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Three Males One Tank

Discussion in 'Betta Splendens' started by Fishball7, Oct 7, 2011.

  1. Fishball7

    Fishball7 Member

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    Tell me how it can work. I know how and why it wouldn't work, I've had enough opinions on that, but I'd especially appreciate people who have done something similar, eg big tank with multiple betta and decorations, to provide suggestions on improving the odds that I can house three male splendens in a tank together.

    I'm going to have a 4x2x2 ft (~100 gallons) heavily planted tank (high tech for those of you) that would look something like this: http://www.aquascapingworld.com/gallery/images/1/1_18.jpg though with more smaller plants where the rocks are and much less rocks. Dual filters, inline heaters in both, with modifications on the intake and outtake pipes so the current is low enough for the bettas. I'm going to throw in a bunch of shrimps also; the tank will have only the shrimps and the three male betta splendens. I'll be choosing the boys from LFS so I can hopefully buy those that are less obviously aggressive--unless it doesn't matter so I can get them online? A halfmoon and a crowntail for sure and another one that I like the look of--they won't come from the same spawn. I'll be using quarantine bottles/jars for them (about 1+ gallon) and release them at the same time in different spots of the tank in the hope that they have an equal chance to choose their own territory; so that it isn't one will establish their territory first and dominate the others when they go into the tank much later. The reason for three males is I've seen several shoaling fish that were fine in bigger groups, 3 or 4 at least, but when they were left with two, one would chase the other endlessly. I know they're not shoaling fish; it's hopefully to even out the aggression and the tank would be big enough in territory for the boys. Three males are also easier to manage than having bigger group. No dividers.

    There's also a consideration that they might simply hide in the plants and not come out a lot?

    My back up plan: if it fails, I'll return them to the bottles and buy a few 2ft, scape them and make the main tank for ramirezi.
     
  2. creeker

    creeker Member

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    You might as well start picking out those Ramirezi now! :no:
     
  3. ZoddyZod

    ZoddyZod Constantly learning

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    you want to dedicate a 100g tank to 3 bettas?

    you must really like the species.
     
  4. micko

    micko drive it like you stole it.

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    There are wild species of betta's that will live happily together I believe.
     
  5. The_Betta_Lady

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    Wild type Bettas are your only way of keeping Bettas in one tank without death. A Betta Splenden wont pick a territory and stick to it, if he knows there is another male in there he will go for it. My advice, if you sooo badly want these fish in together in this huge tank. Get some sheets of glass and fix them in as dividers but put them at an angle so as you look at the tank they are hardly visable, that way you give the illusion one tank but no fish have to die.
     
  6. Fishball7

    Fishball7 Member

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    ZoddyZod Lol I do adore the splendens. 100g planted tank is not too big for these fellows if they're happy in it; it'll more closely resemble their wild habitat I believe. Besides, if I can manage the scape, it'll be so brilliant looking that the splendens are big bonuses to the tank.

    The_Betta_Lady I've seen one guy, a poster in another forum, who kept 8 males and 4-5 females, totally different spawns, in a 70 gallon. He chose his splendens extremely carefully and intricately planned his tank decor. It's a complex cave system that each betta chose their cave territory and they free swim in the middle open area. No fights, no deaths, just the occasional flaring when one gets too close to another's cave.


    Again, I'm going for the stuff I described in my first post. I'm looking for suggestions related to the situation I described.
     
  7. sausagewinkle

    sausagewinkle Winner - Pet Of The Month

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    My opinion..

    Your going for LFS fish, who are already separated and continuously flaring at each other through there individual sections/cups, how ever they are kept.
    Then they are going to be realised together in a tank, to me wouldn't this cause them to fight anyway??
    And why do you mention not having fish from the same spawn??

    If you do this then I hope it works out for you but to me it isn't worth it

    if you wanted 3 bettas in your 100L then id say your safest bet is to divided it :)
     
  8. The_Betta_Lady

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    The LFS Betta is not a wild fish they have never been wild fish. They have been created from wild fish yes, but in this breeding they have become more aggressive. Mainly because the wild Betta was taken and the most aggressive ones were selected to breed to produce fighting fish, used for betting, they were designed to not stop until the other fish was dead. It was soon discovered that people out there thought these fish were pretty so these hyped up aggressive fish were used to create what we know as the betta from out LFS. You stick a HM back in the paddy fields and it wouldn't last 5 seconds.

