White Spot On New Cichlid

[Mayu]

I got two new Blue Ram Cichlids (not what I wanted, long story)... this morning I noticed one had two white spots,

I've looked very closely and it's only the two spots. the other cichlid is fine. Not sure if it's a fungus, the start of ich, or some other parasite. His coloring is fine, he seems to be just as active, swimming normally, he ate a few blood worms this a.m., Nitrates, Nirtrites and Ammonias are 0 (master water test kit), pH is high for blue rams... 7.5, but I'm going to be adding some peat moss or almond leave tea bags to the filter, which I was told would lower the pH.

I have the temp currently set at 85 F. I just did a partial water change... I was going to add some aquarium salt, but I figured I wouldn't until I figured out what these two spots are, and what to treat them with.

 

[WILDER]

it's hard to tell in the pics. Dosn't look like whitespot.

Can you describe what you see in more detail.

Any tiny bubbles on the fish body or fins.
Any signs of darting, flicking and rubbing, irratation.

 

[Mayu]

none of that. I watched him for quite a bit and I don't see signs of rubbing, no loss of his bright colors... just checked on him this a.m., looked very closely for several minutes (I think he's already use to me cause when I put my face against the tank he comes right up and stares at me.)

He doesn't really dart around the tank. Sometimes he gets irritated at the other Ram, and will charger her and/or give her a small nip to make her go away when she's bugging him, but other wise they seem to get along, swimming around normally.

the only thing I can say is he does pick at the gravel a lot, but I'm assuming he's picking excess food that may have fallen to the floor of the tank.

The main thing is there are two white spots... one on his tail fin, one on his anal fin. They haven't grown, they haven't spread... it's still those two spots. I tried to get good pics, but those are the best I could find. I keep thinking fungus cause one does look cottony. and I know it's not ick cause there are no other spots, and my other Ram is fine.

one thing I can say, they prefer to swim near the middle or bottom of the tank... but I think that's just how they are, I don't think that's an issue.

 

[Mayu]

this pic probably isn't any better... but here's another view. as you can kinda see, the spots are three dimensional, as they stand away from the fin... but they haven't really grown since last night's photos, and they haven't spread. again, no itching, scratching, rubbing of any kind... no other skin deformities as of yet, and I'd like to keep it that way.

this is basically what they're doing...

swim around, pick at the ground for food, chase each other, neither have ventured into the cave yet... but I'm sure they'll get brave enough to soon. They prefer to hang around the Japanese pagoda though.

 

[WILDER]

I think I would hold off medicating for whitespot.
Keep an eye if the spots move.

Whitespot can look raised, and fluffy.
If more spots appear I think then I would treat for whitespot.

Lovely pics.

 

[Mayu]

I think I would hold off medicating for whitespot.
Keep an eye if the spots move.

Whitespot can look raised, and fluffy.
If more spots appear I think then I would treat for whitespot.

Lovely pics.

so do nothing in the mean time? I raised the temp to about 85... just in case it is the start of ick... cause it can't live in temps 85 and over once it detaches from the host... but I'm wondering if I should at least do small daily water changes... or add salt to the tank. (It may be bad advice considering the schmeck I went through with my LFS about these cichlids...) (long story. I posted it in the new world cichlid forum titled "Ram Cichlid Emergency" if you care to know the full story)

but I was told by the LFS Ram Cichlids don't really tollerate salt in the water, so I figured I wouldn't add any till I got good advice.

 

[WILDER]

Using salt depends on which fish you keep.

Never kept cichlids so don't know much about them.

Pm truckasaurus123.

 

[Mayu]

Cool.

 

[WILDER]

Fish can get calcium deposits on the fins.
I'm not totally convinced it is whitespot yet.
Also rams are very sensitive to whitespot emds I think.

 

[WILDER]

Click on link. Some whitespot pics.

http/images.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http/www.jbl.de/onlinehospitaluk/perpicture/hospital_pictures/041_c.jpg&imgrefurl=http/www.jbl.de/onlinehospitaluk/perpicture/index.php%3FStep%3D2%26GalleryId%3D2&usg=__ka4RIDbHtG0JlPV5y1RHNHWiVaY=&h=250&w=380&sz=41&hl=en&start=8&um=1&itbs=1&tbnid=R-W5KrCzA6lM1M:&tbnh=81&tbnw=123&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dcolumnaris%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DN%26um%3D1

 

[Mayu]

If I had to pick, to me the spots looke like the second pic of Ich. They are raised like that, but again, there are only two... and they are on the tail fin and anal fin.

I thought at first fugus cause there was a cottony look, but no where NEAR the pics of Fungus on that link you provided! I mean, wow, that's nasty! Definately doesn't look like that!

My third thought was Velvet, but the symptoms are clamped fins, breathing hard and yellow to light brown "dust" on body. So I ruled that out just now.

It's only two freakin spots. I mean come on! could he be even more obscure? I'm just happy that he seems to be swimming, eating, looking fine otherwise, so there is still hope.

Do you have pics of what calcium deposits look like on a fish? I have been googling it since the word calcium was first brought up. Can't find anything to compare it to.

Truck said he'd avoid salt with Rams and use a copper based treatment if it ends up being ick or something copper can treat. he said that would be up your alley. (I've only used Mardel Coppersafe once with tetra and Mollies a while ago in an old tank, and it didn't go well.)

but he said to ask you about how to treat with copper, and if I should even try right now, or wait to see if anything changes first. Like I told Truck... I should have stuck with Mollies and Tetra. Stupid me for wanting to try a different species of fish. lol

 

[Mayu]

I think I finally got a slightly better pic of the two spots, at least a bit closer.

 

[WILDER]

Still dosn't look like whitespot.

I would put the temp back to normal.
The higher temp speeds the life cycle up of the parasite. If it was whitepot would of expected to see more spots, or even more fish affected by now. With raising the temp.

 

[Mayu]

well 85 is in normal temp parameters according to most websites on Blue Rams... but I'll turn it down to about 82... I think 80-82 is the optimal temp. And we'll see how it goes. I'm just on my way now to wake them up. I'll observe if anything has changed or not.

 

[Mayu]

the spot on the back fin looks smaller today IMO compared to when I first noticed it a few days ago... the spot on the anal fin looks about the same... it's not bigger, but it still is raised and fluffy looking... Still going to keep an eye on it. Do you still recommend not treating it right now?

How fast does fungus spread? If it were a fungus, would it have been looking worse by now?

Its Definately NOT Ick... the other fish is still fine, and there are still no other spots on my fish other than these spots.

They're still looking good. They're swimming even more now than they were the first few days in the new tank... and they're both eating well. And they've survived for 4 days now, so that's a plus. lol

on an upnote... the ick outbreak in my main tank you (wilder) and a few others helped me with, has finally resloved and the tank is now back to normal.