. I've recently bought some silver sand from Amazon, and provided I buy the filter next week I should start cycling by then. I don't know whether to purchase the plants before or after the cycle but right now I'm leaning towards adding them first just so they have some time to grow before I put in any fish. The tank will be heavily planted with over 30 plant  so it might just be the case that all my plants take the bio-load and I won't have to do the fishless cycle at all. Of course in that case I'll have to add my fish gradually but that was something I was planning on doing either way.

 
I'm trying to go for a peaceful community with good balance between bottom dwellers, shoaling fish and centerpiece fish.  I'll be buying pretty much everything except plants from my local Maidenhead Aquatics at Syon Park; they have a great selection of fish and the staff give top notch advice.

 
So here I plan to do for the stocking
 

• Sterbai Corydoras x6 - The Corydoras Catfish are definitely one of my favourite tropical species out there, and I think the Sterbai look the nicest and grow to a perfect size.
  
• Denison Barb x5 - Lovely community fish, and they look like mini-sharks with amazing colours. What else is there to say?
  
• Boesemani Rainbowfish x3 - Yes yes I know that I should keep more than three but I've talked to a few people who keep just three and they seem to get on with no problems. 
• Angelfish x1 - Great centerpiece fish and they are one of the most popular tropical species for a reason. Just wonderful
  
• Cardinal Tetra x10 - My favourite tetra by far, and from what I've read they're too big for the Angel to eat them. I'll probably put these in early to let them grow before I unleash my Angel.
• German Blue Rams x2 - I called up my LFS today to ask if they could be kept in hard water and they claim they kept them in local tap water so I assume it should be fine.

Will update soon!

 

[Primous]

Whatever you do don't add sand. Definitely do not add plants or even purchase them right now. Cycling brings high concentrations of ammonia, nitrate, and nitrite all of which in high concentrations will sully your sand and destroy your plants. Also cycling will cause huge swings in ph so again, don't add anything and don't even turn on your lights. My apologies if this seems like news you don't want to hear, but I'm/we're saving you money in doing so.

 

[508]

Whatever you do don't add sand. Definitely do not add plants or even purchase them right now. Cycling brings high concentrations of ammonia, nitrate, and nitrite all of which in high concentrations will sully your sand and destroy your plants. Also cycling will cause huge swings in ph so again, don't add anything and don't even turn on your lights. My apologies if this seems like news you don't want to hear, but I'm/we're saving you money in doing so.

 
Okay thanks, I was actually planning to add the sand before I start cycling but I won't now!

 

[Blondielovesfish]

Looking forward to seeing the final result!
 
TBH, I wouldn't worry about adding plants with the cycling, many people do it and it cuts time off of cycling, as the plants will take in some of the ammonia and nitrate.
I had no problems with cycling with sand and plants.

 

[Primous]

TBH, I wouldn't worry about adding plants with the cycling, many people do it and it cuts time off of cycling, as the plants will take in some of the ammonia and nitrate.
 

 Another reason to make sure you don't add plants is because you do not want them sucking up ammonia and nitrate, you want that to be the job of the bacteria you're trying to establish inside your filter. You can plant heavily and stock really-really lightly and forgo the cycling process entirely. However, if you want to establish a strong colony of bacs, again don't add plants.
 
But like blondie said I'm really looking forward to seeing how this turns out. Any pics of the tank available? Also, what lights/ferts/co2 are you using?

 

[Blondielovesfish]

 

TBH, I wouldn't worry about adding plants with the cycling, many people do it and it cuts time off of cycling, as the plants will take in some of the ammonia and nitrate.
 

 Another reason to make sure you don't add plants is because you do not want them sucking up ammonia and nitrate, you want that to be the job of the bacteria you're trying to establish inside your filter. You can plant heavily and stock really-really lightly and forgo the cycling process entirely. However, if you want to establish a strong colony of bacs, again don't add plants.
 
But like blondie said I'm really looking forward to seeing how this turns out. Any pics of the tank available? Also, what lights/ferts/co2 are you using?
 