    This bloke that had all these Bettas together. He was either just saying it to cover up the fact that he had made a mistake and not listened to the advice he had been give, he was trolling, or it worked for a little while but slowly one by one his fish started to vanish.

    I am sorry but its just not going to work. I know you wont listen and you will do it any way but you are not going to get someone on here go "yea go for it, they'll be fine"
     
  9. Fishball7

    Fishball7 Member

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    I know that. I know they're not wild. But 100 gallon heavily planted for 3 males is better than say 20g empty tank. It'll more closely resemble their wild habitat in the sense that it'll play to their instinct which is to gain more territory that they can safeguard but in a space big enough that they can run away and that they won't always encounter other males; which also applies to a lot of animals.

    They do stop actually, because who would want their hard earned, difficultly produced champion to die in a fight? Traditional fights were stopped as soon as a clear loser was shown; there is a judge at each fight to determine the signs of defeat; the owner can even admit defeat as soon as he wants. Sometimes losers were released back into the wild and careful selection recycles the process of producing a champion. I can't recall off the top of my head, but there are a few Thai produced websites that detailed the traditional selection, breeding and fights of the betta, plus theories of the human guided evolution of the splendens.

    His fish have been fine for months from his updates and again, he took great care in his selection and planning. I am trying to contact him and hopefully we can discuss how his success and my planning can produce another achievement. His is not the only one, but the only I've come across that had a plan for his scape, designed specifically for betta. I've read a few others who have had multiple bettas in tanks, although I don't know if they're from the same spawn.

    I know it may not work, hence I'm looking for people who have done this and how it has worked for them. I'm looking for ideas and suggestions on how to make this work, not why this wouldn't work because that's easy. A guy on another forum, despite disagreeing with what I'm doing, helpfully pointed out the dude with the caves and many bettas, whose stringent fish selection criteria inspired me to do likewise. Again, I'm not looking for naysayers because there are a million of you.

    sausagewinkle

    "Your going for LFS fish, who are already separated and continuously flaring at each other through there individual sections/cups, how ever they are kept.
    Then they are going to be realised together in a tank, to me wouldn't this cause them to fight anyway??
    And why do you mention not having fish from the same spawn??"

    I worked in a pet shop before maintaining the fish tanks, including a bunch of betta in small divided tanks. They don't flare continuously and when you watch them enough, you can tell who are the aggressive ones and who prefer to be left alone. Some flare only at other males while others ignore males but flare at the corydora in the same tank.

    I'm going off on the guy with the caves whose idea coincidentally coincided with mine. He chose his fish based on who flared the least and ignored the other males. He spent hours in his LFS and watching his tank for flaring and fights. What I intend to do is, as best as I can, choose the most docile males and put them in the tank at the same time. If they live happily, awesome. However, should the dominant bully soon emerge, hopefully I can return him to my LFS in exchange for another. If not, then perhaps with some other hobbyist; worse comes to worst, I'll put each of them into a two footer and rescape my main tank for rams.

    People have had much/more success with males from the same spawn living in the same tank from birth till adults. Occasionally, someone would point out another person who bred and kept a couple or more males in one tank, ranging from 20g to 100+g, and I've read posts that detailed similar. Adult males from different spawns living together seems to be a nightmarish concept to people ;)

    To me, the success is greatly worth it. I cannot stand betta living in small tanks and the sight of dividers. I'm willing to do a lot of research, pray for inspiration, and smartly do my best.
     
  10. micko

    micko drive it like you stole it.

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    Its a forum. You cannot pick and choose peoples opinions and beliefs, just the same way as we cannot change yours. A lot, if not all people on here will put the life of a fish before disagreeing with a member. The stress and potential death is not worth it, there are many betta fanatics on here who have dividers in their tanks. Saying that its not aesthetically pleasing to you will not make me change my mind.
    I really feel there is nothing more I can add to this as its clear your going to do as you wish regardless.
     
  11. Fishball7

    Fishball7 Member

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    Exactly it's a forum which was why I stated at the top of my initial post I was looking for only suggestions related to my specific situation, from people who have had similar experiences. No one has any need to say anything irrelevant to my initial post. I have specific requirements in my situation which therefore would change answers to be relevant to my issue, eg if I had not stated I didn't want dividers then suggesting it would be relevant, but now it is not. It is as if I was looking for answers to where can I find a red apple and only a red apple and people begin telling me to get oranges instead. It doesn't contribute positively to my situation whatsoever. I am precisely prioritising the quality of life of a fish which is why I'm broadly searching for answers and ideas and not going about it stupidly or without plans and back up plans. Likewise, I'm not looking to change your mind about anything. Nowhere in my posts have I said that I want people to do things the way I'm doing them.

