10 Gallons

Jason Wakelin

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Hello,
My children were recently given a 10 gallon aquarium, with the filter, heater and pump/airstone. We were thinking about putting in a small(6) group of Neon Tetras and are looking for advice. What other types of fish would be good companions, and how many are reasonable to add to this tank. I am a reptile person, so I understand the basic maintence of captive animals, but am open to any suggestions here.
Thank you.
 
Hello,
My children were recently given a 10 gallon aquarium, with the filter, heater and pump/airstone. We were thinking about putting in a small(6) group of Neon Tetras and are looking for advice. What other types of fish would be good companions, and how many are reasonable to add to this tank. I am a reptile person, so I understand the basic maintence of captive animals, but am open to any suggestions here.
Thank you.


I have a school of 6 harlequin rasbora in a similar sized tank, very attractive fish. also shrimp are popular as an addition although i've yet to get any, easily available though
 
Hi Jason,

The tropical fish hobby is a wonderful opportunity for children. Neon/Cardinal tetras are a beaufiful fish. Rasbora Heteromorpha, zebra danios, varios corydoras catfish would all be good beginner fish to consider as part of a community tank stocking plan.

Pet shops and other places that sell fish are quite extensive in misinformation and you have quite an opportunity to perhaps avoid a lot of grief because you've stumbled on a true hobbyist site here at TFF. Actually getting fish is the end reward after a somewhat long setup process. Don't run right out and get fish, that will set you up for possible disappointment as your children watch their new pets die in the first weeks.

What the shops don't want to tell you is that the core component of a fish tank system, the filter, is really just a kit, a kit of hardware that is meant to have a bunch of rather arcane hobbyist knowledge ideally applied to it such that over 3 to 6 weeks or more it becomes a "working filter" and is ready to handle live fish.

Have a look at our Beginners Resource Center and in particular begin reading the "Nitrogen Cycle" article and the articles on Fishless cycling and fish-in cycling and aquarium setup. Then come back here with questions. The members here are great. Lots and lots of them can give you all sorts of angles that will help you.

~~waterdrop~~ :)
 
Thank you all for the responses. It is not by accident that I came to a forum for advice, this was the first one that popped up in a google search though. I do plan to spend more time reading the information provided by the members here. As mentioned earlier, I am a reptile person (herper), I've spent the major portion of the past 30 years working with them. Because of that experience there is no way I'd ever go to a pet store for advice, especially a chain store.

I have some experience with fish, but all in a maintence situation and a long time ago. This would be my first time setting up an environment from scratch. Any and all advice is more than welcomed, but I will also be doing "my own homework" here and elsewhere. The tank is now functional, filled with water and semi decorated. We hope to put fish in it by early next week.

Thanks again for the responses, I sincerely appreciate you taking the time to help a "newbie".

Jason
 
well if you need anymore help with anythink just ask.
I do now have a question, after reading your link. Which was great by the way, thanks. None of the equipment or tank decorations are new, before we got it the tank was functioning. If no cleasners were used on the equipment would the bacteria still be present? The tank and supplies were all allowed to dry before we set it up again.
 
If the sponges and other media in the filter completely dried out its unlikely any of the bacteria lived, although if it was a short time its possible a few could make it through and help to seed a new fishless cycle if you went ahead and got started. It can be a challange finding the right sort of ammonia for the fishless cycle.

~~waterdrop~~
 
If the sponges and other media in the filter completely dried out its unlikely any of the bacteria lived, although if it was a short time its possible a few could make it through and help to seed a new fishless cycle if you went ahead and got started. It can be a challange finding the right sort of ammonia for the fishless cycle.

~~waterdrop~~
Thanks for the reply. Another question please, regarding cycling. As I understand it, you add ammonia until nitrite bacteria colonize the tank. The bacteria consume the ammonia, which will be a major component of the fishes waste (later on when the tank is ready). I'm reading in several places on this site that for some fish you want 0 nitrates and 0 ammonia. Do they cancel each other out? That sounds like a very, very precise balance between fish waste and bacteria numbers! Am I reading this wrong? Also, if it's not too much to figure out in one go, what are nitrates as opposed to nitrites? Sorry for such basic questions, but I've got to start somewhere. Thaks again for taking the time to respond to my questions.