 
But surely, if the plants are going to take some of the ammonia, it means less bacteria has to grow, therefore the cycling is quicker.
When you get fish, those same plants will take the same amount of ammonia, if you don't have the plants, then a bunch of bacteria goes to waste.

 

[Primous]

 

 


TBH, I wouldn't worry about adding plants with the cycling, many people do it and it cuts time off of cycling, as the plants will take in some of the ammonia and nitrate.
 

 Another reason to make sure you don't add plants is because you do not want them sucking up ammonia and nitrate, you want that to be the job of the bacteria you're trying to establish inside your filter. You can plant heavily and stock really-really lightly and forgo the cycling process entirely. However, if you want to establish a strong colony of bacs, again don't add plants.
 
But like blondie said I'm really looking forward to seeing how this turns out. Any pics of the tank available? Also, what lights/ferts/co2 are you using?
 

 
But surely, if the plants are going to take some of the ammonia, it means less bacteria has to grow, therefore the cycling is quicker.
When you get fish, those same plants will take the same amount of ammonia, if you don't have the plants, then a bunch of bacteria goes to waste.
 


 
I see your point but it's misplaced so to speak. Cycling by definition is to build a colony of bacs in your filter. Having other things which eat or neutralize waste products isn't connected to cycling at all as there are numerous products that will reduce ammonia/nitrate/nitrite instantly or soon after. Yes, plants will definitely eat some of these waste products but that will only slow his "cycling" process. The aim in cycling is to have the bacteria eat through 5ppm / 4ppm (preferably 5ppm ) of ammonia inside of 12 hours.
 
Other sources, including plants, that reduce nitrate, ammonia, and nitrite are beside the point and goal.

 

[Blondielovesfish]

I see your point but it's misplaced so to speak. Cycling by definition is to build a colony of bacs in your filter. Having other things which eat or neutralize waste products isn't connected to cycling at all as there are numerous products that will reduce ammonia/nitrate/nitrite instantly or soon after. Yes, plants will definitely eat some of these waste products but that will only slow his "cycling" process. The aim in cycling is to have the bacteria eat through 5ppm / 4ppm (preferably 5ppm ) of ammonia inside of 12 hours.
 
Other sources, including plants, that reduce nitrate, ammonia, and nitrite are beside the point and goal.
 

 
Not meaning to sound rude, but have you read the updated cycling article? 3ppm is what you want to use, more and the nitrites will spike too high, often causing the cycle to crash.
 
I see your point about the ammonia/nitrite removing products, however they aren't a long term solution, whereas plants are.
 
Whilst you're right about cycling being about building up a colony of bacteria in the filter, I personally see no point of having a massive colony of bacteria if you're just going to add plants that will absorb some of the ammonia, making some of the bacteria you worked so hard to build go to waste.

 

[Primous]

The fact that we disagree about a particular point isn't something I'd associate with you being/sounding rude and I truly hope that our differences over any particular aspect of this hobby of ours doesn't infer that I'm trying to be rude to you either...
 
As to your question, the answer is no, I haven't read the "updated" cycling thread on this site. But I'd like to suggest that you read others and not just forums, but blogs, articles, write ups, and experiments. They are all out there and have been extremely useful to me. Also, I think we differ as to how we both define "long term solutions" I've come across numerous products that are designed to be inserted into your filter/tank to remove ammonia etc which some have been using for years and it's those I consider long term. But most importantly here is the blanket statement that "plants use ammonia." While this is true, we need to be aware of the the fact that this ammonia in take varies, hugely, according to a whole host of factors including, but not limited to PH, light, individual species, growth rates, co2, nutrients, frequency of water changes, water source etc They don't simply sit and absorb ammonia which is why ammonia at higher then normal concentrations is pure poison to them. Which is why in my initial post I suggested that the OP not add plants to begin with.
 
I didn't know that people were being told to use 3ppm of ammonia to cycle on this forum. Personally for the strength of the bac colony I'd still recommend 5ppm but that's a different topic altogether... 

 

[Blondielovesfish]

The fact that we disagree about a particular point isn't something I'd associate with you being/sounding rude and I truly hope that our differences over any particular aspect of this hobby of ours doesn't infer that I'm trying to be rude to you either...
 