    If my initial post wasn't clear enough, I am not looking to start a war or argument of what I'm going to do. I am going to do it. I just want suggestions on how to better minimise the risk within the parameters stated.
     
  12. micko

    micko drive it like you stole it.

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    Aye, a forum which means you cannot tell me noir the other posters to not contribute to this thread.
     
  13. Fishball7

    Fishball7 Member

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    Lol. No, simply that your posts were not contributory.
     
  14. micko

    micko drive it like you stole it.

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    In your opinion. The same persons opinion who wants 3 male betta's in a tank. There really is no point.
     
  15. Fishball7

    Fishball7 Member

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    No, mate. It is not simply my opinion for I am looking for suggestions whilst the answers provided are irrelevant to my situation, hence not contributory. I do not go into a thread and push upon someone else my opinion that we should all have three males in a 100g tank when the person is asking how big their tank should be for one betta. I do not go into a thread to say something that does not contribute to their situation at hand. I know almost 100% of people disagree vehemently with what I want to do and that's not what I'm looking for and do not need from. Sure, you can come in here and say whatever you like, but again, it does nothing for me, as I do nothing for you. I'm tired of criticisms and hostility to what I want to do. It does not deter me but it's not what I'm looking for. I'm not going about it in a stupid way, such as throwing in a couple of aggressive boys in a 0.1g empty tank and hope for the best, but exploring a probability that through my smartness and dedication, along with people's experiences, has a good chance of succeeding. I agree to disagree with you and cease this topic with you and others likewise.

    However, if someone has something that would help me in my plans, I'd love to know.
     
  16. loraxchick

    loraxchick Retired Moderator

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    I think it might just work. IMO knowing the species well, I honestly do not see a single male claiming 100 GALLONS of water. These fish are territorial, yes but 100 GALLONS? I dont think so. Make sure it is heavily planted as you stated. Id Imagine theyd take about 30 at most so three would be pushing your limit. They will likely squabble to establish the hierarchy at first but will likely pick their own territories and stick to them.
    Of course they are not wild fish but still have instincts. Instincts are not to kill each other but claim their space. Death happens when they are put into comparatively tiny volumes of water and cannot get away from each other. Even wild bettas only claim small (less than 3 square feet) of territory if theyre lucky, and even in nature territories overlap. They just need enough room to stay out of each other's way. I can see potential "arguments" from time to time but one fish will concede, swim away and the "victor" will just go back to being lazy. I doubt they will chase each other around the tank constantly and fight non-stop, killing each other. Those huge fins just dont allow for that. They get tired. I could go on and on but Ill just stop here.
    Id like to see photos or video of the setup when it's complete. Im curious and have wanted to do something similar myself.
    Id like to see less finger pointing and blatant statements. I dont see any of the above posts being helpful or relevant, other than to discredit the OPs very relavant question and also the notion that it simply will not work and will end in deaths all over the place. I just dont see that happening. Keep it civil folks.
    Thanks
    Cheers
    ps there are PLENTY of betta keepers who have successfully kept 2 male splendens in the same tank without massacre, and in less than 100 gal i might add.
     
  17. The_Betta_Lady

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    I wish you the best of luck and hope your plan works, for the fishes sake not yours.

    P.S If it was so easy to do loraxchick then every single bit of information you see on every site would not state so very clearly and adamantly not to do it.

    P.P.S use siblings if you can they are more used to having each other around.
     
  18. micko

    micko drive it like you stole it.

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    You believe its "smartness", I would say different. I've suggested wild betta's, so I have contributed toward the thread. Of course you wouldn't go into a thread to say to put 3 males in together because hopefully the vast majority wouldn't and would know better.
    As your insisting on doing this all I can say is that I hope the fish are ok.

    I give UP!!!!!!
     
  19. Tizer

    Tizer Team TetraTEC

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    Bettas are for girls, i would stay clear of this forum if you value your tackle. :D
     
  20. Fishball7

    Fishball7 Member

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    loraxchick Thanks! Much appreciated. I will surely document my success or failure and let you know. Would you be able to point me to these successful keepers so I may be able to glean some ideas off of them?
     

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