What animals are more intelligent than dogs and primates?

[gwand]

There's no denying we're smart, but what if those extra terrestrials considered the source of the neutron bombs, climate change, plastic pollution and our trying to run a system that must infinitely expand on a planet with finite resources? They could conclude we're idiots, one and all. We look a bit like a viral life form, and one that kills its host.

The extra terrestrials could drop by after we've gone extinct and the planet had rebounded from some of our damage, and still find a lot of intelligence around them to respect.

Culture is an offshoot of intelligence, and we have a lot of cultures to expand our abilities. There's no denying human ingenuity in the original question. We are animals running with instinct like all others, but we do escape the box occasionally.

Intelligence and foolishness are not mutually exclusive. I think the greater capacity for free will, the more likelihood that a species engages in both good and evil. Given that we have more free will than other species, we are masters at both. Keep in mind that many humans on planet earth recognize we are merely part of a complex ecosystem and respect this delicate balance. Unfortunately there are many selfish, reckless individuals driving us in the wrong direction. May be a more important question then who is the more intelligent species, is why are there so many human beings that don’t recognize how important it is for all of us to live in harmony with mother earth.

 

[gwand]

I asked my AI program about the paradox of intelligence and destructiveness. Here is what it said.

The question of why humans, with their intelligence and cognitive abilities, can be both intelligent and destructive to the planet is a complex and multifaceted one. Several factors contribute to this apparent paradox:

1. Evolutionary history: Human intelligence has evolved over millions of years to help us adapt to our environment and ensure our survival. In our ancestral environment, the ability to manipulate resources and alter the environment could provide advantages. However, our modern world has changed significantly, and our evolved behaviors and tendencies can sometimes lead to destructive consequences when applied to a global scale.
2. Short-term vs. long-term thinking: Human beings often prioritize short-term gains and immediate needs over long-term consequences. This focus on immediate gratification can lead to unsustainable practices, such as overconsumption and resource depletion, which harm the planet in the long run.
3. Tragedy of the commons: In many situations, individuals or groups act in their own self-interest without considering the broader impact on shared resources, leading to overexploitation and degradation of the environment. This phenomenon is known as the tragedy of the commons and can be seen in issues like overfishing, deforestation, and pollution.
4. Technological advancements: While human intelligence has led to remarkable technological advancements that have improved our quality of life, some of these innovations have unintended negative consequences for the environment. For example, industrialization and the burning of fossil fuels have contributed to climate change.
5. Lack of awareness and education: Not all destructive actions are driven by malice; often, people simply lack awareness or understanding of the environmental consequences of their actions. Education and raising awareness about environmental issues can help mitigate some of this ignorance.
6. Economic and political factors: Economic systems and political structures can incentivize behaviors that are detrimental to the environment. For instance, profit motives may lead corporations to prioritize short-term gains over long-term sustainability. Political decisions and policies can also play a significant role in determining how resources are managed and protected.
7. Population growth: The exponential growth of the human population places increased demands on natural resources and ecosystems. This growth exacerbates environmental challenges, such as habitat destruction and resource depletion.
8. Psychological factors: Cognitive biases, such as the optimism bias (underestimating risks), and conformity to social norms can influence human behavior and decision-making in ways that contribute to environmental degradation.

It's essential to recognize that not all humans are equally responsible for environmental destruction, and many individuals and groups are actively working towards sustainable practices and conservation efforts. Addressing these challenges often requires a combination of scientific research, education, policy changes, and collective action to align our intelligence and abilities with the goal of preserving and protecting the planet for future generations.

 

[TwoTankAmin]

There s a difference between intelligence and being smart. Humans, unlike most animals, can be both smart and stupid at the same time. Humans have abiiities which all animals lack. We are able to understand and to use science. We are capable of learning much more than the rest of the animal kingdom.

A bird can build a nest, but no amount of birds can build a house or an apartment. We are capable of changing the environment of the planet, no species of animal is able to do this.

And not all prey animals use flight as a way to avoid being eaten. Some animals freeze and do not move. And just like fleeing works for some, so does freezing.