As to your question, the answer is no, I haven't read the "updated" cycling thread on this site. But I'd like to suggest that you read others and not just forums, but blogs, articles, write ups, and experiments. They are all out there and have been extremely useful to me. Also, I think we differ as to how we both define "long term solutions" I've come across numerous products that are designed to be inserted into your filter/tank to remove ammonia etc which some have been using for years and it's those I consider long term. But most importantly here is the blanket statement that "plants use ammonia." While this is true, we need to be aware of the the fact that this ammonia in take varies, hugely, according to a whole host of factors including, but not limited to PH, light, individual species, growth rates, co2, nutrients, frequency of water changes, water source etc They don't simply sit and absorb ammonia which is why ammonia at higher then normal concentrations is pure poison to them. Which is why in my initial post I suggested that the OP not add plants to begin with.
 
I didn't know that people were being told to use 3ppm of ammonia to cycle on this forum. Personally for the strength of the bac colony I'd still recommend 5ppm but that's a different topic altogether... 

 
I don't think you're rude either
 
TBH I don't know what else to say, I don't think I can change your mind so saying anything more would just be a waste. Not that I'm saying your wrong, just that I don't think I can change your opinion  
You have your opinion and I have mine, it is up to the OP to who he wants to listen to, if either of us.
 
BTW if you want to read the sites cycling article, it is linked in my sig

 

[508]

So the striplight on my tank has been broken for a while now, only one of the bulbs actually work which is why I haven't been posting any updates for a while.
 
Had to order a new one for £60, hopefully it'll come soon because I'm worried my alternanthera cardinalis isn't receiving enough light.

 

[508]

OK, update time! 

 
So last week on Sunday I set everything up and started cycling. The filter took a while for me and my dad to set up, because the primer button got stuck and we couldn't figure out how to fix it. After a few hours of trying different things to get the darn thing running I eventually just smashed it as hard as I could and voila, it worked!
 
The next day my dad felt the tank was extremely boring to look at he bought a bunch of plants from our LFS and the whole thing started taking shape. Bought two driftwood pieces yesterday along with some more plants and I must say I'm very pleased with how it looks so far. I might still move the plants around a bit but it's hard for me to judge how they will look when fully grown. I'm planning on buying a few more next week for the foreground and possibly one for the background in the middle as it's empty at the moment but I haven't decided on which ones just yet. 
 
Current plant list

• Bolbitus heudelotii
• Alternanthera cardinalis
• Java Fern
• Hygrophila polysperma
• Echinodorus Bleheri
• Ceratophyllum demersum (need more of this imo)
• Vallis
• Anubias Nana

 

 
Also received my test kit today, anyone know what my ph is? I think it's about 8.2 but I can't tell
 

 
Thanks for reading!

Constructive criticism is more than welcome

 

[Ch4rlie]

Looks good, can't wait for plants to grow out a bit more and will fill in the tank a little more.
 
Driftwoods does add a little extra to the tank, a focus point and some depth.
 
Will you be adding a background poster?
 
One of the plants Alternanthera cardinals might be best grown with higher lights and co2 perhaps, am not expert in plants but I always sort of assume that plants with red leafs or very fine leafs tend to be a bit higher tech, meaning ferts and co2 is usually required. Might be wrong about that though.
 
Ph does look like its around the 8.2 mark but subjective really as best seen in natural lighting.

 

[Blondielovesfish]

Looks good! Definitely needs more plants though.
 
What I'd do, personally, is put a black background on and buy another bag of sand, then sculpt the sand so it is taller in the back and shallower in the front, this can do wonders and will add depth to the tank.
Also, I would get another thermometer, unfortunately, the stick on ones aren't very reliable. One that sits inside the tank is much better, sorry.
 
Your pH does look like 8.2, although like Ch4lie said, it needs to be viewed in natural light for us to be sure

 

[508]

Thanks for the tips and suggestions, I actually have some leftover sand so I will do just that. I'm not too happy with the overall look anymore though, and I think I'm going to rescape with a large piece of red moor as my focal point.