Jason
 
When humans respire, they tank in air and give off a lot of CO2. When fish respire, the the gills give off a lot of CO2, but also quite a bit of ammonia, NH3. This NH3 off the gills is the largest contributor to ammonia in the tank. Fish waste, excess fishfood and plant debris all litter the tank with organic materials. These organic materials are quickly used by clouds of heterotrophic bacteria that are present in large numbers in the water and more ammonia is given off.

In nature the ammonia is immediately carried away from fish gills by and diluted in millions of gallons of water. By contrast, our aquariums are tiny glass boxes and the ammonia concentration builds up very differently than in the wild. Ammonia, even in small amounts, causes permanent gill damage and can lead to shortened fish lives and even death. In our tanks, when the bacteria suppression of chlorine/choramine is removed, many species of microscopic bacteria are freed up to reproduce. Besides the heterotrophic species populating the water, there are autotrophic species that attach themselves to hard surfaces. One specific type, Nitrosomonas, will grow in freshwater conditions with trace to 7ppm ammonia and pH conditions of 6.2 to 8.9 or so and will be the most efficient "ammonia oxidizing bacteria" or "ammonia eaters." These bacteria will convert ammonia (NH3) into nitrite(NO2) which, unfortunately, is also deadly to fish.

Nitrite(NO2), even in small amounts, breaks down the hemoglobin protein, destroying the red blood cells in fish blood, leading to suffocation and initially to brain and nerve damage. This causes shortened lives and/or death. There is a second autotrophic type of bacteria, Nitrospira, which grows in our filters and which eats this nitrite(NO2) and converts it to Nitrate(NO3.) Nitrate(NO3), while not a particularly good thing, is much less deadly to fish and can be removed with weekly water changes.

So in fishless cycling, what you're doing is artificially adding ammonia, in the correct concentration (2 to 6 parts per million or so) and maintaining other conditions that are ideal for autotrophic colony growth (84F/28C temp, 8.0 to 8.4 pH, traces of calcium and iron) and then waiting for the slow (3 weeks to 2 months) and unpredictable time period that these two types of bacteria need in order to both reproduce and to outcompete other species of bacteria within the given surface areas that are in the prime ammonia and oxygen areas of the tank (almost entirely inside a correctly working filter.)

Within reason, the bacterial colonies will grow to match the particular ammonia concentration of the water. The concentration of 5ppm has been worked out to be more than the concentration that would be produced by an over-population of a tank, using the one inch of adult fish body per US gallon of tank volume guideline. In all cases it is desirable to have an oversized, over-robust bacterial population that can "drop back" to match the real ammonia output of the actual fish population that is introduced to the tank after the fishless cycle. The bacterial colonies are made of of millions of cells. When the fish population gets smaller (or larger by a reasonably small amount) hundreds of thousands of bacterial cells can die off or can multiply to precisely match the current output of ammonia in the tank environment. This "adjusting" happens without any intervention by the aquarist. I believe this was one of the things you were asking about.

As for your other question, Nitrite(NO2) is nitrogen with two oxygens, Nitrate(NO3) has 3 oxygens. Nitrite is the ion that is much more deadly to fish, whereas nitrate(NO3) is the ion that includes nitric acid as about 7% of its state in water and thus is the substance that can move the tank water in an acid direction during cycling. And you'll recall that the autotrophic bacteria won't die, but will stop their growth process if the pH moves below 6.2 as the water gets more acidic.

In case you're having trouble going to sleep this weekend you can read this post a couple times. :lol:

~~waterdrop~~ :)
 
Thank you Waterdrop,

Your response was well written, comprehensive and totally understandable. I have given up the notion that we will be stocking the tank in a couple of days. However, I am wondering what would be a reasonable estimate for the length of time cycling will take. Some of the posts I've read are saying it would take months to do. Also if you are still inclined to continue assisting me, I've started a new thread here regarding the proper procedure for water changes.

Thanks again,
Jason
 
In many cases, the entire cycle can finish up in about 4 weeks but more often we hear from people who are having trouble getting their cycle done and we end up working with people who are in the 6 weeks to 2 months range. If you can get a sample of the filter media in a mature tank, it can be used to seed your filter and could shorten the time considerably. Otherwise, you are trying to reproduce the chance single bacteria that may be present in your water or reaches your tank by some other means. Even with daily doubling of the population, that can take a while to go from one or two bacteria to the millions that you need. In an idealistic calculation in our scientific section here,someone carried out the calculations including the assumed initial levels in the water and got answers around 21 days for the ammonia processors. I don't think I have ever read a thread where someone hit exactly 21 days for the ammonia processors though.
 

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