We can bandy this topic about until we fill the thread with more posts than the entire rest of the site. But what it boils down to is we are able to be really smart, but most of us choose to be stupid. Part of it has to do with our immediate survival combined with how long it takes us top become able to survive on our own. Evolution is involved here. Animals which live in frigid climeates are adapted to stay warm. Humans can use multiple strategies from clothing to heated homes etc. we have become able to use. We have not remained in caves for a few 100,000 years.

A lot of this has to do with the capabilities of living things. I suppose a lot of what we are talking about here is the capacity to learn and to make reasonable assumptions about the world which allow us to have greater control over our environment. The problem is when we do not heed the science. A perfect example, and one I have personal experience with is tobacco.

It took us some time to accept that smoking is harmful. I knew this for most of the 45 years I smoked before I finally quit. So even though I consider myself to be moderately intelligent, I kept on smoking until my lungs made continuing the habit very hard. My intelligence failed me. I knew I should not smoke yet I kept on doing it.

Humans are the only species which has the intelligence and ability to make sure everybody in the world gets medical care, an decent diet and a reasonable home. Yet we have wars, starvation, disease etc. And this doesn't include motivations which insure we will behave stupidly- greed, anger, hate ll seem to guide our behavior more than intelligent decision making.

We have the ability to make logical decisions but very often we do not engage our brains before we act. "Do not engage mouth before putting brain in gear." This pretty much explains the different between the intelligence of humans and that of animals.

 

[Uberhoust]

Intelligence and foolishness are not mutually exclusive.

Well said.

Individually we are all very intelligent. I don't believe any creature yet is as intelligent as humans, some come close (looking at intelligence not knowledge) but we have gone past the phase where we have to individually pass on information to future generations, we have learned to store knowledge for future generations, our intelligence has allowed this. Just because other organisms don't destroy or modify their environment does not imply that they are more intelligent or we are less intelligent, they simply don't have the ability to do so to the same extend we can. And that said there are a number of creatures that go through cycles of extreme die offs simply because they have used up all the resources that they need to live within their ecosystem.

Collectively we are not doing so well. Behaviors that benefit individuals still dominates, leading to essentially competition within our society. This makes it difficult to make collective changes that would be better for our society as a whole, to do this we would need to have more of a collective sense, intelligence. Global warming is a good demonstration of this lack. Each one of us as an individual likes to do things that use energy resources. Many people will still take long distance vacations halfway around the word because they simply enjoy it and they feel they deserve it, someone else will cut back. Fish keeping is another case, there major reasons why fish keeping is bad for the environment and few reasons that are really not rationalizations of our behavior. Yet here we all are, hypocrites, author included, we want to enjoy our lives and that conflicts with trying to behave in a way that would benefit everyone as a whole. Al Gore spoke to great lengths about how all need to reduce our impact environment while continuing to live in a mansion, with a private pool, jet setting around the world using literally tons of fossil fuel in the process. Collective behaviors are more difficult to develop because they require a loss of individual freedom, not so easy to do when others do not have the same point of view, or when collective behaviors appear to adversely affect an individual's well being. We, as a species only has collective intelligence in regards to people we are associated with, family, friends, close community members. This is no different than most other animals.

In a certain respect you have to ask yourself what does it really matter if we are more intelligent or not. If we screw up bad it means our species might not last much longer, it has taken 1 to 1.5 billion years to get where we are right now, we only have another 500 million before the output from our sun boils off our oceans. We are doomed as a species no matter how you look at it.

Moo

On a happier note my shrimp tank seems to be turning around, I had two berried shrimp finally release their shrimpets? baby shrimp?

 

[GaryE]

What if free will is not a factor, and we generally follow a form of instinct not unlike that of an ant, but with culture attached to it? We create and invent within the boundaries of what our DNA lets us do? We think we're acting independently and rationally, but we're on a destructive bender that may be the essential nature of our species?

We rebel against it (well, some of us) but we seem to follow very predictable patterns that include fouling our own nest.

 

[gwand]

What if free will is not a factor, and we generally follow a form of instinct not unlike that of an ant, but with culture attached to it? We create and invent within the boundaries of what our DNA lets us do? We think we're acting independently and rationally, but we're on a destructive bender that may be the essential nature of our species?

We rebel against it (well, some of us) but we seem to follow very predictable patterns that include fouling our own nest.

Excellent consideration, Gary. Of course, the topic of free will versus determinism is still hotly debated among philosophers and physicist. Many physicist envision a deterministic universe, including deterministic behavior. Even quantum indeterminism cannot escape a deterministic universe. Although I tend in that direction, I hope that is not the case. We do not want to live a life of delusion. However, Buddhist philosophy states just that.

 

[jaylach]

I hear what you’re saying. However, imagine a series of neutron bombs wiped out all life forms on earth and then extra terrestrials landed on the planet. They see and marvel over termite mounds, beaver huts and dams, bird nests, bee hives etc. Then they come upon New York City. Who will they assume was the dominant and most intelligent specie. Better ways to kill is a reflection of our superior intelligence coupled with a greater capacity for free will.

I say this mostly tongue in cheek but those extra terrestrials just may not think us as being the dominant intelligence. Of course using a sci-fi movie isn't fair but take the movie Battlefield Earth. The aliens thought that dogs were dominate over humans because the dogs used humans as servants as in driving them around. Even though this does not seem relevant the following paragraph will show that it actually could be.

The presumption that an alien species would consider humans to be the dominant intelligence just does not hold as we, again, would be arrogant in thinking that these aliens would think the same way as do humans. Many scientists believe that, even if we contacted extra terrestrials communication and understanding would most often be impossible as the total operation of the brains and cultures and just basic concepts would likely just not be able to find a common ground.

What if these aliens were a 'hive culture'? Would they then not be likely to consider bees, ants and termites superior to humans as these insects would be closer to their concepts? If we visited another planet where a hive culture was the top intelligence and a humanoid animal was a lower form would we not be likely to consider the humanoid animals more intelligent just due to similarity?

Sorry but bringing aliens into the discussion really does not relate to intelligence on our Mother Earth. Mayhaps in a few hundred years we, as a species, MAY evolve from being, at best, adolescents as to truly understanding our place on our home, Of course that assumes that we don't kill ourselves off first.

 

[Colin_T]

Aliens are already here and have been for thousands of years. Just ask the American government and the whistle blowers coming out of the woodwork now. Area 5-1 is just one of the areas the US government have aliens and alien technology living/ stored. There are other areas all across the USA. Russia and China are also believed to have aliens in their countries.

 

[GaryE]

Aliens have to register when they enter the US. I've seen the old signs.

 

[gwand]

I’m against illegal alien entry. Send them back to Rigel Nine

 

[Fishmanic]

Cats are pretty intelligent. All they have to do is be cute and playful and their humans will do their bidding. They have their owners trained to attend to their every need and dont have to learn tricks or work as service cats for their owners. They are very smart.

 

[Colin_T]

Cats are pretty intelligent. All they have to do is be cute and playful and their humans will do their bidding. They have their owners trained to attend to their every need and dont have to learn tricks or work as service cats for their owners. They are very smart.

They aren't that smart. They can be caught in cages and cooked in the oven

 

[GaryE]

They aren't that smart. They can be caught in cages and cooked in the oven

An Australian who doesn't barbecue? Another stereotype washed down the drain...

Meanwhile, in cat campfire culture, there is the legend of the Drop Colin_T.

 

[GaryE]

Is it only humans that dream?

It was once thought that the ability to dream was a peculiarly human trait. But a surprisingly wide range of species could be able to do so as well.

www.bbc.com

Interesting to consider...

 

[Colin_T]

Is it only humans that dream?

It was once thought that the ability to dream was a peculiarly human trait. But a surprisingly wide range of species could be able to do so as well.

www.bbc.com

Interesting to consider...

Dogs and ferrets dream. Puppies and young dogs dream more than older dogs. I used to watch my dogs chasing things (presumably cats and rabbits) while they were asleep. Their paws would start moving a bit, they would twitch and make half hearted barking noises. You could see them chasing something. After a bit they would wake up and look around, but no bunny of cat.